[Storm Water Advisory Committee on July 27, 2023.]
[00:00:02]
GOOD AFTERNOON.WE WERE, UH, WE WERE GIVING EVERYBODY A FEW EXTRA MINUTES TO GET HERE WITH THE, UH, WITH THE ISSUE THAT'S GOING ON ON THE INTERSTATE, BUT I, I THINK WE'VE GOTTEN JUST ABOUT EVERYBODY HERE THAT, THAT'S PLANNING TO BE HERE TODAY.
I, I KNOW, UH, FOR SURE THAT, THAT THE BRACK, UH, REPRESENTATIVE'S NOT GONNA BE HERE TODAY.
SO, WITH THAT, UH, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND GET STARTED.
UH, FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO, I WANT TO THANK Y'ALL ALL FOR YOUR TIME.
THIS IS NOW MEETING NUMBER FIVE THAT WE, WE'VE MADE, UH, A LOT OF GOOD PROGRESS, UH, MADE SOME GOOD DECISIONS OVER THE LAST FEW MEETINGS.
I'LL, UH, I'LL RECAP THOSE HERE SHORTLY.
UH, THE FIRST WAS THE LEVEL OF SERVICE, AND THERE WERE, THERE WERE VARIOUS LEVELS OF, OF SERVICE THAT WE DISCUSSED OVER THE FIRST SEVERAL MEETINGS.
IT WAS ULTIMATELY DECIDED UPON AT THE LAST MEETING THAT WE WOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH SIX AND A HALF MILLION ANNUALLY TO ADDRESS THE COMPLIANCE PORTION OF THE MS FOUR PERMIT.
AND THAT WE WOULD CONTINUE TO DISCUSS THE, THE LEVEL OF SERVICE AND THE FUNDING NEEDS IN THE FUTURE.
AND THAT'LL BE THE, THE THOUGHT BEHIND SOME OF THE FUTURE MEETINGS.
UM, SECONDLY WAS THE, UH, AND THEN THE, THE WAY THAT WE WOULD FUND IT, WE ALSO, THE DECISION WAS ALSO MADE THAT WE WOULD NOT MOVE FORWARD WITH SALES TAXES.
WE WOULD NOT MOVE FORWARD WITH PROPERTY TAXES.
AND FROM THERE, WE, WE'VE TALKED IN THE PAST A LOT ABOUT HOW THE, IF WE GO WITH IMPERVIOUS AREA, THAT IS THE MOST FAIR AND EQUITABLE WAY TO HANDLE IT FROM A, FOR A STORMWATER FEE.
SO WITH THAT, WE'VE, UH, WE'VE PRESENTED THREE DIFFERENT OPTIONS LAST WEEK THAT GO OVER DIFFERENT TYPES OF RATE STRUCTURES USING THOSE IMPERVIOUS AREAS.
AND, UH, ANNA FROM BLACK AND VEATCH WILL COME IN AND TALK TO YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THOSE IN A, IN A MINUTE.
BUT I, I'LL JUST GO AHEAD AND RECAP 'EM.
THE, THE FIRST ONE IS A TIERED APPROACH, AND WE ULTIMATELY, WE ENDED UP WITH 11 TIERS OF VARIOUS FORMS OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
AND THEN THAT 12TH TIER WAS FOR INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED OVER 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
AND I CAN TELL YOU, IT, IT WAS A VERY ITERATIVE PROCESS.
YOU KNOW, WE, WE STARTED OUT, IT WAS LIKE, WELL, LET'S DO ONE FOR RESIDENTIAL AND FEW FOR NON-RESIDENTIAL.
BUT THEN, THEN YOU START GETTING INTO, YOU'VE GOT SOME OF THESE REALLY LARGE, UH, PARCELS THAT ARE JUST TOTALLY DIFFERENT FROM EVERYBODY ELSE THAT'S OUT THERE FROM THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE EVEN COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES, RIGHT? AND THEN WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW MANY TIERS, ONCE YOU GET ABOVE 1 MILLION, IT'S LIKE, WELL, HOW MANY TIERS WOULD I NEED ABOVE 1 MILLION? 'CAUSE YOU COULD HAVE ONE THAT'S A MILLION, AND THEN YOU COULD HAVE ANOTHER ONE THAT'S 2 MILLION, AND THEN YOU COULD HAVE ANOTHER ONE THAT'S 5 MILLION.
IT'S LIKE, WELL, HOW DO I, THEN YOU, THEN YOU'RE AT THE POINT WHERE YOU'RE ALMOST MAKING TIERS FOR JUST A HANDFUL OF FOLKS.
SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT, THERE'S, THERE'S 42 PARCELS THAT ARE OVER 1 MILLION.
SO THAT WAS THE POINT WHERE WE JUST SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT, INSTEAD OF HAVING, TRYING TO HAVE A, A FEW TIERS FOR EACH ONE OF THOSE, WE'LL JUST INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATE THEM OVER 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET.
AND THAT'S HOW WE, WE GOT TO THAT.
THE SECOND ONE WAS THE HYBRID MODEL.
THE, YOU KNOW, WE PRESENTED A LITTLE BIT OF THE, THE PROS AND CONS.
SO WITH THE TIERS, THAT'S IT, IT DOES END UP AT A, A EVER SO SLIGHTLY HIGHER BILLING RATE, BECAUSE WHEN YOU LUMP PEOPLE IN THE TO TIERS, THEN YOU LOSE SOME BILLING UNITS.
SO THE, THE BILLING RATE HAS TO BE A LITTLE BIT HIGHER FOR THE SIX AND A HALF TO 7 MILLION.
IT ENDS UP BEING, UH, 27 CENTS FOR THE BILLING RATE WHEN YOU GO TO THE HYBRID.
THE HYBRID WAS, WE KEEP THOSE SAME TIERS FOR THE RESIDENTIAL, AND THEN FOR THE NON-RESIDENTIAL, THEY'RE ALL INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
OKAY, WELL, THAT, UH, IT'S HALFWAY BETWEEN THE TWO.
THAT ONE, IT GOES DOWN TO 26 CENTS FOR THE BILLING RATE.
[00:05:01]
AND THE REASON THERE IS BECAUSE YOU GAIN SOME OF THOSE BILLING UNITS BACK WHEN YOU INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATE EVERYTHING THAT'S NON-RESIDENTIAL.AND THEN OF COURSE, THE FINAL ONE IS ALL OF THEM BEING INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, WHICH EVERYBODY JUST PAYS FOR WHATEVER IT IS THAT'S IMPERVIOUS AREA, THAT THAT'S ON THEIR PROPERTY.
AND THEN AGAIN, YOU GAIN A, A LITTLE BIT MORE BILLING UNITS.
SO THE BILLING RATE GOES DOWN TO 25.
SO THAT'S A LITTLE A RECAP OF HOW WE GOT TO WHERE WE ARE.
SO WITH THAT, I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO ANA.
ALRIGHT, GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYBODY.
SO ADAM GAVE A NICE SUMMARY, IF WE WANNA GO BACK ONE SLIDE.
YEAH, WE'LL JUST GO BACK TO THIS SLIDE FOR, FOR JUST A MINUTE HERE.
ADAM GAVE A REALLY GOOD SUMMARY OF THOSE THREE OPTIONS.
I JUST KIND OF WANNA RECAP THEM FOR YOU SO THAT YOU CAN UNDERSTAND.
ALL THREE OF THE OPTIONS DO INCLUDE AN INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED COMPONENT.
AND THEN TWO OF THE OPTIONS ALSO INCLUDE THE TIERED COMPONENT.
SO THE THREE OPTION OPTIONS ARE JUST KIND OF A, A, A MIX AND MATCH OF, OF THOSE TWO DIFFERENT RATE STRUCTURES.
SO AGAIN, OPTION ONE IS SYSTEM-WIDE TIERS.
ONE SET OF 11 TIERS WOULD APPLY TO ALL OF THE CUSTOMERS, WHETHER THEY'RE RESIDENTIAL OR NON-RESIDENTIAL PARCELS.
OVER A MILLION SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA WOULD BE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
OKAY? SO YOU HAVE THE TIERS AND YOU HAVE THE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED OPTION TWO, WE ALSO HAVE THE TIERS.
WE STILL HAVE THE TIERS, BUT THEY APPLY ONLY TO RESIDENTIAL.
AND AGAIN, PARCELS OVER A MILLION SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA BE CHARGED, INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
AND THEN ALL OF THE NON-RESIDENTIAL IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO WE STILL HAVE THE TIERS, BUT IT'S ONLY FOR RESIDENTIAL.
NON-RESIDENTIAL IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, I'M SORRY, CORRECT.
NON-RESIDENTIAL 42, NON-RESIDENTIAL THAT ARE OVER 42 NON-RESIDENTIAL THAT ARE OVER.
AND THEN THE THIRD OPTION IS, IS MOVING TO THE NEXT STEP, WHICH IS INDIVI, INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED FOR ALL PARCELS.
SO BASICALLY WHEN WE SAY INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, WHAT WE'RE, WHAT WE'RE MEETING THERE IS THAT EACH PROPERTY IS ASSIGNED, UH, A PROPERTY SPECIFIC BILLING UNIT BASED ON ITS SPECIFIC AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SO THE AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA FOR EACH PROPERTY DIVIDED BY 500 SQUARE FEET, THAT'S THE BILLING UNITS.
AND THEN THAT'S WHAT THE IN VISUALLY CALCULATED FEE WOULD BE PAID BASED ON.
WE GO ON TO THE NEXT SLIDE THEN.
AND I KNOW ADAM TOUCHED A LITTLE BIT ON THE RATES, UM, THE, THE, THE RATE PER 500 SQUARE FEET.
WE'LL LOOK AT THAT IN JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL HERE.
SO YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE THREE OPTION OPTIONS.
SO AGAIN, OPTION ONE IS TIERS.
AND SO YOU CAN SEE WE'RE GENERATING A LITTLE OVER $7 MILLION IN REVENUE FROM THOSE TIERS.
WE DIVIDE IT BY, OR WE WOULD NEED TO RECOVER $7 MILLION IN, IN COSTS.
IN OPTION ONE, WE DIVIDE IT BY THE BILLING UNITS.
THAT'S BASED ON ALL OF THE PROPERTIES RUNNING THROUGH THE TIERS.
AND AGAIN, NON-RESIDENTIAL, OVER A MILLION INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, THAT RATE IS 27 CENTS PER 500 SQUARE FEET.
SO A PARCEL THAT'S INDIVIDUALLY CAL INDIVIDUALLY, UH, CALCULATED, IT'D BE THE IMPERVIOUS AREA DIVIDED BY 500 TIMES 27 CENTS.
OPTION TWO, IT'S VERY SIMILAR.
WE'RE RECOVERING THE SAME AMOUNT OF COSTS BECAUSE OUR BILLING UNITS HAVE INCREASED A BIT BECAUSE NOW WE ONLY HAVE TIERS FOR THE RESIDENTIAL.
WE MOVE TO INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED FOR ALL OF THE PARCELS.
WE PICK UP MORE BILLING UNITS.
AND SO IF AS A RESULT OF THAT, YOU CAN SEE THAT THAT RATE PER 500 SQUARE FEET GOES DOWN BY A PENNY.
AND THEN WHEN WE MOVE TO OPTION THREE, WE DO HAVE A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE THERE IN OUR ANNUAL REVENUE REQUIREMENTS.
WHAT WE'RE SHOWING FOR OPTION THREE IS WHAT WE PRESENTED AT THE LAST MEETING.
UM, SINCE THEN WE HAVE INCLUDED FOR OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO AND OPERATING RESERVE, SO THAT BUMPED THOSE COSTS UP A LITTLE BIT.
BUT FOR OPTION THREE IS WHAT WE SAW LAST TIME, ABOUT SIX AND A HALF, 6.6 MILLION IN COSTS HERE.
ALL THE PARCELS ARE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO YOU CAN SEE THE AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS OR THE, UM, THE BILLING UNITS SHOWN THERE, ABOUT 2.1 MILLION.
THAT ALSO DOES REFLECT AN ADJUSTMENT FOR CREDITS AND APPEALS.
SO UNDER OPTION THREE WHERE ALL PARCELS ARE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, WE'RE ASSUMING THAT THERE WOULD ALSO BE A CREDIT PROGRAM OFFERED.
SO THAT'S WHY YOU SEE US A REDUCTION IN THE BILLING UNITS FROM OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE ALL
[00:10:01]
INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, WE'RE ASSUMING THAT THERE WILL BE SOME CREDITS OFFERED.AND THEN WHEN YOU DO THE MATH, THAT WE GET THE 25 CENTS PER 500 SQUARE FEET OF, OF IMPERVIOUS AREA THAT WE HAD SHOWN YOU AT THE LAST MEETING.
OKAY, SO OPTION ONE AGAIN IS WHERE WE HAVE THE TIERS FOR ALL PARCELS.
SO THIS TABLE HERE SHOWS WHAT THOSE ACTUAL TIERS WOULD LOOK LIKE.
SO WE HAVE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE.
FOR INSTANCE, FOR TIER ONE, IT WOULD GO FROM ZERO TO 2,750 SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SO IF A PARCEL HAS 1500 SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA, THEY'D FALL IN TIER ONE.
AND THE CHARGE FOR THAT TIER ONE IS $10.
SO WHETHER THEY'RE RESIDENTIAL OR NON-RESIDENTIAL, ANY PROPERTY THAT HAS 1500 SQUARE FEET WOULD PAY $10.
AND SO YOU CAN SEE AS THE TIERS, AS WE GO THROUGH THE TIERS, THOSE RANGES EACH MOVING UP TO, UM, YOU KNOW, A HIGHER LEVEL OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
WHEN WE GET TO TIL TIER 12, THOSE ARE THE PARCELS THAT HAVE MORE THAN A MILLION SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA AND ARE WILL BE INDIVI INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO THERE'S NO TIER RATE ASSOCIATED WITH, WITH THAT LAST TIER.
WE'RE ALSO SHOWING THERE THE NUMBER OF PARCELS, RESIDENTIAL AND NON-RESIDENTIAL THAT FALL INTO EACH OF THOSE TIERS.
SO YOU CAN SEE FOR RESIDENTIAL, THE MAJORITY IS GONNA FALL INTO TIER ONE AND TIER TWO.
SO $10 A A YEAR OR $24 A YEAR, DEPENDING ON THE IMPERVIOUS AREA FOR NON-RESIDENTIAL, UM, YOU CAN SEE HOW THEY ARE ALLOCATED THERE AMONGST THE TIERS.
THERE IS A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF NON-RESIDENTIAL PARCELS IN TIER ONE, UM, WHICH AGAIN WOULD BE $10 A YEAR.
AND THEN YOU CAN SEE AS YOU LOOK DOWN TOWARDS THE BOTTOM TIERS 11 AND 12, HOW HOW MANY NON-RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS WOULD FALL IN THOSE MUCH HIGHER TIERS.
SO WE HAVE THE SAME TIERS AS OPTION ONE, BUT THIS TIME THEY ONLY APPLY TO RE RESIDENTIAL PARCELS.
SO YOU CAN SEE THAT THE RANGE, THE TWO AND FROM IS THE SAME, BUT YOU CAN SEE THAT THE DOLLAR AMOUNT, THE ANNUAL CHARGE PER TIER HAS CHANGED JUST A LITTLE BIT, JUST BECAUSE WE HAVE DIFFERENT BILLING UNITS.
BY ONLY ASSUMING THAT THE TIERS WILL APPLY TO THE RESIDENTIAL PARCELS.
SO TIER ONE STARTS AT $11, IT WAS $10 UNDER OPTION ONE, BUT WE HAVE THE SAME NUMBER OF TIERS.
AND AGAIN, YOU CAN SEE THE MAJORITY OF OF RESIDENTIAL PARCELS ARE GONNA FALL IN TIER ONE AND TWO.
AND THEN INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED WOULD APPLY TO ALL OF THE NON-RESIDENTIAL PARCELS AND INDUSTRIAL OR, AND RESIDENTIAL OVER A MILLION, WHICH THERE AREN'T ANY RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS OVER A MILLION.
SO THIS IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
UM, SO HERE WE'RE JUST SUMMARIZING THE NUMBER OF PARCELS BY THE DIFFERENT CUSTOMER CLASS, THE IMPERVIOUS AREA, AND THEN THE BILLING UNITS, WHICH THE BILLING UNITS IS THE IMPERVIOUS AREA FOR EACH PARCEL DIVIDED BY 500 SQUARE FEET.
AND THEN WHAT WE'RE SHOWING HERE IS THE NET STORMWATER, UM, BILLING UNITS.
AGAIN, ASSUMING THAT IF ALL PARCELS ARE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, THERE'D BE AN OPPORTUNITY, UM, POTENTIALLY AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A CREDIT PROGRAM.
AND THEN IF WE LOOK AT JUST THE CUSTOMER BILL IMPACT FOR EACH OF THESE THREE OPTIONS, UM, WE HAVE FOUR EXAMPLES HERE.
SO THE FIRST ONE IS A VERY SMALL, UM, HOUSE OR A VERY SMALL BUSINESS.
SO UNDER OPTION ONE, IT WOULD FALL INTO TIER ONE.
SO $10 UNDER OPTION ONE $11 UNDER OPTION TWO INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED $4 AND 80 CENTS.
AND AGAIN, THAT'S JUST BECAUSE IT'S A VERY SMALL AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
YOU DIVIDE IT BY 500 AND MULTIPLY BY 25 CENTS RESULTS IN A FEE OF $4 AND 80 CENTS.
AND THEN YOU CAN SEE AS, AS THE AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA INCREASES UP TO 3,700, UH, YOU CAN SEE BETWEEN OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO, THERE'S NOT MUCH OF A DIFFERENCE.
AND ACTUALLY OPTION THREE, WHICH IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, IS ALSO KIND OF RIGHT IN LINE WITH OPTION, OPTION ONE AND TWO FOR THAT EXAMPLE.
THE NEXT ONE, THE 12,000 SQUARE FEET, UM, YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE THERE BETWEEN OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO.
IT DOES GO DOWN FOR OPTION TWO.
AND OPTION THREE IS MORE, IS IN LINE WITH OPTION TWO AS WELL, INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
UM, AND THEN THE LAST ONE THERE, A FAIRLY LARGE, UM, NON-RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY, MOST LIKELY WAS 60,000 SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
YOU CAN SEE THE RANGE THERE THAT, THAT ANNUAL BILL WOULD BE BETWEEN THE THREE OPTIONS.
[00:15:02]
SO WHAT WE'VE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT, UM, AS WE LOOKED AT THESE THREE OPTIONS AND CONSIDERED WHAT, WHAT WE FELT WERE THE BEST COMBINATION OF RATE STRUCTURES TO BRING TO THIS GROUP FOR CONSIDERATION.FIRST WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE MAKING SURE THAT THERE IS REVENUE STABILITY FOR THE UTILITY.
SO MAKING SURE THAT WHATEVER RATE SCHEDULE WE BRING FORWARD FOR CONSIDERATION WILL ALLOW, UM, SUSTAINABLE REVENUE AS WELL AS THE ABILITY TO, UM, INCREASE THAT REVENUE GOING FORWARD FOR HAVING A RATE STRUCTURE THAT GOING FORWARD CAN BE, UM, EASILY INCREASED OVER TIME AS THE, UM, LEVEL OF SERVICE NEEDS FOR THE STORM WATER SYSTEM INCREASE OVER TIME.
THAT RATE STRUCTURE CAN KEEP UP WITH THAT.
UH, MAKE SURE THAT THERE'S COMMUNITY EQUITY.
SO USING AN INDUSTRY ACCEPTED METH METHODOLOGY, LOOKING AT THE IMPERVIOUS AREA PER PARCEL, TAKING INTO RATES, TAKING INTO ACCOUNT RATE STRUCTURES THAT ARE BASED ON IMPERVIOUS AREA AND TRY TO BUILD IN THAT EQUITY AS MUCH AS WE CAN WITH AN INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED RATE, THAT'S THE MOST EQUITABLE BECAUSE EACH PARCEL IS PAYING BASED ON ITS ACTUAL, UM, ESTIMATED AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
WHEN YOU MOVE TO THE TIERS, IT'S LESS EQUITABLE BECAUSE YOU'RE PUTTING PARCELS OF DI WITH DIFFERENT AMOUNTS OF IMPERVIOUS AREA INTO ONE GROUP AND CHARGING THEM THE SAME FEE.
UM, IT'S NOT, NOT EQUITABLE, IT'S JUST LESS EQUITABLE AND INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO WE TOOK THAT INTO ACCOUNT WHEN WE WERE CONSIDERING WHAT OPTIONS, UM, TO BRING FORWARD COMMUNITY AFFORDABILITY.
WHEN WE WERE LOOKING AT THE TIERS, WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAD A STARTING TIER WITH THE LOWEST THE PARCELS WITH THE LOWEST AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA THAT WE FELT WAS AFFORD AFFORDABLE.
SO KEEPING THAT DOWN AT THE 10, $11 AMOUNT PER YEAR WE FEEL IS ADDRESSING THAT CONCERN.
AND THEN STORMWATER, UH, STEWARDSHIP, MAKING SURE THAT THESE FREIGHT STRUCTURES DO GENERATE THE AMOUNT OF REVENUE, UM, AS A STARTING POINT FOR THE STORMWATER UTILITY MOVING FORWARD.
AND THAT'S IT OF APPEALS OR IN THE OVERALL DOLLAR AMOUNT WE DID FOR OPTION THREE FOR THE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, WE DID TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT, UM, JUST BASED ON EXPERIENCE WITH OTHER UTILITIES.
WE, WE KNEW WHICH CUSTOMER CLASSES TO TARGET.
UM, YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE VERY MANY APPEALS FROM RESIDENTIAL.
YOU'RE GONNA SEE 'EM MORE FROM, UM, POTENTIALLY LARGER CUSTOMERS, UM, AND COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS.
SO WE DO JUST ASSUME A CERTAIN FACTOR, UM, FOR EACH CUSTOMER CLASS WHERE WE ANTICIPATE THERE MIGHT BE APPEALS.
SO THE, THE THE DOLLAR AMOUNT OF ABOUT $700,000, SOME OF THAT IS FOR CREDITS AND SOME OF THAT FOR ADDITIONAL ADMINISTRATIVE COST.
THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN OPTION TWO AND OPTION THREE IS ABOUT $700,000.
SO ONE OF, RIGHT, SO WE ADDED, UM, AN OPERATING RESERVE FOR OPTIONS ONE AND TWO.
SO WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, UM, THERE, THERE'S A CERTAIN NUMBER OF DAYS OF CASH ON HAND, CORRECT.
SET ASIDE FOR, FOR UNEXPECTED ISSUES WITH REVENUE OR WITH EXPENSES.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THOSE TWO.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE UNITS, THAT'S WHERE YOU CAN SEE THERE'S MORE OF A DIFFERENCE FOR OPTION THREE.
AND THAT'S BECAUSE WE DID, UM, THAT'S SHOWING THE NET NUMBER AFTER TAKING INTO ACCOUNT POTENTIAL APPEALS AND CREDITS.
SO THAT'S ABOUT, THAT'S ABOUT WHAT 90,000 DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BILLING UNITS, IS THAT CORRECT? YEAH.
AND IT'S A COMBINATION, AGAIN OF APPEALS AND CREDITS.
JUST TO KINDA ADD TO THE POINT, UM, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT APPEALS HERE, UH, AS WE EXPLAINED BEFORE, THE IMPERVIOUS AREA IS ACTUALLY DIGITIZED IMPERVIOUS AREA FOR EACH PARCEL, THEREFORE, WE ARE NOT EXPECTING A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF APPEALS.
IF IT WAS, IF SOME LEVEL OF ESTIMATION WAS USED BASING USING, BASED ON SOME RUNOFF FACTOR AND STUFF LIKE THAT, THAT SOME COMMUNITIES USE, THEN YOU COULD ANTICIPATE A LOT OF APPEALS.
BUT HERE, THE CITY PARISHES ACTUALLY USED THE IMAGERY AND DIGITIZED IT AND WE PROCESSED THE IMAGERY FOR EACH PARCEL USING THE G I S TECHNOLOGY, AND THEREFORE IT IS AS RELIABLE AS IT CAN GET IN TERMS OF THE IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SO THERE'S A HIGH DEGREE OF CONFIDENCE IN THE IMPERVIOUS AREA THAT'S BEEN DETERMINED.
AND, UH, JUST IF YOU COULD GIVE US WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS HAVE BEEN WHERE Y'ALL HAVE IMPLEMENTED THIS IN OTHER LOCATIONS, UH, WHAT IS THE MAIN, OR WHO, LET ME ASK IT THIS WAY.
[00:20:01]
WHAT OF THESE OPTIONS IS MOST PREVALENT? UM, FROM A NATIONWIDE STANDPOINT, FROM THE STORMWATER SURVEYS THAT WE HAVE SEEN, IT WOULD BE OPTION TWO WHERE HAVING A TIERED RATE STRUCTURE FOR RESIDENTIAL IS VERY COMMON AND PREDOMINANTLY INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED IS WHAT IS USED FOR THE NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES.AND DO YOU FIND, DO YOU FIND THAT THERE IS, UH, GREATER PUSHBACK WHEN I'M, I'M TRYING TO FIND OUT IF WE IMPLEMENT SOMETHING, WHAT IS THE GREATEST LEVEL OF PUSHBACK THAT WE ARE GONNA RECEIVE EITHER FROM THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY OR FROM UH, RESIDENTS? SO, UM, TYPICALLY TALKING RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE A FEW PROP THERE.
THERE ARE SOME IN THE COUNTRY THAT DO HAVE FLAT FEE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL PARCELS, WHERE LITERALLY THEY WANT TO GO EXTREMELY SIMPLE AND THEY JUST HAVE A FLAT FEE FOR EACH RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY.
THOSE ARE ALL ENTITIES THAT ESTABLISHED A FEE A LONG TIME AGO.
UM, AND SO THEY HAVEN'T REALLY CHANGED IT.
BUT IF YOU ARE LOOKING MORE LIKE WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN THE LAST, LET'S SAY, FIVE TO 10 YEARS, UTILITIES THAT HAVE COME IN SINCE THE 2000, FOR EXAMPLE, THEY TYPICALLY GO IN FOR A RESIDENTIAL, TIERED RESIDENTIAL, UH, BECAUSE IT BALANCES THE FACT THAT YOU'RE NOT CHARGING EVERY RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY, WHETHER IT IS AN 800 SQUARE FEET HOME THAT ANNA I EXPLAINED, OR A 10,000 SQUARE FEET HOME, YOU'RE NOT CHARGING THEM THEN THE SAME BECAUSE OPTICALLY YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCE.
AT THE SAME TIME, IT HELPS THE UTILITY BALANCE, THE ADMINISTRATIVE BURDEN THAT YOU ARE NOT ENTERTAINING, YOU KNOW, APPEAL FROM EVERY INDIVIDUAL RESIDENTIAL PARCEL AND EVEN FROM THE PARCEL OWNERS, THEY DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT, LET'S SAY FOR EXAMPLE, THEY'RE GONNA ADD A DECK.
THEY'RE ADDING A DECK FOR 200, 300 SQUARE FEET BECAUSE OF THAT, IT'S NOT LIKE THE CHARGE IS IMMEDIATELY GONNA JUMP AS LONG AS THEY'RE IN THE TIER RANGE.
THEY CAN ADD A ROOM, THEY CAN ADD A DECK, AND IT'S STILL NOT SUBSTANTIVELY DIFFERENT FOR THEM.
SO FOR THOSE ADMINISTRATIVE REASONS, FROM THE UTILITY STANDPOINT AND THE CUSTOMERS TIERED RESIDENTIAL IS NORMALLY USED, INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
ONE OF THE REASONS YOU DON'T SEE A TIERED RATES FOR INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED FOR, UH, NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES OR ANY KIND OF A FLAT CHARGE FOR NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES, UH, ESPECIALLY IN THESE DAYS, BECAUSE AS WE SEE IN THE CITY PARISH, THERE'S A BIG DIVERSITY IN THE AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA FROM PROPERTY TO PROPERTY.
NO TWO PROPERTIES ARE THE SAME.
AND EVEN SIDE BY SIDE, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE A STRIP MALL.
AND THEN THE NEXT THING YOU KNOW, THERE MIGHT BE A SMALL MOM AND POP STORE THAT THAT'S INDIVIDUAL.
SO BECAUSE OF THE DIVERSITY IS WHERE TYPICALLY THEY LEAN TOWARDS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED THIS, UH, WHAT WAS SENT OUT TO US WAS VERY HELPFUL.
THAT GIVES US A GOOD IDEA OF WHAT PUSHBACKS YOU WOULD HAVE AND WHAT YOU HAVE DONE.
I HAVE A, A QUESTION, UM, AND I'M SORRY IF I MISSED IT, IF THAT'S, THIS WAS DISCUSSED IN PRIOR MEETINGS, BUT, UM, WHEN YOU SAY THAT THE IMPERVIOUS AREAS DIGITALLY CALCULATED, UM, WHAT ABOUT THOSE AREAS THAT, UM, ARE LIKE PERVIOUS CONCRETE AND OTHER AREAS LIKE GRAVEL PARKING LOTS, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE THOSE ARE CONSIDERED, YOU KNOW, PERVIOUS, BUT YET DIGITALLY THEY MAY ASSUME A HARDSCAPE, YOU KNOW, VIEWPOINT.
UM, YEAH, THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.
SO FOR THE PURPOSES OF, UH, STORMWATER UTILITY CALCULATION, THEY ARE DEEMED IMPERVIOUS.
AND THIS IS NOT UNIQUE TO CITY PARISH, UH, COMPACTED GRAVEL, LOOSE GRAVEL, COMPACTED EVEN DIRT, UH, MORE THAN COMPACTED DIRT, BUT DEFINITELY COMPACTED GRAVEL, LOOSE GRAVEL, CONCRETE PAVED AREAS.
THEY'RE ALL DEEMED IMPERVIOUS, NOT BECAUSE OF JUST DIGITIZATION OF THE IMAGERY.
THOSE ARE ALSO POLICIES THAT, UH, TYPICAL UTILITIES DO BECAUSE THEY DO RESTRICT INFILTRATION OF STORM WATER AND THEY DO COST RUNOFF.
WELL, THE, THE THING IS, THE CITY ENCOURAGES GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE AND THAT'S PART OF GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE.
SO, YOU KNOW, WOULD THAT MOMENTUM MOVE PEOPLE AWAY FROM GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE IMPERVIOUS ANYMORE? SO THERE'S A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CALLING COMPACTED GRAVEL, IMPERVIOUS GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE, THAT'S NOT REALLY GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE.
SO WHEN THEY TALK ABOUT GREEN IN INFRASTRUCTURE, REALLY TALKING, FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT THEY CALL POROUS PAVEMENT, POROUS OR YOU CALL A A, A POROUS, UH, YOU KNOW, DRIVEWAY, RIGHT? THOSE ARE ALL CONSIDERED, YOU KNOW, UM, YOU KNOW, IT HELPS WITH INFILTRATION.
SO THOSE KINDS OF PRACTICES, AGAIN, THERE ARE UTILITIES THAT DO CONSIDER THOSE KINDS OF BEST PRACTICES THROUGH A CREDIT PROGRAM.
UM, BECAUSE YES, THOSE WILL GET PICKED UP AS IMPIOUS AREA, BUT THOSE ARE HANDLED THROUGH A CREDIT PROGRAM.
WELL, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I WAS WORRIED ABOUT WAS WHETHER OR NOT WE ARE DISCOURAGING THAT NOW, BUT, YOU KNOW, SO YEAH, NOT THOSE THINGS, BUT COMPACTED GRAVE, YOU KNOW, ANY KIND IS NOT NECESSARILY A GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE.
[00:25:03]
AND JUST TO ADD ON TO THAT IS HAVING THE, THOSE, THE PAVERS THAT I THINK YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT COULD ACTUALLY BE CONSIDERED, I THINK ALSO THROUGH THE APPEALS PROCESS AS WELL.I JUST HAVE ONE QUESTION CONCERNING THE, UH, CREDIT MM-HMM.
SO CREDITS ARE ONLY AVAILABLE IN OPTION THREE, OR ARE THEY ALSO AVAILABLE IN THE ADOPTION? SO IN, IN OPTION ONE WITH, WITH THE TIERS FOR ALL PARCELS, UM, EXCEPT FOR PARCELS OVER A MILLION SQUARE FEET IN PERVIS AREA, I, I GUESS I THINK FOR ALL THREE OPTIONS THEY COULD BE CONSIDERED, UM, I THINK THOUGH THAT UNDER THE INDI INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED IS THE OPTION WHERE IT REALLY MAKES THE MOST SENSE.
SO, SO IN ALL THREE OPTIONS, LET'S TALK OPTION ONE AND TWO.
UH, IN OPTION ONE, ANY PROPERTY, ANYTIME A PROPERTY IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY, UH, SO IN OPTION ONE THEY, THAT CREDITS COULD BE CONSIDERED BECAUSE ANYTHING GREATER THAN $1 MILLION, ONE 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET IS GETTING INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
YOU COME TO OPTION TWO, ALL NON-RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES ARE GONNA BE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO, WHICH MEANS THE CREDIT PROGRAM WHERE IF, IF A CREDIT PROGRAM IS USED, THEN IT WOULD APPLY TO ALL NON-RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES BECAUSE THEY'RE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
AND THEN OPTION THREE, WHERE EVERY PARCEL IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, AGAIN, CREDIT PROGRAM WILL APPLY.
BUT BASED ON THE POLICY DISCUSSIONS WE'VE HAD INTERNALLY BALANCING ADMINISTRATIVE BURDEN AND UH, HAVING THE CAPACITY TO PROCESS CREDITS, AS WE HAD EXPLAINED TO YOU BEFORE, THE CREDIT PROGRAM THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED WOULD BE ONLY FOR NON RESIDENTIAL.
SO IN A SENSE, IN ALL THREE OPTIONS, THE CREDIT PROGRAM WILL BE CONSIDERED REALLY FOR NON RESIDENTIAL TO BEGIN WITH, AGAIN, BECAUSE OF THE ADMINISTRATIVE REASONS.
BUT IN OPTION ONE, IT'LL BE ONLY FOR PROPERTIES GREATER THAN MILLION SQUARE FEET.
OPTION TWO, IT'LL BE FOR ALL NON RESIDENTIAL OPTION THREE, IT'LL BE FOR ALL NON RESIDENTIAL.
UM, AM I CORRECT THAT THE THREE OPTIONS YOU ALL ARE SHOWING US AND THE RATES OF THE ANNUAL CHARGES ASSOCIATED WITH EACH, GET US TO THE 6.5 MILLION, GET US TO THE, UH, COMPLIANCE LEVEL OF SERVICE? IT, IT DOES IN ALL THREE OPTIONS.
IT DOES GET YOU TO THE $6.5 MILLION.
THAT'S THE TOTAL, THAT ALL THREE OPTIONS GET US TO 6.5 MILLION ANNUALLY.
DOES IT GO ABOVE 6.5 MILLION IN, IN OPTION, IN OPTION ONE AND TWO? YES, BECAUSE THE BILLING, THE UNIT RATE ONE THREE IS THE TOTAL.
UM, ALRIGHT, SORRY, THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO GET TO.
AND SO THESE DO NOTHING IN THE WAY OF WATER QUANTITY.
THESE THREE OPTIONS ADDRESS COMPLIANCE WITH MS FOUR.
BEYOND 2025, BUT DO NOTHING TOWARDS QUANTITY.
WITH THE AMOUNT THAT WOULD BE COLLECTED.
AND, AND SO WHAT'S IN FRONT OF YOU ONLY ADDRESSES THAT? UM, WE DID SEND THE, THE SPREADSHEET THAT MM-HMM.
I GUESS WE NEED, NEEDED A MAGNIFYING GLASS.
SO THAT SPREADSHEET PRESENTS THE SIX AND A HALF MILLION AND THEN WE JUST WENT UP, WE DID 10, 15, 20, AND 25 WITH THE THOUGHT THAT, UM, MAYBE YOU ADD A LITTLE BIT FOR O AND M, MAYBE YOU ADD A LITTLE BIT FOR SOME CAPITAL PROJECTS, WHATEVER THE, THE CASE MAY BE.
IT, IT WAS REALLY JUST TO SHOW THIS IS WHAT THESE, UH, DIFFERENT RATE STRUCTURES WOULD LOOK LIKE AS THAT NUMBER INCREASED IF THE COMMITTEE SO CHOOSES THE, THE INCREASE THAT FUNDING LEVEL.
BUT, UM, BRAAVA AND SARAH, I MEAN THE, THE EXPERTS CAN, UM, SAY THIS BETTER THAN I CAN.
ROWDY, I MEAN THESE ADDRESS WATER QUALITY AND QUANTITY.
I MEAN, NOT TO THE EXTENT THAT I'D LIKE TO SEE OR WE'D LIKE TO SEE WITH THE STORMWATER COALITION.
WE'D LIKE TO SEE A FULL PROGRAM ROBUST.
THIS IS LIKE WE TALKED ABOUT LAST TIME, THE, THE VOLKSWAGEN.
THE MINIMUM, THE BARE MINIMUM.
BUT CERTAINLY, I MEAN, HELP ME LADIES, RIGHT? THIS, THIS IS GONNA HELP MITIGATE SOME WATER QUALITY AND QUANTITY ISSUES IF IT'S IMPLEMENTED CORRECTLY, RIGHT?
[00:30:01]
AGAIN, THIS, THIS SIX AND A HALF MILLIONS IS THE ADDITIONAL, RIGHT? 'CAUSE REMEMBER IN ALL THESE THREE OPTIONS, THE ASSUMPTION IS THAT THE 10 MILLION THAT IS COMING FROM THE GENERAL FARM WILL CONTINUE TO COME, RIGHT? OF COURSE THIS IS THE SIX AND A HALF ADDITIONAL MILLION DOLLARS AND THAT 10 MILLION THAT CONTINUES TO COME FROM THE GENERAL FARM IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO SUPPORT THE DRAINAGE MAINTENANCE AND THINGS LIKE THAT, WHICH ARE ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL.THIS JUST TAKES IT ONE STEP FORWARD IN ADDITION TO THAT, TO GET THE SIX AND A HALF MILLION ADDITIONAL MONEY SO THAT MORE PROACTIVE WATER QUALITY COMPLIANCE AND THINGS LIKE THAT CAN BE DONE.
I MEAN, IN REALITY, QUALITY AND QUANTITY ARE NOT COMPLETELY DISASSOCIATED.
YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU TO SOME EXTENT MANAGE QUANTITY AND THAT HELPS MANAGING QUALITY, RIGHT? SO THEY'RE TWO VERY HIGHLY INTEGRATED.
BUT, BUT YES, THAT'S, THIS IS AN ADDITIONAL ON TOP OF THE 10 MILLION.
COULD WE PULL UP OPTION ONE, OPTION ONE ON THE GREEN? I'M NOT SURE WHO'S DRIVING THE POWERPOINT.
SO AS IT'S BEING PULLED UP, UM, DO YOU HAVE IT IN FRONT OF YOU? OPTION ONE? YEAH, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND.
SO YOU'VE GOT ON THE FAR RIGHT COLUMN BILLING UNITS, THAT'S THE NUMBER OF PROPERTIES? NO.
SO THE NUMBER OF PARCELS IS THE NUMBER OF PROPERTIES, THE BILLING UNITS, ONE BILLING UNIT IS 500 SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SO FOR PARCELS THAT ARE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED, IT'S JUST THAT PARCELS AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA DIVIDED BY 500 SQUARE FEET.
WHEN WE DO THE TIERS THOUGH, WHAT WE'RE SHOWING THERE IS THE BILLING UNITS FOR EACH TIER, AND THAT'S BASED ON THE, THE MEDIAN IMPERVIOUS AREA FOR EACH PARCEL.
SO, SO PROBABLY WE'LL SEND YOU WHEN THE, WHEN THIS PRESENTATION IS POSTED, WE WILL ADD ONE MORE COLUMN.
WHAT YOU'RE NOT SEEING HERE IS THAT IT'S ACTUALLY A BILLING UNIT DIFFERENTIAL BETWEEN THE FIRST TIER AND THE SECOND TIER AND THE THIRD TIER AND THE FOURTH TIER.
SO THAT'LL TELL YOU WHAT'S THE DIFFERENTIAL IS.
THAT COLUMN, AGAIN, BECAUSE OF REAL ESTATE, WE DIDN'T PUT THAT COLUMN, BUT THAT'LL TELL YOU HOW THE BILLING UNITS ARE CALCULATED FOR EACH TIER.
SO FOR EXAMPLE, IF BILLING UNIT TIER ONE IS X, THEN BILLING UNIT TIER TWO IS SO MUCH TIMES X AND BILLING IN A THREE TIER THREE IS THEN JUST A MULTIPLIER.
SO WE WILL SHOW YOU THE COLUMN SO THAT YOU CAN SEE WHAT'S THE BILLING UNIT FACTOR IS FOR TIER ONE VERSUS TWO FOR ALL THE 11 TIERS.
I I CAN ACTUALLY PULL IT UP RIGHT NOW.
SO, SO I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE SPREADSHEET THAT HAD THE DIFFERENT DOLLAR AMOUNTS.
THE FIRST ONE IS JUST THE BARE MS FLOOR KIND OF COVERAGE.
AND AS YOU ADD THE 10, 15, 20, ARE THOSE THERE TO SAY ADDRESS SOME OF THE PROJECTS THAT WERE IDENTIFIED IN THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN? THAT'S CERTAINLY A POSSIBILITY.
WHEN YOU S SO I WANT TO, THERE'S, THERE'S SO MANY BUCKETS OF MONEY HERE.
THE MS FOUR WAS FOR THE ADMINISTRATIVE ACTIVITIES ASSOCIATED WITH MS FOUR, THE 6.5, AND THEN YOU MENTIONED THE O AND M, BUT WE ALSO SAID THERE'S $11 MILLION COMING OUT OF THE GENERAL FUND.
IS THAT COVERING THE O AND M COMPONENT? UH, SO THE, YEAH, WE HAVE A, A POT OF MONEY RIGHT NOW.
WHERE THAT, THAT THE CITY PARISH HAS, THAT WE ARE CURRENTLY USING FOR O AND M FUNCTIONS.
THIS, THE SIX AND A HALF MILLION IS IN ADDITION TO WHATEVER IS COMING OUT OF THE, THE CURRENT BUDGET, WHETHER IT'S GENERAL FUNDS OR WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE, IS FOR THE, THE REGULATORY PORTION OF THIS WORK.
DOES THAT ANSWER THE QUESTION? YEAH, IT DOES.
AND THEN, SO THEREFORE THE, THE 10, 15, 20, 20 $5 MILLION OPTIONS COULD COVER PROJECTS DEFINED BY THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN.
SO COULD, RIGHT, AND THE REASON, SO I THINK IT WAS, UM, ADAM KNAPP THAT ASKED THAT SAID, HEY, I, I WANT TO SEE, UH, SOME CAPITAL WORK, UM, ADDED TO THIS.
AND THEN A, A FEW OF THE OTHER FOLKS SAID,
[00:35:01]
HEY, IF WE'RE GONNA BRING THIS TO THE PEOPLE, WE NEED TO BRING A COMBINED PACKAGE THAT ADDRESSES BOTH QUANTITY AND QUALITY.SO I, I WAS JUST PUTTING NUMBERS IN INCREMENTS AND $5 MILLION INCREMENTS JUST TO SHOW IF WE WERE TRYING TO GET MORE MONEY, THEN THIS IS WHAT THOSE INDIVIDUAL FEES WOULD LOOK LIKE.
AND THEN THIS IS HOW IT WOULD AFFECT BRECK AND THIS IS HOW IT WOULD AFFECT SOUTHERN.
UM, THE THOUGHT WOULD BE IF, IF WE WOULD DO SOME TYPE OF MAJOR CAPITAL PROGRAM, IT WOULD BE BONDED AND THEN THAT WOULD HOWEVER MANY MILLIONS IT WOULD TAKE PER YEAR TO BOND WHATEVER WORK THE COMMITTEE COULD CHOOSE TO DO WOULD BE IN THOSE NUMBERS THAT WE PRESENTED.
THAT SHOULD BE A KEY TENET OF WHATEVER WE PROPOSE GOING FORWARD, BECAUSE WE HAVE CONDITIONED THE PARISH OVER THE LAST FOUR AND A HALF YEARS TO THINK STORMWATER MASTER PLAN IMPROVING OR REDUCING THE FLOOD RISK IN THE PARISH.
VERY FEW PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF THE MS FOUR.
AND SO A COMBINATION OF ANYTHING, A COMBINATION OF BOTH THE REGULATORY COMPONENT AND THE FLOOD RISK MITIGATION COMPONENT HAS GOT TO BE WHAT WE PRESENT TO THE, UH, TO THE PUBLIC.
NOW, I AGREE YOU'RE NOT GONNA GET TO THIS $2.4 BILLION OF ACTIVITY AND THAT'S GONNA HAVE TO COME FROM EITHER MANNA FROM WASHINGTON OR WHATEVER, HOWEVER YOU DECIDE TO DO THAT, BUT, OKAY, THANK YOU.
YEAH, AND I, I THINK, AND I, I'LL GO AHEAD, I'LL JUMP AHEAD HERE.
THE, THE AGENDA FOR SOME OF THE SUBSEQUENT MEETINGS WOULD BE LET'S TALK ABOUT WHAT CAPITAL PROJECTS YOU GUYS WOULD LIKE TO SEE.
LET'S TALK ABOUT, I, I THINK I HEARD COUNCILMAN GODDE SAY AT THE LAST MEETING THAT WE MAY LOOK AT THAT O AND M LIST AND GO THROUGH EACH ITEM IN DETAIL AND MAYBE A HANDFUL OF THOSE ARE PICKED AND WE, WE PUT THAT IN.
SO I'VE BEEN WORKING WITH FRED AND HIS TEAM WITH H N T B.
WE'VE ALREADY PULLED TOGETHER A LIST, AND SO WE'VE GOT THAT IN.
AND LIKE I SAID, IT'S NOT 2.4 BILLION.
IT'S, THERE'S A $200 MILLION LIST AND THEN THERE'S A $300 MILLION LIST.
BECAUSE JUST BEYOND THAT, IT'S, UM, I, I WILL CERTAINLY PROVIDE THAT NUMBER IF Y'ALL WANT TO SEE IT, BUT IT, UH, IT GETS, IT GETS HIGH QUICK.
SO JUST, JUST REAL QUICK QUESTION ON THE LIST.
IS IT LOOKING AT THE MOST
THEY, THEY HAD A, AND, AND I THINK LIKELY, WE'LL, WE'LL GET INTO THIS AND THAT'LL BE THAT, THAT WORK SESSION WHENEVER WE GET TO THAT ONE.
BUT YEAH, THEY, THEY HAD A RANKING SYSTEM THAT WAS BASED ON SEVERAL DIFFERENT FACTORS, AND THESE ARE THE, THE ONES THAT RANKED THE HIGHEST IN THAT RANKING SYSTEM AND THE, UH, 6.6 MILLION IN RESERVE FUNDS WE TALKED ABOUT AT THE LAST MEETING.
IS THAT STILL IN PLAIN? YES, SIR.
SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW IS 2025 AND NO, I'M SORRY, 2026.
SO WE HAVE, WE HAVE FUNDING FOR 2024 THROUGH ARP FUNDS AND SOME OTHER, SOME ONE TIME DEDICATED FUNDING.
WE'VE GOT FUNDING FOR 2025 THROUGH THE GENERAL FUND THAT IS STILL IN PLACE.
UM, IT'S ACTUALLY, UH, I THINK IT'S GONNA BE GONE ON THE COUNCIL AGENDA HERE SHORTLY.
AND THEN, UM, SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NOW IS 2026.
SO THAT 6.6 IS IS OR 2026 THEN.
YES, WE TALKED ABOUT, WELL, I, I GUESS THE, THE COMMITTEE, THE COMMITTEE HAS MADE A RECOMMENDATION AT THIS POINT THAT THAT IS WHAT, THAT THE LEVEL OF FUNDING THAT THAT HAS BEEN RECOMMENDED AND APPROVED IS FOR THAT LEVEL OF SERVICE, IS THE, IS THE SIX POINT I'M, I'M TALKING ABOUT THE RESERVE FUNDS.
THEY'RE AVAILABLE WHEN THEY'RE SPLIT.
UM, AND MAYBE YOU CAN PROBABLY ANSWER THIS BETTER THAN I COULD.
[00:40:01]
I GUESS IS THE APPROPRIATE WORD FOR 2025.BUT THEY'RE BEING ACCUMULATED OVER TWO YEARS.
SO NEXT YEAR, 2024, WE'RE USING ARPA MONEY, 6 MILLION.
AND THEN IN 2025, IT'LL BE THE GENERAL FUND SURPLUS THAT'LL COVER THE 6 MILLION FOR COMPLIANCE.
AND THAT MONEY, THE 6 MILLION IN 2025 IS 3 MILLION FROM BUDGET SURPLUS THIS YEAR.
3 MILLION FROM BUDGET SURPLUS NEXT YEAR TO THEN BE USED IN 2025.
SO WHEN WOULD OUR, WHEN WOULD OUR 6.5 WE'RE APPROVING FOR THESE FEES COME INTO EFFECT? TO COVER? WHAT, WHEN WOULD IT, WHAT, WHAT QUESTION ARE YOU ASKING? IF WE PASS A A, A FEE, UTILITY FEE TO, TO FUND SIX POINT TO RAISE 6.5 MILLION ANNUALLY, WHEN DOES THAT 6.5 MILLION COME INTO PLAY FOR MS FOUR? IT WOULD HAVE TO BE COLLECTED IN 2025 SO THAT WE COULD HAVE IT IN PLACE, START USING IT 2026.
SO, I'M SORRY, ARE YOU FINISHED? OKAY, GO AHEAD.
SO, SO THAT BEING SAID, LET'S SAY WE WALK OUTTA HERE TODAY AND WE CHOOSE OPTION TWO.
HYBRID, UM, YOU GUYS WILLING TO VOTE ON IT AT THE COUNCIL? I MEAN, YOU'RE A GOVERNING BODY, UH, AS I UNDERSTAND IT.
YOU HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO VOTE ON THIS, YOU GONNA VOTE ON IT, OR ARE YOU GONNA, WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO WITH IT? YOU GONNA PUT IT TO THE VOTE OF THE PEOPLE? WHAT HAPPENS? OH, SORRY.
UM, I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHEN IT, IF IF IT'S Y'ALL VOTING ON IT, IT COULD BE APPROVED, YOU KNOW, PRETTY QUICKLY.
IF IT HAS TO GO BEFORE A VOTE OF A PEOPLE, THAT'S A MUCH A LONGER PLAY.
THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND.
WE DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.
WE DON'T, WE DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT HAS TO GO TO THE VOTE OF PEOPLE.
MY OUR UNDERSTANDING IS IT DOES NOT, THE GOVERNING BODY HAS THE AUTHORITY TO MAKE THAT DETERMINATION.
NOW THERE'S AN OPTION FOR THEM TO PUT IT, THAT YOU CAN CERTAINLY TAKE THAT OPTION A HUNDRED PERCENT AND PUT IT TO VOTE OF A PEOPLE, BUT THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED TO DO THAT.
THAT IS OUR UNDERSTANDING AS, UH, THE TYPE OF GOVERNMENT THAT WE HAVE.
UM, I MEAN, WE DON'T VOTE ON EVERY TIME THE SEWER BILL GOES UP OR EVERY TIME THE WATER BILL GOES UP OR EVERY TIME THE GARBAGE CONTRACT GETS INCREASED, WE DON'T VOTE ON THAT.
BUT, BUT SEEM LIKE WE CAN GET AN ANSWER ON THAT.
YOU WOULD THINK WE COULD GET AN ANSWER ON 6.5 OR $7.2 MILLION.
YOU WOULD THINK, OH, I SEE AN ANSWER ON WHETHER THEY, WE HAVE TO VOTE TO THE PEOPLE.
WELL, I, I DID VISIT WITH THE, THE CITY ATTORNEY.
YEAH, I'M JUST SAYING THAT'S WHAT OUR STORMWATER TEAM, OUR UNDERSTANDING IS, BUT WE'LL FIND OUT SOON.
DO YOU KNOW IF SHE FOUND OUT, ADAM? I, I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT IT SINCE THEN.
I, I, I THINK THAT'S A BIG DETERMIN IN FACTOR.
IN TERMS OF, WE'VE BEEN SAYING THAT FROM THE BEGINNING IN TERMS OF HOW WE MOVE FORWARD MM-HMM.
AND SO, YEAH, IF WE CAN GET AN ANSWER TO THAT, UM, AND AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, THAT THAT WOULD HELP.
AND I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S THE LEGISLATE, I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHERE TO GET THE ANSWER FROM THAT ON, BUT NO, IT'S THE CITY.
IT'S, IT'S OUR HOMEROOM RULE CHARTER.
IT HAS TO DO WITH US AND OUR FORM OF CONSOLIDATED GOVERNMENT.
UM, AND SO ADAM, UM, LAST TIME, WHILE, WHILE I HAVE YOU AT THE PODIUM, UM, WE, WE TALKED ABOUT, UM, WHICH MAPS WERE BEING USED.
UM, AND, AND SO TO SOME EXTENT THE ASSESSOR'S MAP HAS TO BE USED TO SOME EXTENT, RIGHT? FOR, FOR OWNERSHIP.
I MEAN, HOW, HOW DO WE, BECAUSE I ASKED THAT QUESTION LAST TIME AND YOU MENTIONED, YOU SAID, AH, NO, WE'RE NOT USING ASSESSOR.
YOU MENTIONED SOME OTHER MAP THAT WE WERE USING.
BUT I GUESS MY, MY ULTIMATE POINT IS I ASSUME WE'RE USING THE ASSESSOR'S MAP IN ORDER TO KNOW WHO OWNS THE PARCELS, BUT, UH, OUR EXPERIENCE IS THAT THE ASSESSOR'S MAP HAS, HAS SIGNIFICANT ERRORS.
WELL, MAYBE THE WORD SIGNIFICANT IS TOO STRONG, BUT IN OUR EXPERIENCE, WE, WE'VE SEEN MULTIPLE ERRORS.
UM, AND, AND SO THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS, AGAIN, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU FIX THAT, BUT, BUT THAT'S SOMETHING TO CONSIDER.
UM, MY OTHER QUESTION IS CITY PARK, IT'S OWNED BY THE CITY.
WHO, WHO PAYS THE FEE ON THAT? UM, I WILL.
WE, WE ARE USING INFORMATION FROM THE ASSESSOR'S OFFICE AND THAT, THAT'S HOW WE, WE DETERMINED OWNERSHIP.
UM, THAT ONE IN PARTICULAR, I, I'LL, I'LL LOOK AT, BUT UM, AND, AND YET, LOOK, WE
[00:45:01]
IN, IN COMBING THROUGH SOME OF THE DATA WE WERE TRYING TO, WE, WE STUMBLED UPON A HANDFUL OF THINGS THAT WE NEED TO WORK WITH THE ASSESSOR'S OFFICE ON TO, UH, TO GET 'EM CLEANED UP.'CAUSE WE, FOR INSTANCE, WE HAD A, UM, THERE WAS A PIECE OF PROPERTY AND IT WAS A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS AREA, AND IT WAS CLASSIFIED AS RESIDENTIAL.
IT'S LIKE, WOW, SOMEBODY'S GOT A BIG HOUSE.
AND THEN COME TO FIND OUT IT'S NOT A BIG HOUSE.
THE, UM, IT'S A INDUSTRIAL FACIL.
I GUESS IT WOULD BE THE, THE RIGHT WORD.
SO YEAH, THERE, THERE'S GONNA BE SOME THINGS THAT ARE GONNA NEED TO BE CLEANED UP.
AND THAT GOES INTO THE, THE MORE YOU LOOK AT INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED AND ALL THAT GOOD STUFF, THE MORE ADMINISTRATIVE COSTS THERE ARE IN IT, THE, THE MORE WORK THERE IS TO ADMINISTER THAT TYPE OF FEE.
WHEREAS IF IT'S, IF PEOPLE ARE JUST IN PEERS, IT'S, IT'S DIFFERENT.
SO YEAH, THAT, THAT'S ABSOLUTELY SOMETHING THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO WORK THROUGH.
I THINK I CAN, I CAN TELL YOU FROM, FROM THE EXPERIENCE NATIONALLY IN DOING THIS, UH, IT'S NOT TYPICALLY WHO'S OPERATING IT.
UH, IT'S REALLY WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY BECAUSE EXACTLY.
AGAIN, DEPENDING ON WHICHEVER FUNDING STRUCTURE YOU CHOOSE, RIGHT? WHETHER YOU CHOOSE IN THE OPTION 1, 2, 3, WHATEVER THE FUNDING STRUCTURE IS FROM A BILLING RESPONSIBILITY STANDPOINT, BECAUSE THIS IS PROPERTY BASED, UM, IT'S NOT JUST YOU PUT A METER AND MEASURE THE CONSUMPTION.
SO TYPICALLY, THE ULTIMATE RESPONSIBILITY OF BILLING AND PAYMENT OF THE CHARGE RESTS ON THE PROPERTY OWNER.
SO, UH, AGAIN, DEPENDS ON THE BILLING METHODOLOGY, WHETHER IT'S GONNA BE BILLED THROUGH A TAX ASSESSOR SYSTEM OR A UTILITY BILLING SYSTEM.
THERE ARE PROS AND CONS OF HOW THE ENFORCEMENT IS DONE, BUT BY AND LARGE, THE PROPERTY OWNER IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CHARGES, ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CHARGES.
SO IF YOU'RE ASKING WHAT OTHER ENTITIES DO, FROM MY EXPERIENCE IN WORKING WITH OTHER UTILITIES, UH, PROPERTIES WHERE THE CITY OWNED PROPERTIES, STATE OWNED PROPERTIES, FEDERAL GOVERNMENT OWNED PROPERTIES ARE BUILT, THE POOR IS THE OWNER ON THE DEEDED FOR THOSE CITY, STATE, AND FEDERAL ENTITIES.
SO WE HAVE CLIENTS WHERE THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY IS THE SECRETARY OF THE ARMY, IS THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY, THEY OWN THE DEED.
THEY ARE THE, THEY ARE THE ENTITY THAT THAT HAS TO PAY.
THAT ALSO APPLIES TO QUASI GOVERNMENT ENTITIES LIKE AMTRAK.
AMTRAK IS THE OWNER OF PROPERTIES, AND MANY OF OUR CLIENTS, THEY ARE, THEY HAVE TO PAY THE CHARGES AND THEY DO PAY THE CHARGES.
AND, AND ADAM SORT OF ADDRESSED THE, THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD REGARDING WHETHER THE TIERS PROVIDED SOME, UM, UH, A LESS OF A COST IN TERMS OF ADMINISTRATION OF THE PROGRAM.
AND SO THERE IS MAYBE IS IT SHOWN IN THE NUMBERS THAT WE HAVE, UM, IN TERMS OF THE ADMINISTRATIVE COSTS OR BURDEN, UH, TIERS VERSUS INDIVIDUAL, UM, CALCULATION.
UM, SO AS, AS ADAM MENTIONED, IF YOU LOOK AT OPTION NUMBER ONE, RIGHT? THAT TAKES AWAY LOT OF ONE KEY CHALLENGE.
THAT TAKES AWAY ONE KEY CHALLENGE IN TERMS OF THE CUSTOMER CLASSIFICATION, WHETHER YOU'RE A RESIDENTIAL OR WHETHER YOU'RE A NON-RESIDENTIAL, WHETHER THERE ARE SOME INACCURACIES IN THE ASSESSOR'S, UH, CLASSIFICATION OF THE PROPERTY, NOT THE OWNER, BUT THE CLASSIFICATION OF THE PROPERTY, IT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, AS LONG AS YOU BELONG TO A TIER IN OPTION ONE, YOU'RE GONNA PAY THE CHARGE.
SO THERE, THE ONLY QUESTION IS, IS YOUR IMPERVIOUS AREA REASONABLE? CORRECT.
SO THAT YOU'RE IN THE RIGHT TIER.
AND IF YOU'RE A PROPERTY GREATER THAN 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET, IT IS CALCULATED INDIVIDUALLY.
SO THE CLASSIFICATION ISSUE GOES AWAY.
AND I'LL TELL YOU FROM MY EXPERIENCE, NO ASSESSOR SYSTEM WILL HAVE THE PERFECTLY ACCURATE A HUNDRED PERCENT ACCURATE CLASSIFICATION.
IT'S HUMAN BEINGS WHO DEAL WITH IT.
SO SOMETIMES SOMETHING MAY NOT GET UPDATED TEMPORARILY, AND TYPICALLY WHEN YOU POINT OUT, THEN THEY WILL CORRECT IT.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE THE APPEALS PROCESS FOR THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO IN OPTION TWO, YES, CLASSIFICATION DOES BECOME IMPORTANT BECAUSE NOW YOU HAVE RESIDENTIAL UNDER TIER AND NON-RESIDENTIAL INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO CLASSIFICATION ACROSS WHETHER YOU'RE A RESIDENTIAL OR A NON-RESIDENTIAL BECOMES IMPORTANT.
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER YOU'RE A COMMERCIAL OR A HOTEL OR A, OR A CHURCH OR THAT CLASSIFICATION DOESN'T MATTER.
BUT RESIDENTIAL VERSUS NON-RESIDENTIAL ABSOLUTELY MATTERS.
OKAY? SO THAT'S ON THE OPTION TWO.
AND OPTION THREE, AGAIN, HONESTLY, CLASSIFICATION DOESN'T MATTER ANYMORE BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S CHARGE IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED.
SO THEREFORE, WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS, HEY, IS YOUR IMPERVIOUS AREA FAIR AND ACCURATELY CAPTURED? SO IT DOES HAVE AN IMPLICATION ON THE, UH, ADMINISTRATIVE
[00:50:01]
ASPECTS OF, YOU KNOW, THE APPEALS PROCESS.SO FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, OPTION ONE DEFINITELY IS MUCH, MUCH EASIER, UH, FOR THE UTILITY.
THE SECOND THING ALSO I WOULD TELL YOU ABOUT THE, BETWEEN THE THREE OPTIONS IS THAT IN OPTION ONE, AS I SAID, IF SOMEBODY ADDS A DECK, SOMEBODY ADDS A PATIO, IT DOESN'T MATTER, AS LONG AS YOU'RE IN THAT TIER RANGE, IT DOESN'T CHANGE.
SO YOU HAVE A, THE UTILITY HAS MORE FLEXIBILITY IN THE, IN THE FREQUENCY IN WHICH THEY WANT TO REVIEW THE IMPERVIOUS AREA AND GLOBALLY UPDATE ALL THE IMPERVIOUS AREA.
WHEREAS IN OPTION THREE, YOU KNOW, EVEN IF SOMEBODY ADDS ONE ROOM OF 200 SQUARE FEET OR AT LEAST 500 SQUARE FEET, THEN IT, IT CHANGES.
SO DEFINITELY ADMINISTRATIVELY OPTION ONE BECOMES THE MOST SIMPLER BECAUSE AGAIN, FOR THE FACT THAT WE SAID THEN THE CREDIT PROGRAM WILL APPLY ONLY TO PROPERTIES GREATER THAN A MILLION DOLLARS.
SO FROM THAT TWO ANGLES, DATA MANAGEMENT CREDIT PROGRAM, MANAGING THE APPEALS OPTION ONE WILL BE EASIER ON THE UTILITY.
UM, AGAIN, IT'S A BALANCING OF ADMINISTRATION, ADMINISTRATIVE EASE WITH EQUITY AND, AND ALL OF THAT.
I HAVE A, I HAVE A QUESTION JUST FOR CLARIFICATION.
UH, IT WAS SAID THAT IT, IT, WE HAVE TO, WE NEED TO KNOW BEFORE WE VOTE ON THIS, WE SHOULD, WE NEED TO KNOW WHETHER THIS HAS TO GO FOR VOTE OF THE PEOPLE OR THE COUNCIL CAN VOTE ON THAT.
AND IT SAID THAT WE NEED TO KNOW THAT BEFORE THEN.
CAN I ASK WHY? WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE ON HOW WE VOTE IF IT HAS TO GO TO THE COUNCIL FIRST OR DIRECTLY TO THE PEOPLE? WELL, I MEAN, COREY SAID THAT I KIND OF SECONDED IT.
I MEAN, I, I, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW, I'VE BEEN SAYING THAT KIND OF FROM THE BEGINNING.
I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW MM-HMM.
I, I, I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, I GOTTA, I GOTTA AGREE WITH GREG.
IT SHOULDN'T MAKE A DIME'S WORTH OF DIFFERENCE.
DOESN'T MAKE A DIFFERENCE WHETHER IT GOES TO THE VOTE OF THE PEOPLE OR JUST THE SIMPLY THE COUNCIL.
AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS THOSE ARE POLITICAL ISSUES.
AND, UH, I DON'T KNOW THAT I WILL TELL YOU IF YOU, UH, IF YOU JUST HAVE THE COUNCIL DO IT, THAT'S A LOT OF PRESSURE ON THESE INDIVIDUAL COUNCIL MEMBERS TO DO THIS.
AND IF WE DON'T GO TO A VOTE OF PEOPLE, THAT'S PROBABLY GONNA BE SOMEBODY SUING OVER THIS.
WE, WE, WE NEED TO NOT BE INTO THE POLITICAL REALM.
THAT'S FOR THOSE PEOPLE, NOT US.
I, I WASN'T APPROACHING IT FROM A POLITICAL POINT OF VIEW.
MY POINT OF VIEW IS THAT IF WE HAVE TO START COLLECTING THIS ON JANUARY 1ST, 2025, THAT'S A YEAR AND A HALF FROM NOW.
SO IT'S GONNA GO, WE'RE GONNA, IT'S GONNA BE A LOT BETTER CHANCE OF US TO GET THIS THROUGH AND START COLLECTING ON JANUARY 1ST, 2025, SO WE CAN START USING IT ON JANUARY 1ST, 2026 VERSUS IF WE CAN'T EVEN VOTE ON IT UNTIL WHEN, FALL OF 2020.
WELL, YOU, YOU HAVE MULTIPLE OPPORTUNITIES TO VOTE, BUT TO ME IT SEEMS LIKE THIS SHOULD NOT, THIS SHOULD BE A COMPONENT, PART OF A BIG PACKAGE THAT WE'RE PRESENTING TO THE PUBLIC.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THE RATES THAT THEY HAVE IN HERE RIGHT NOW, I KINDA LIKE THE IDEA OF GOING TO 20, WHAT IS IT, FIVE 25 MILLION MM-HMM.
THAT, THAT SEEMS LIKE A, A, WE SHOULD NOT, WE SHOULD NOT PUT OUT THERE TODAY, IN MY OPINION, THIS IS JUST ME, THAT THIS IS THE RATES WE THINK WE OUGHT TO BE DOING.
IT'S NOT SOLVING ANY OF OUR PROBLEMS. MM-HMM.
IT'S SUR IT IT'S FIXING THE FEDERAL PROBLEM.
IT'S NOT FIXING ANY OF THE DRAINAGE PROBLEM.
AND THAT'S THE ONLY THING THAT PEOPLE WANT TO HEAR.
THEY DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUT WHETHER THE WATER QUALITY IS THIS OR THAT THEY DON'T, THAT'S NOT IN THEIR MM-HMM.
SO I WANNA MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE MODIFIED, BUT WE DO NOT SET A DOLLAR AMOUNT OF TOTAL AMOUNT TO COLLECT.
I THINK THAT'S VERY REASONABLE, LARRY.
I THINK IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT MODIFIED ME.
I WANNA ASK, UM, LOOKING AT OPTIONS ONE, TWO, AND THREE, WE KNOW THAT
[00:55:01]
OPTION ONE IS THE, THE SIMPLER AND OPTION THREE IS, UM, POTENTIALLY A LITTLE MORE COMPLEX.WHAT ARE WE LOOKING AT? AND, AND YOU CAN ANSWER THIS ADAM, OR PROBABLY YOU MAY BE ABLE TO HELP US WITH THIS.
WHAT ARE WE LOOKING AT HAVING TO ADD ADMINISTRATIVELY INTO YOUR DEPARTMENT TO, TO BE ABLE TO ADMINISTER THIS, THIS FEE? I MEAN, I'M, I'M, THIS IS NEW AND I'M ASSUMING, I MEAN, I KNOW YOU LIKE WORK UNTIL EIGHT O'CLOCK AT NIGHT AND MAYBE YOU WANNA WORK TILL 10, BUT I'M THINKING, I'M THINKING THAT THERE'S GONNA BE, UM, AN ADMINISTRATIVE AD ON THIS, AND I'D LIKE TO GET A FEEL FOR WHAT THESE DIFFERENT OPTIONS, WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE.
ON, ON OUR, OUR GENERAL FUND BUDGET.
WE, UH, THERE, THERE WAS, SO PART OF THE, UH, PART OF THE FUNDING WAS AN ADMINISTRATIVE COST.
I'D HAVE TO GO LOOK AND SEE EXACTLY WHAT THAT WAS.
UM, OF COURSE, IF WE'RE LOOKING AT IT FROM A INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED STANDPOINT, THAT MAKES IT, AND THEN ESPECIALLY IF YOU GET INTO THE CREDIT PROGRAM, AND THEN THAT'S THAT MUCH MORE, UM, WE DID, UH, WE HAD A COUPLE OF CONVERSATIONS WITH RACHEL AND DEPARTMENT OF DEVELOPMENT AS PART OF THE PERMITTING PROCESS.
NOW THEY'RE ACTUALLY COLLECTING SOME OF THE INFORMATION THAT WE NEED ON THE RE ESPECIALLY ON THE RESIDENTIAL SIDE.
SO IF WE DO THIS HYBRID MODEL THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT, IT'S GONNA BE VERY EASY TO DROP THEM INTO A TIER BECAUSE THEY JUST, WE JUST NEED TO BE WITHIN A COUPLE HUNDRED ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.
IF, IF WE GO TO OPTION THREE, THEN, THEN THERE'S GONNA BE SIGNIFICANT ONGOING COST BECAUSE THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE AN EXACT NUMBER EVERY SINGLE TIME AND NOT PUT SOMEBODY IN A, IN A A SPOT.
DO YOU THINK YOU'RE GONNA BE ABLE TO DO OPTION TWO WITHOUT ADDING STAFF? WELL, SO THE, IT, IT WAS GONNA BE A, UM, WE WOULD HAVE, UM, CONTRACTED.
UH, PEOPLE CONTRACTED TO US TO, TO DO THIS.
I THINK LARRY'S GOT, I MEAN, ARE WE DOING MOTIONS? WE'RE NOT DOING MOTIONS.
I CAN'T, I MEAN, I, I'LL SECOND, I'LL SECOND.
BUT I'M KNOW WE'RE DOING THAT THE STAND BY MOTION.
IT'S WITHOUT A DOLLAR AMOUNT CALCULATION OF THE TOTAL, WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO GENERATE.
WE, IF YOU RECALL LAST SESSION, UH, WE WERE THE ONLY VOTE AGAINST THE 6.5 BECAUSE WE DIDN'T THINK IT WAS ENOUGH.
WE BELIEVE THERE NEEDS TO BE APPRECIABLE CHANGE, AND WE NEED, PEOPLE NEED TO SEE THE CHANGE TO BEGIN WITH THIS EDUCATION PROCESS TO MOVE FORWARD AND ACCEPT THAT STORM WATER MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS ARE GONNA BE PART OF OUR LIVES FOREVER.
SO WE AGREE WITH THIS WITHOUT THE AMOUNT OR 500 SQUARE FEET THAT DETERMINES THAT, THAT THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO, THAT THAT'S MOTION.
AND IF THIS, IF THIS, IF THE MAYOR EXTENDS OUR OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE COMMENTS AND WE GO AND START LOOKING AT PROJECTS THAT ARE IN FRED'S WHEELHOUSE, THEN THOSE THINGS COULD POTENTIALLY BE BONDED.
BUT I DON'T THINK THIS FEE ALONE IS GONNA BE ENOUGH TO BOND, TO DO THE KIND OF STUFF WE NEED TO GET DONE.
BUT IT, IT, IT IS, I THINK IT'S ONE COMPONENT, PART OF A BIGGER PACKAGE.
I I, I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU ACTUALLY.
WHAT IN, FROM MY VIEWPOINT, WHAT Y'ALL ARE VOTING ON HERE IS ACTUALLY THE STRUCTURE, NOT THE DOLLAR FIGURE.
YOU VOTED ON A DOLLAR FIGURE ON THE LAST ONE, AND RIGHT NOW IT SITS AT SIX, $6.5 MILLION.
IF THAT EV, IF THAT GETS CHANGES OR THE, OR, OR THE, THE DOLLAR FIGURE THAT'S NEEDED GETS CHANGES, THEN WE'LL JUST GO BACK TO THIS STRUCTURE AND YOU'LL RESTRUCTURE THE RATES.
SO TO ME, YOU'RE RIGHT, RIGHT NOW, WE'RE NOT ASKING TO, TO BID ON THE RATES ITSELF BECAUSE THAT GOES WITH NUMBER ONE.
OR IF IT COMES BACK AND YOU CHANGE NUMBER ONE, THIS IS JUST THE STRUCTURE AS YOU SAID, THIS IS, DO WE WANT, DO YOU, WHEN WHATEVER RATE IT IS, WHATEVER AMOUNT WE ARE TRYING TO GET, WELL, DO YOU WANT ONE, TWO, OR THREE? AND YOU'RE, YOU'RE GOING WITH THE HYBRID.
I THINK THIS IS JUST A STRUCTURE THAT'S ALL WE ARE REALLY ASKING FOR AND THAT THIS COMMITTEE HAS PREVIOUSLY VOTED TO SAY THE 6.5 IS WHAT WE DETERMINED IS KIND OF THE MINIMAL LEVEL ON THIS PART.
BUT I WANT US TO HAVE A BIGGER ROLE IN LOOKING AT OTHER STORMWATER YEP.
THINGS THAT ARE IN FRED'S WHEELHOUSE.
UM, AND THEN YOU JUST, YOU JUST STATED THAT MY MAIN QUESTION WAS YOU'RE NOT ONLY LOOKING
[01:00:01]
FOR QUALITY, WATER QUALITY AND MS FOUR COMPLIANCE ISSUES, BUT ALSO LOOKING TO CAPITAL PROJECTS IN THE STORMWATER, SPECIFICALLY CAPITAL PROJECTS IN THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN.AND, AND BECAUSE I THINK, UH, UH, DWIGHT, I THINK THAT THE PUBLIC COULD UNDERSTAND, UH, A POTENTIAL PROPERTY TAX AS WELL AS A FEE LIKE THIS.
AND, BUT THE PAIN LEVEL, Y'ALL HAVE TO ADJUST THE PAIN LEVEL OF WHAT PEOPLE WOULD BE WILLING TO GO THROUGH.
AND I THINK IF THEY SAW A NUMBER OF PROJECTS, AND IT, I THINK THAT'S THE REASON WHY THE GREEN GREEN LIGHT PROGRAM WAS A SUCCESS BECAUSE THEY SAW A LIST, THEY KNEW WHAT WAS GONNA GET DONE, AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE TO DO.
MY, MY, AND WE'RE NOT DOING THIS, SO THERE'S NOT A CONCERN, BUT MY CONCERN WITH IF, IF WE WERE TO SET A, AN ADDITIONAL DOLLAR AMOUNT IS IF I DON'T KNOW WHAT CAPITAL PROJECTS WE'RE LOOKING AT, I DON'T KNOW IF I'M SUPPORTIVE OF IT.
YOU KNOW, AS A COUNCIL PERSON.
UM, SO I THINK THAT'S A, A, A GOOD WAY TO GO ABOUT IT.
AND, UM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR MOTION.
SO WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND.
ARE THERE ANY, UH, OPPOSED? I, I JUST DIDN'T THINK WE HAD ENOUGH DISCUSSION, REALLY.
UM, AND SO I'M NOT QUITE SURE HOW TO DO THAT, BUT I LIKE WHY ONE VERSUS TWO OR TWO VERSUS ONE, UH, I'M NOT QUITE SURE HOW TO GO ABOUT THAT.
'CAUSE TWO, ADD THE ADDITIONAL ADMINISTRATIVE BURDEN OF DETERMINING WHETHER SOMETHING'S RESIDENTIAL OR NON-RESIDENTIAL.
I I MEAN THAT'S THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ONE AND TWO, RIGHT? YEAH.
IF IT'S, AND I WOULD LOOK THERE, THERE'S AN ADMINISTRATIVE BURDEN, BUT I THINK THAT I, I, I WOULD, I I THINK I WOULD ASK THAT YOU, YOU LIMIT THAT PORTION OF IT ON, ON OUR END.
UM, I, I, ADAM, I, I THINK WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE BENEFIT OF TWO OVER ONE? SO I, WELL, GO AHEAD.
SPECIFICALLY ON RESIDENTIAL VERSUS COMMERCIAL, BUT WE, WE CAN ACCOMPLISH THAT PRETTY EASILY THROUGH OUR ZONING MAPS.
UM, AGAIN, DIGITIZED THROUGH OUR GI I S SYSTEM.
SO I, I THINK THAT ISSUE IS DONE.
I MEAN, TWO VERSUS ONE, OR, I, I WOULD, I, I GUESS I'M GONNA ASK LARRY, WHAT WAS HIS REASON FOR, UM, LET ME ADDRESS WHAT I THINK IT IS.
NOW I'M PUTTING A POLITICAL HAT ON.
TEARS WORK, WELL, I THINK FOR RESIDENTIAL, BUT THERE'S GOING TO BE A COMMON THOUGHT BY RESIDENTS IN BATON ROUGE THAT BUSINESS IS GETTING A FREE RIDE.
SOMEHOW THAT'S GONNA BE THEIR THOUGHT PROCESS.
AND, AND, BECAUSE NOW YOU'RE CALCULATING IT BASED UPON NOT, I DON'T WANT THEM TO BE IN TEARS.
I WANT THEM TO BE CALCULATED FOR EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE.
AND THAT WAY IT ELIMINATES IN MY MIND, THE POLITICAL COMPLAINT THAT YOU WOULD HAVE ABOUT RESIDENTIAL PEOPLE IS THAT BUSINESS IS GETTING A FREE RIDE.
UH, WHEN YOU LOOK OVER THE, THE, THE, UH, HANDOUT THAT THEY PREVIOUSLY SENT, THEY SAID THIS WAS MODERATE, UH, ADDITIONAL EFFORT AS OPPOSED TO THE TIER, UH, THE TIER ONE, UH, OPTION ONE, I SAID, BUT THAT WAS MY THOUGHT PROCESS.
IT MAKES BUSINESS BE SPECIFIC AND CALCULABLE AND RESIDENTIAL IN, IN, UM, IN THE INDIVIDUAL TEARS.
AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS A, A FAIR WAY TO DO IT.
I AGREE WITH WHAT LARRY'S SAYING.
AND COREY, UM, I MEAN, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, WE'VE DONE, WE, THE STORM WATER COALITION TEAM HAS DONE A LOT OF RESEARCH AND TALKED TO EXPERTS ALL AROUND THE COUNTRY.
WE EVEN HELD A SUMMIT LAST, I CAN'T SEE YOU,
WE HELD A SUMMIT, UH, LAST NOVEMBER, BROUGHT IN EXPERTS, HAD THE EXPERTS CALL IN FROM AROUND THE COUNTRY.
WE HAD THE STORMWATER MANAGER FROM THE OLD, FROM TALLAHASSEE.
THE OLDEST STORMWATER MANAGEMENT PROGRAM IN THE COUNTRY WAS ON IT.
AND WHAT WE'VE SEEN IN MANY OF THOSE COMMUNITIES IS THE HYBRID SYSTEM THAT WORKS.
AND THAT'S WHY WE ARE SUPPORTING TOO.
OPTION TWO, THE HYBRID, IF THAT HELPS.
BUT WE'RE GLAD TO SEND YOU THOSE RESOURCES OR LINKS.
UM, I THINK SOME OF YOUR PEOPLE ATTENDED OUR STORMWATER SUMMIT.
BUT WE CAN SEND YOU THE LINK TO JODY CAHOON AND HIS TALK AND HIS PRESENTATION, OR CONNECT YOU WITH HIM AND OTHERS AROUND THE COUNTRY AND PROBABLY KNOWS ALL THESE PEOPLE.
I'VE GOT A QUESTION FOR PROBLEM.
IN YOUR, UH, NATIONWIDE EXPERIENCE, HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH LARGE INDUSTRIAL PROPERTIES LIKE EXXON, WHICH PROBABLY HAVE AN INDIVIDUAL POINT SOURCE
[01:05:01]
PERMIT WITH D E Q, WITH REQUIREMENTS FOR TREATMENT AND DISCHARGE TO A SPECIFIC POINT? HOW DO YOU HANDLE THEM IN, IN STORMWATER MANAGEMENT FOR THE, UH, MUNICIPALITY THAT THEY'RE IN? UH, AGAIN, IT, IT TYPICALLY WHAT UTILITIES DO IS THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, IF THEY HAVE, UH, EVEN AN INDIVIDUAL PERMIT, N P D S PERMIT, DISCHARGE PERMIT, THEN SOME UTILITIES CONSIDER THEM, GIVE THEM A SMALL MODEST CREDIT FOR BEING IN COMPLIANCE WITH THAT.HOWEVER, REALLY, IN TERMS OF ALL OF THE RUNOFF, AGAIN, THERE, THERE ARE TWO WAYS THEY CAN, THEY CAN DO THAT.
ONE IS IF THEY QUALIFY FOR A CREDIT PROGRAM THAT IS DEFINED BY UTILITY, THEN THEY QUALIFY FOR THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
AND THAT'S WHERE WE TALKED ABOUT THE DIFFERENT TYPES OF CREDIT.
THEY SOMETIMES YOU COULD DEFINE A SMALL N P D S CREDIT FOR THEIR SPECIFIC DISCHARGE PERMIT IF THEY'RE IN COMPLIANCE, AND THEN THE QUANTITY QUALITY CREDIT THAT IS DEFINED.
SO FOR EXAMPLE, I'LL GIVE YOU ANOTHER LARGE PROPERTY HERE.
NOW, FOR EXAMPLE, IN A PLACE LIKE PHILADELPHIA, THEY HAVE A VERY LARGE AIRPORT.
A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF THE PHILADELPHIA AIRPORT COMES UNDER THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA, AND A SMALL PORTION OF THE PHILADELPHIA AIRPORT COMES OUTSIDE THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA.
PHILADELPHIA AIRPORT HAS TO PAY THE STORMWATER CHARGES FOR THE AIRPORT.
SO, SO THAT IS HOW IT IS REALLY DONE.
IT IS EITHER HANDLED THROUGH, IF THEY QUALIFY FOR A CREDIT, IF THERE IS A CREDIT PROGRAM, THEN THEY COME UNDER THAT, INCLUDING POTENTIAL, UH, YOU KNOW, N P D S PERMIT CREDIT.
SECONDLY, IF THEY HAVE SOMETHING SUBSTANTIVE ON THE PROPERTY WHERE IT ACTUALLY QUALIFIES THEM FOR IMPERVIOUS AREA REDUCTION, LET'S SAY FOR EXAMPLE, THEY HAVE A WHOLE PARKING LOT THAT IS COMPLETELY A POROUS, UH, KIND OF A PARKING LOT.
THEN THE IMPERVIOUS AREA ITSELF, THEY CAN COME UNDER THE PILLS PROGRAM CALLED THE IMPIOUS AREA REDUCTION, AND THEY COULD HAVE A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT IMPERVIOUS AREA CONSIDERING THAT THAT PARTICULAR AREA IS NOT REALLY, IS REALLY ACTING PERUS.
SO OTHER THAN THESE TWO, IT'S NOT LIKE THERE IS SOME EXEMPTION OR ANYTHING FOR INDUSTRIAL.
UM, AN AND AN AND I RECENTLY WORKED FOR A COMMUNITY THAT ACTUALLY HAD A STRONG WATER CHARGE PASSED BY THE, BY THE COM COMMISSION IN THE MIDWEST.
THEY HAVE A HUGE SPEEDWAY, AND THAT SPEEDWAY IS PREDOMINANTLY IMPERVIOUS, AND THEY DO HAVE TO PAY THE STORMWATER CHARGE.
THEY DID AS A STAKEHOLDER, THEY PARTICIPATED IN THE STAKEHOLDER COMMITTEE, LIKE, LIKE YOU'RE ALL HAVING, THEY WERE ONE OF THE STAKEHOLDERS.
THEY HAD INDIVIDUAL DISCUSSIONS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, EVERYBODY AGREED THAT IS ONLY FAIR BECAUSE IF THEY DON'T PAY THEIR FAIR, FAIR SHARE, SOMEBODY ELSE IS PAYING THAT FAIR SHARE.
AND TYPICALLY IT ENDS UP BEING THE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES.
DO YOU KNOW, DO YOU KNOW IF EXXON'S M P D S PERMIT DISCHARGES TO THE, UH, PARISH OR TO THE RIVER? I, I WOULDN'T KNOW THAT THOUGH.
IT GOES DIRECTLY TO THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER.
DOES THAT, DOES THAT PUT IT OUT OF THE, UM, SAY THE AUTHORITY OF THE PARISH TO CONTROL IT IN THAT IT'S A, A MULTI, MULTI-STATE DISCHARGE FROM, FROM A MS FOUR PERSPECTIVE? YES.
THE, THE MS THE, THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER IS NOT IN THAT, BUT THE, AND THAT, THAT'S THE, WHERE WE GET INTO ALL OF THIS, BUT IT'S STILL PART OF THE, THE AREA THAT THE MS FOUR, THE, THE PLANT ITSELF, IT STILL FALLS WITHIN THE MS. BUT, BUT IF THERE RUNOFF IS GOING TREATED TO THE RIVER, HOW DOES IT AFFECT, UH, SAY THE BAYOU IN THE PARISH AND THAT THAT'S, AND THAT'S THE SAME CASE THAT, UH, SOUTHERN UNIVERSITY'S GONNA MAKE WITH, UH, A LOT OF THEIR RUNOFF AS WELL.
I DON'T DUNNO,
IF YOU HAVE A PRE-TREATMENT PERMIT THAT'S DIFFERENT, THAT GOES TO THE CITY PARISH THROUGH PRE-TREATMENT PROGRAM TO A P O T W.
AND THAT'S WHERE YOU DO HAVE JURISDICTION.
BUT BUT YOU DON'T, FOR AN N P D S CITY PARISH HAS NO, NO JURISDICTION, AND THAT'S WATER QUALITY.
AND WE, AND EXXON IN PARTICULAR DOES NOT HAVE A PRETREATMENT PER PERMIT.
SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO COLLECT ANY MONEY FROM THEM FOR THIS PROGRAM? OR IS THAT, WHAT ARE WE SAYING THE WAY, ARE WE GONNA SAY THEY'RE GONNA FIGHT IT? WHAT ARE WE SAYING RIGHT HERE? NO, I, I I THINK WHAT HE'S SAYING IS NOT FOR THE N P D S MM-HMM.
I THINK YOU STILL CAN COLLECT AND DEAL WITH THOSE, BUT NOT FOR THE N P D S PERMIT, BECAUSE THERE'S NO JURISDICTION PARKING LOTS AND CITY PARISH HAS YEAH.
[01:10:01]
THAT.AND, AND I THINK WE, WE BROUGHT THIS UP IN THE, IN THE PAST, IS THAT OKAY, THEIR YES, THEIR, THEIR PLANT MAY GO DIRECTLY TO THE MS FOUR.
BUT THE, THE ROAD THAT'S RIGHT OUTSIDE OF THEIR, THEIR PLANT GOES TO THE DITCH, WHICH GOES THE EMPLOYEES USE TO, TO GET TO WORK.
AND ALL THE ROADS THAT THE, THEY USE, ALL THE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT IS USED FOR THAT PLANT TO OPERATE FALLS WITHIN THE MS FOUR.
SO THEY ARE STILL PART OF THIS PROCESS NOW.
SO I THINK, AND A LOT OF WHAT Y'ALL ARE TALKING ABOUT NEXT IS, OR RIGHT NOW, IS THE, THE NEXT TOPIC IS ARE WE GOING TO HAVE A CREDIT PROGRAM? AND THAT'S WHERE WE GET INTO ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT WE HAD WAS, AND I, I KNOW HOW A HANDFUL OF MEMBERS ARE GONNA VOTE, UM, I CAN MAKE A MOTION
UM, BUT THAT ONE OF THE, UM, ONE OF THE POTENTIAL CREDITS THAT WE BROUGHT WAS WHETHER OR NOT A, AN OWNER HAD AN L P D E S PERMIT THAT WAS, WAS IN COMPLIANCE, AND THAT WAS THAT, THAT'S ONE WAY TO ADDRESS THAT TYPE OF THING.
NOW, IT'S NOT GONNA, IT DOESN'T MAKE THE FEE GO AWAY.
IT JUST MAKES IT, IT GIVES THEM THE, THE ABILITY TO APPLY FOR A CREDIT AT WHATEVER MAXIMUM AMOUNT THE COMMITTEE CHOOSES THAT THIS CREDIT WOULD BE IF WE HAVE A CREDIT PROGRAM.
I, I HAD A MAYBE ONE EXAMPLE TO GIVE FOR THIS EXXON SITUATION THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
AGAIN, WE ARE NOT DECIDING ANYTHING HERE TODAY, BUT JUST TO GIVE AN EXAMPLE, THERE ARE SITUATIONS LIKE THIS THAT OTHER UTILITIES HAVE DEALT WITH.
UH, IN ANOTHER CASE IT WAS NOT EXXON, IT WAS SONOCO.
UH, BUT THE KEY ALSO IS ALSO THE RECEIVING WATERS.
WHETHER THE RECEIVING WATER QUALITY IS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE JURISDICTION THAT IS HAVING A STORM WATER CHARGE, OR THAT RECEIVING WATER QUALITY IS NOT UNDER THE JURISDICTION OF THE UTILITY.
SO AGAIN, I'LL GIVE YOU PHILADELPHIA AS ONE EXAMPLE.
IT'S A DELAWARE RIVER THAT RUNS ACROSS PHILADELPHIA, ACROSS PHILADELPHIA, AND THE SAME DELAWARE RIVER THEN RUNS INTO DELAWARE, BUT IN PENNSYLVANIA.
AND THE COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA, CITY OF PHILADELPHIA IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THE WATER QUALITY OF THE DELAWARE RIVER IN THE STATE OF DELAWARE.
CITY OF WILMINGTON, WHICH IS A LARGE CITY ON THE SAME DELAWARE RIVER, JUST 20 MILES AWAY.
THE DELAWARE CITY OF WILMINGTON IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE WATER QUALITY IN THE SAME RIVER.
SO YOU DO SEE THESE KINDS OF DIFFERENCES.
AND SO IN PHILADELPHIA, THEY MADE SOME VERY SPECIFIC, UM, CREDITS THAT THEY CREATED, UH, TO ADDRESS SOME UNIQUE SITUATIONS LIKE THIS.
AND SO IF YOU LOOK AT A PHILADELPHIA CREDIT PROGRAM, IT'S NOT VERY COMMON WITH, UH, OTHER CREDIT PROGRAMS BECAUSE IF THERE ARE VERY UNIQUE, EXTRANEOUS SITUATIONS LIKE THIS THAT CAN BE ADDRESSED, IT CAN BE LOOKED AT IN THE FORM OF A CREDIT PROGRAM, NOT JUST ONLY THE N P D S CREDIT, BUT IN PHILADELPHIA, I'M NOT SAYING ANYTHING THAT IS NOT PUBLIC.
IN PHILADELPHIA, THEY HAVE SOMETHING CALLED A DIRECT SERVICE DISCHARGE CREDIT BECAUSE OF SOME SPECIFIC SITUATIONS THAT THEY HAD TO HANDLE.
BUT THE IDEA IS THAT IT IS NOT DONE CASE BY CASE FOR JUST TO ADDRESS ONE PARCEL OR ANOTHER PARCEL.
THAT'S NOT HOW A CREDIT PROGRAM SHOULD WORK.
IT SHOULD STILL WORK FOR A PARTICULAR CIRCUMSTANCE.
IF THAT, IF THERE ARE SEVERAL PARCELS THAT MEET THAT CIRCUMSTANCE, THEN THOSE PARCELS WILL BE ELIGIBLE FOR THAT CREDIT SO THAT IT'S NOT JUST A CASE BY CASE, UH, DEVELOPMENT OF A CREDIT PROGRAM.
LARRY, I WANTED TO KNOW IF YOU WERE GONNA AMEND YOUR MOTION BASED ON JUST VOTING ON JUST THE STRUCTURE NOW, SINCE WE WEREN'T TALKING ABOUT THE DOLLAR AMOUNT.
NO, THAT'S ALL MY MOTION TRUCTURE.
WE VOTED ON THE TOTAL DOLLAR AMOUNT OF THE NEED FOR WHAT ADAM NEEDS FOR THE TWO, TWO MEETINGS TO GO.
AND THAT THIS IS JUST THE METHODOLOGY WE'RE GOING TO USE AT WHATEVER NUMBER WE DECIDE TO USE.
BUT WE KNOW INITIALLY HOW MUCH IT GENERATES.
AND I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO GENERATE MORE, UM, THAT COULD BE USED AND BE BONDED AND COULD BE USED FOR THE STORMWATER PROGRAM.
AND HOPEFULLY THE MAYOR WILL CONTINUE THIS OR THIS GROUP AND WE CAN START LOOKING AT THINGS THAT, UM, COULD BE A LISTING OF PROJECTS.
THAT WAS MY, KAREN, MAY I ASK A QUESTION BASED ON HIS INPUT? I DIDN'T WANT TO INTERRUPT YOU.
[01:15:01]
ON THAT, AND ADAM, THAT MAYBE THIS IS HALFWAY DIRECTED TO YOU, WILL IT BE FOR THIS COMMITTEE TO ULTIMATELY DECIDE ON THE NUMBER FOR THE LEVEL OF SERVICE? WE DECIDED, WE DECIDED FOR TWO YEARS.WE'VE DECIDED 6.5 MILLION FOR THE NEXT TWO YEARS, WHICH IN MY MIND WAS BUYING SOME TIME.
BUT IS THIS COMMITTEE GONNA DECIDE WHETHER GOING FORWARD IT'S 10, 15, 20 OR BEYOND? IS THAT THIS COMMITTEE? OR IS THIS COMMITTEE SAYING WE'RE TELLING YOU THE FUNDING STRUCTURE THAT WE THINK IS PREFERRED NOW YOU GUYS GO OUT AND TELL THE PUBLIC WHAT YOU NEED OR WHAT PROJECTS YOU COULD SUCCESSFULLY GET, AND YOU SELL THE PUBLIC THAT IT'S GONNA BE, HERE'S WHAT YOU WOULD PAY FOR 5, 10, 15, AND THEN ADMINISTRATION DECIDE WHAT THAT NUMBER'S GONNA BE.
DID THAT VERY WINDING TRAIN OF THOUGHT MAKE SENSE? MM-HMM.
UH, COMING UP WITH A LEVEL OF SERVICE DOLLAR AMOUNT.
BUT WE DON'T NECESSARILY NEED TO DO THAT TODAY.
I DO WANNA FOLLOW UP ON, ON, ON LARRY'S, UH, PREMISE THAT INDIVIDUALLY CHARGING BUSINESSES IS A WAY TO NOT LET THEM OFF THE HOOK, BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE THE INFORMATION YOU SHOWED US WHEN IT'S INDIVIDUALLY CHARGED SEEMED LIKE THE AMOUNT GOES DOWN VERSUS A TIERED STRUCTURE.
SO I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND A DISTINCTION BETWEEN RESIDENTIAL AND NON-RESIDENTIAL, BUT IF THE IDEA IS WE'RE GONNA CHARGE BUSINESSES MORE, I DON'T KNOW IF WE ACCOMPLISH THAT BY INDIVIDUALLY CHARGING THEM.
LET ME UNFORTUNATELY CAN BRING THAT, UH, SLIDE BACK UP.
UM, SO LET ME EXPLAIN THAT CONFUSION PROBABLY THAT YOU ALL HAVE.
SO, UM, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER YOU ALL HAVE YOUR PAPER THAT WE HAD GIVEN THAT FUNDING STRUCTURE PAPER.
SO IF YOU LOOK IN THAT PAPER, SO I KNOW SOME OF YOU MAY HAVE THAT PAPER.
SO LET ME EXPLAIN WHAT HAPPENS.
SO HOW, HOW DO WE COME UP THE, THE FUNDAMENTAL THING IS THAT FOR, REGARDLESS OF THE FUNDING STRUCTURE, WHETHER IT IS OPTION ONE, OPTION TWO, OR OPTION THREE, THE FUNDAMENTAL THING IS THAT DEPENDING ON THE STRUCTURE WE USE, WE FIRST COME UP WITH WHAT IS CALLED A SYSTEM WIDE UNIT RATE.
THAT ANA WALKED YOU THROUGH THAT BASICALLY WE HAD THAT 2020 6 CENTS, 25 CENTS, YOU SAW THAT 25 CENTS, 26 CENTS, THAT IS A KEY.
SO HOW DO YOU COME UP WITH THAT UNIT RATE? WE CAME UP WITH THAT BECAUSE WE ARE CALCULATING THE BILLING UNITS FOR THE ENTIRE SYSTEM, CITY PARISH FOR ALL THE PARCELS.
THE TOTAL BILLING UNITS THAT WE CALCULATE IS GONNA VARY DEPENDING ON THE FUNDING STRUCTURE.
SO IF WE STAY WITH OPTION THREE WHERE IT IS INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED FOR EVERY PARCEL, THEN THE SYSTEMWIDE TOTAL BILLING UNITS IS GOING TO BE THE HIGHEST BECAUSE EVERY PARCEL, WE ARE TAKING THAT IMPERVIOUS AREA, DIVIDING IT BY 500 SQUARE FEET.
AND WE ARE CALCULATING THE BILLING UNITS.
SO EVERY PARCEL HAS THE BENEFIT OF GIVING THE BILLING UNITS, OKAY? THAT WILL HAVE THE HIGHEST BILLING UNIT, THEREFORE LOWEST SYSTEMWIDE UNIT RATE.
SO THAT 25 CENTS IS THEN GONNA BE APPLIED TO, LET, LET'S SAY A PROPERTY HAS 500,000 SQUARE FEET OF IMPERVIOUS AREA.
THAT 25 CENTS IS GONNA BE APPLIED TO THAT 500,000 SQUARE FEET.
YOU'RE GONNA DIVIDE IT BY 500, GET THE BILLING UNITS MULTIPLIED BY 25 CENTS.
SO IN THAT CONTEXT, THAT WHILE THE UNIT RATE IS THE LOWEST, THAT INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY IS GONNA PAY A HIGHER CHARGE RELATIVE TO, LET'S TAKE OPTION ONE.
IN OPTION ONE, YOU'RE TAKING EVERYBODY LESS THAN 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET AND PUTTING THEM INTO TIERS.
WHEN YOU PUT PEOPLE INTO TIERS, WHAT HAPPENS, THE TOTAL BILLING UNITS AS A SYSTEM WIDE IS GONNA COME DOWN.
THAT'LL BE THE LOWEST FOR THE ENTIRE, THAT, THAT'S WHAT WE ARE SHOWING HERE.
THAT THE TOTAL NUMBER OF BILLING UNITS FOR THE ENTIRE SYSTEM IS ACTUALLY LOWER UNDER OPTION ONE.
IF YOU LOOK AT THAT, WE ARE CALCULATING A 2.23 MILLION BILLING UNITS.
AND SO WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU HAVE THE LOWEST AMOUNT OF BILLING UNITS, THEN YOUR SYSTEM WIDE RATE IS 27 CENTS AND NOT 25 CENTS.
NOW THE 27 CENTS, IF YOU'RE APPLYING IT INDIVIDUALLY TO CALCULATE FOR EVERY PARCEL, THEN YOUR CHARGE WILL BE DIFFERENT.
BUT HERE, WHAT ARE WE DOING? WE ARE TAKING UP TO MILLION SQUARE FEET AND PUTTING THEM INTO TIERS AND PREDEFINING THE CHARGE.
AND SO THEY END UP ACTUALLY PAYING A SAME 500,000 SQUARE
[01:20:01]
FEET PROPERTY UNDER OPTION ONE ENDS UP PAYING LOWER THAN A PROPERTY UNDER OPTION THREE.SO WE HAVE TO JUST BE CAREFUL TO NOT CONFUSE THE UNIT RATE, WHICH IS THE LOWEST UNDER OPTION THREE AND HIGHEST UNDER OPTION ONE.
BUT THE FLIP SIDE IS THE INDIVIDUALLY CALCULATED CHARGE FOR A VERY, VERY LARGE PROPERTY WILL BE HIGHER IN OPTION THREE THAN AN OPTION ONE.
I'M SORRY, COUNCILMAN, YOU HAD A QUESTION? LEMME SEE IF I CAN REMEMBER WHAT IT WAS.
WHO IS ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR SETTING THE LEVEL OF SERVICE DOLLAR AMOUNT? WOULD THAT BE THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THIS COMMITTEE, OR WOULD THAT BE WHERE THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE ADMINISTRATION BASED ON OUR FUNDING STRUCTURE RECOMMENDATION? I, I THINK AS I APPRECIATED THIS COMMITTEE, IS TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE ADMINISTRATION, OF COURSE, THE ADMINISTRATION ON FUNDING STRUCTURE AND LEVEL OF SERVICE THAT ON, ON ALL OF THESE THINGS.
AND I THINK IT WAS BROUGHT UP EARLIER, I THINK LARRY MAY HAVE SAID IT ABOUT, UM, WHETHER OR NOT THIS COMMITTEE, IT WAS IN THIS COMMITTEE'S PURVIEW TO GO DOWN THE PATH OF CAPITAL PROJECTS AND THAT TYPE OF THING.
THAT IS THE, THE REASON YOU GUYS ARE ASSEMBLED IS THAT YOU ALL REPRESENT VARIOUS STAKEHOLDERS THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY.
UM, I, I THINK, YOU KNOW, JUST THE FACT THAT, HEY, IF YOU'RE GONNA DO THIS, YOU NEED TO MAKE IT A PACKAGE DEAL.
AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHY WE PUT THIS COMMITTEE TOGETHER.
SO YES, THAT IS, AND AND THAT'S WHERE WE'RE ULTIMATELY, UH, GOING WITH THIS THING, ADAM.
IF WE'RE GONNA GO DOWN THE ROUTE OF LOOKING AT CAPITAL PROJECTS UNDER THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN AS, AS AN ADJUNCT TO THIS, RIGHT? WE NEED TO HAVE A LIST OF PROJECTS AND COST FOR EACH PROJECT TO LOOK AT, TO SEE WHAT, WHAT WE'RE ACTUALLY GONNA BE FUNDING.
BEFORE WE GO INTO, INTO ACTUAL NU NUMBER O OF OF COURSE.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M, LIKE I SAID, I MET WITH FRED AND H N T B, I THINK IT, IT WAS A COUPLE OF WEEKS BACK BACK, BUT TO, TO START PREPARING FOR THAT.
BUT THE INTENT IS TO ULTIMATELY BRING THAT TO THIS COMMITTEE.
BUT WE'RE JUST, WE'RE TRYING TO GET PREPARED ON OUR END TO, TO BRING INFORMATION TO YOU GUYS.
MY SENSE IS, IF I'M READING THE ROOM CORRECTLY, THAT WE MAY BE COM WE MAY FEEL COMFORTABLE VOTING ON A FUNDING MECHANISM TODAY, BUT NOT AT A COMFORT LEVEL OF SAYING, AND THIS IS THE TOTAL LEVEL OF SERVICE DOLLAR AMOUNT.
AND THAT'S WHERE YOU ARE AS WELL.
THAT WE, WE ARE ALL, WE'RE JUST TRYING TO, UM, UH, AGAIN, WE, WE STARTED OUT, WE PRESENTED ALL THESE OPTIONS MM-HMM.
SO NOW WE'RE, WE'RE COMING TO A CONCLUSION.
ALL RIGHT, NOW WE'RE GONNA DO OPTION TWO, I THINK.
SO THEN THAT ALLOWS THAT WAY WHEN YOU SAY, ALL RIGHT, IF WE DO THESE CAPITAL PROJECTS, THEN WE JUST, WE, AND THEN WE FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT BONDING'S GONNA BE OR WHATEVER.
AND WE TAKE OPTION TWO AND WE TELL YOU WHAT THAT, UH, COST IS FOR THE DIFFERENT TIERS, AND THEN WE'RE DONE.
SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE ASKING TO MAKE SOME OF THESE DECISIONS UPFRONT SO THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO PROVIDE 12 DIFFERENT OPTIONS ON FUNDING WHENEVER WE TALK ABOUT A DOLLAR AMOUNT.
SO ANY, ANYONE IN OPPOSITION? WELL, DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT IT WAS, LARRY? ARE YOU ABLE TO,
MY MOTION WAS TO ACCEPT OPTION TWO, WHICH IS THE MODIFIED HYBRID, EXCUSE ME.
UM, WITHOUT A CALCULATION AS TO A SPECIFIC, UM, SERVICE, SERVICE LEVEL, WHICH WE'VE ALREADY DECIDED THAT, BUT IT DOES NOT INCLUDE WHAT IS THE, UM, DENOMINATOR OF THAT CALCULATION.
SO GOING ALONG WITH THE CAR THEME, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A HYBRID.
AND IT MIGHT BE A VOLKSWAGEN OR IT MIGHT BE A CHEVROLET, RIGHT?
[01:25:01]
IT WILL DO WHAT? IT WILL DO WHAT ADAM, I'M TEA IS HAZARDOUS.AND HOPEFULLY, AND I WANT TO MAKE YOU LAUGH, LARRY, PLEASE LAUGH.
OPTION TWO IS THE PREFERRED FUNDING STRUCTURE OF THIS COMMITTEE.
I'M, THERE'S SOME ORGANIZATIONS THAT MAY STILL HAVE SOME QUESTIONS AND I DON'T WANT THEM TO FEEL LIKE WE'RE RUSHING THROUGH THIS 'CAUSE THIS IS REAL MONEY TO THESE GROUPS.
DO WE WANNA MAKE THAT DECISION NOW? DO YOU WANT SOME TIME TO CONTEMPLATE THIS? WHAT ORGANIZATION? PEOPLE THAT ARE NOT HERE TODAY? IS THAT WHAT YOU MEAN? I MEAN, L SS U I MEAN, WHAT, OKAY.
PEOPLE THAT ARE NOT IN THIS ROOM TODAY GOT GOT SOME ORGANIZATIONS THAT HAVE A LOT OF STAKE IN THIS GAME.
AND, UH, I'M, I JUST, 'CAUSE I LIKE TO TALK ON THE MICROPHONE.
I'M SEEING IT WHAT THE THOUGHTS ARE.
I THINK IF IT WAS THAT IMPORTANT, THEY WOULD'VE SENT A REPRESENTATIVE.
I MEAN, NOT NOT THAT IMPORTANT, THAT IMPORTANT TO THEM.
I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG YOU HOLD SOMETHING UP.
UH, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WHETHER IT'S ONE, TWO, OR THREE, IT IS GOING TO BE A, A SUBSTANTIAL BURDEN POTENTIALLY ON PEOPLE LIKE BRE, L S U SOUTHERN AND, AND B R C C.
THAT I THINK EVERYBODY, I THINK EVERYBODY ON THIS COMMITTEE WANTS TO DO ONE OF THE THREE.
AND WE MAY WANT TO COME AND MAKE A MODIFICATION TO SOME DEGREE, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO, WE NEED, WE HAVE SOME DEADLINES WE NOW NEED TO GET TO, AND I THINK WE NEED TO MOVE THE BALL DOWN THE FIELD ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
JUST, JUST FOLLOWING UP ON COUNCILMAN GOD'S, UM, COMMENTS.
AND SO THE, THE CALCULATIONS YOU SENT OUT EARLIER THIS WEEK, DID THOSE CONSIDER CREDITS? I I, I, I DIDN'T GO THROUGH THE DETAIL, BUT, SO THE OPTION THREE WHERE WE PRESENTED THE BILLING UNITS, IT'S ACTUALLY ON THE SCREEN.
OPTION THREE, THAT 2.19 MILLION BILLING UNITS DID RECOGNIZE POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN UNITS BECAUSE OF CREDITS.
SO THAT 25 CENTS DOES RECOGNIZE POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN UNITS BECAUSE OF CREDITS OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO, WE HAVE NOT INTEGRATED POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN CREDITS YET.
UH, FOR OUR PROPERTIES IN OPTION ONE, ALL PROPERTIES GREATER THAN 1 MILLION SQUARE FEET COULD, COULD HAVE APPLICABILITY FOR CREDITS.
SO ANY POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN CREDITS FOR THAT OR AN OPTION TO WHERE ALL NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES WOULD HAVE SOME POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN CREDITS? WE HAVE NOT CONSIDERED THAT, BUT WE CAN RUN THAT SCENARIO AND WE CAN SEND IT BACK.
UM, SO THAT WE CAN, AT THE MOST, THE 26 CENTS MIGHT SLIGHTLY CHANGE, RIGHT? UH, THE 26 CENTS MAY BECOME 27 CENTS AND THE 27 CENTS MAY BECOME 28 CENTS.
SO WE CAN SEND THAT BACK TO YOU SO THAT ALL THREE WILL HAVE A RECOGNITION IN THE UNIT RATE FOR THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
AND, AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED THAT TO MAKE A DECISION.
I GUESS WILL THERE STILL BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DISCUSS CREDITS EVEN IF WE MOVE FORWARD WITH OPTION TWO TODAY? AGAIN, THE LAST MEETING, WHAT WE DID WAS TO PRESENT THE DIFFERENT TYPES OF CREDITS, BUT EXACTLY WHAT THE CREDITS WILL BE, EXACTLY WHAT THE MAGNITUDE OF CREDITS WILL BE.
THAT'S SOMETHING I WANNA COMMENT ON.
SO I GUESS WE PRESENTED FIVE CREDITS AT THE, THE LAST MEETING AND THEY WERE, THERE WAS A CREDIT, IF YOU, UH, RETAINED MORE THAN WHAT IS REQUIRED, IF YOU TREATED BEYOND WHAT IS REQUIRED.
THERE WAS A, A RATIO CREDIT, WHICH KIND OF, UH, THAT ADDRESSED SOME OF THE RURAL PROPERTIES WHERE IF YOU HAD A, A HOUSE IN THE MIDDLE OF FIVE ACRES.
THERE WAS AN EDUCATION CREDIT AND THEN THERE WAS AN L P D E SS CREDIT.
SO THOSE WERE THE ONES THAT WE, UH, THOSE WERE THE FIVE THAT WE PRESENTED.
SO THE, THE NEXT QUESTION THAT WAS GOING TO BE ASKED WAS, UM, I GUESS NUMBER ONE, DOES THE COMMITTEE AGREE THAT WE SHOULD CONTINUE TALKING ABOUT A CREDIT PROGRAM? AND THEN NUMBER TWO,
[01:30:01]
DO YOU WANT ALL FIVE OF THESE? DO YOU WANT THREE OF THESE? JUST WHATEVER, WHATEVER IT IS.AND THEN WE WOULD HAVE TO THEN TAKE THAT BACK AND FIGURE OUT, OKAY, UM, HOW MANY PEOPLE WOULD REALISTICALLY FALL IN THESE VARIOUS CREDIT? OKAY.
AND THEN WE WOULD ADJUST ACCORDINGLY FROM THERE.
AND THEN LIKE PRO, ULTIMATELY WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN IS, IS THAT IT'S GONNA MAKE THE FEE THAT YOU GOTTA RECOUP THAT COST.
'CAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'VE GOT A NUMBER THAT WE HAVE TO GET TO.
SO IF, IF THESE, THIS GROUP OF FOLKS PAYS MORE, WELL THEN WE GOTTA, WE GOTTA RECOUP IT WITH THE OTHER, UH, THROUGH THE OTHER BILLING UNIT.
GUESS SO, I MEAN, I, I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT CREDITS MORE, UH, IN, IN MORE DETAIL.
AND WE CAN TIME, BUT WE CAN I, IS THAT SOMETHING Y'ALL LIKE TO DO NOW OR IS THAT, THAT THE AGENDA FOR THE NEXT MEETING? HOW DO YOU MAYBE WE START WITH SHARING WITH, I'M SORRY, WHAT IS YOUR NAME? HI, DIANE
UM, DIANE, BECAUSE YOU, IT WAS DISCUSSED PRETTY THOROUGHLY LAST TIME.
MAYBE WE COULD SHARE WITH HER SO SHE CAN, YOU KNOW, SEE WHAT WE'VE DISCUSSED IN THE PAST.
ON THE FURTHER DISCUSSION OF CREDITS MM-HMM.
UM, AND I WOULD SAY THAT, UM, YES, I THINK IT WOULD BE IMPORTANT FOR SOMEONE TO CONSIDER HOW THAT MIGHT IMPACT THAT TOTAL NUMBER.
AND, AND THAT WOULD CERTAINLY BE SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK TO YOU WITH.
BUT AGAIN, THE, UM, SO THE FIRST ONE WAS THE ABSOLUTELY
AND WE DO, I'M SORRY, I GOT TOO MANY HIRINGS IN THE FIRE RIGHT NOW.
UM, WE HAVE COFFEE AND WE HAVE WATER, BUT YES.
LET, LET'S TAKE A, UM, LET'S, LET'S RECONVENE AT THREE 30.
IF WE COULD, UH, GO AHEAD AND GET STARTED AGAIN.
WE WILL, UM, WE'LL, WE'LL TALK ABOUT CREDITS HERE FOR A LITTLE BIT.
AND I, I THINK I HAVE A A AND, UH, WE HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND AND WE HAVE I THINK GENERAL AGREEMENT.
UM, I, I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN DO THIS.
I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WE HAVE THAT'S RIGHT.
I, I THINK THERE, THERE'S A HANDFUL OF FOLKS THAT WOULD JUST LIKE TO SEE HOW THE CREDIT PROGRAM WILL AFFECT WHAT IT IS THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN GOING FORWARD.
UM, AND WOULD IT, WOULD IT IMPACT ALL EQUALLY OR WOULD IT DIFFERENT IMPACTS 'EM ALL EQUALLY THEN MAYBE WE CAN MAKE A DECISION, BUT IF, BUT IF WE'RE GONNA HAVE DIFFERENT RESULTS AS THE CREDIT, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S GOING TO DETERMINE WHETHER WE GO ONE, TWO, OR THREE BASED ON CREDIT.
WELL, WE, WE TALKED ABOUT THAT.
IT, IT, OF COURSE IT'S THE COMMITTEE'S DECISION.
BUT ADAM JUST A, JUST RIGHT, RIGHT HERE.
JUST THE POINT OF INFORMATION.
I THOUGHT THAT LARRY'S MOTION WAS FOR TWO.
SO IT, THAT'S KIND OF WHAT WE'RE VOTING ON IS TWO, REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE, WHAT THE, UH, CREDITS GIVE YOU.
WHETHER IT GIVES YOU ONE OR YOU HAVE TO, HE'S SAID IT'S TWO.
AND NOW, UNLESS HE'S WILLING TO AMEND HIS MOTION TO LEAVE IT OPEN, I THINK, YOU KNOW, I I WOULD, I'M GONNA PROBABLY, I'M GONNA TRY TO CALL THE QUESTION ON THE ENTIRE THING AND JUST GET THIS THING ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
I, AND I, I, I, I CAME HERE, UH, FULLY PREPARED TO, UH, TO, TO GET A, UH, TO TRY TO GET ONE MORE DECISION MADE.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE ALL THE MEMBERS ARE COMFORTABLE VOTING ON IT WITH THE INFORMATION THAT THEY, THAT THEY HAVE.
AND IF EVERYBODY'S COMFORTABLE VOTING, I THEN ABSOLUTELY WE OKAY.
AGAIN, YOU KNOW, WHAT YOU PRESENTED TO US.
YOU SAID YOU DID NOT CONSIDER CREDITS FOR OPTION ONE AND OPTION TWO, BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S NOT, WE WE'RE ALL CLEAR THAT AS A COMMITTEE WE'RE, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE SELECTING OPTION TWO, WE ARE STILL GOING TO
[01:35:01]
CONSIDER CREDIT.NOW I JUST WANT TO GIVE A CLARIFICATION.
IT IS NOT THAT THE CREDIT PROGRAM IS NOT GONNA BE CONSIDERED FOR OPTION TWO.
CREDIT PROGRAM WILL BE CONSIDERED FOR OPTION TWO.
ALL WE SAID WAS THAT BILLING UNITS THAT WE SHOWED IN THE PRESENTATION TODAY, THAT BILLING UNIT HAS NOT BEEN REDUCED YET FOR POTENTIAL REDUCTION TO CREDIT.
SO CREDIT PROGRAM IS ABSOLUTELY APPLICABLE.
SO THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE IN THE CREDIT PROGRAM APPLICABILITY, WHETHER IT IS OPTION THREE OR WHETHER IT IS OPTION TWO BECAUSE IN BOTH OPTIONS, ALL NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES ARE KEPT GETTING CALCULATED INDIVIDUALLY.
THEREFORE, WHATEVER CREDIT PROGRAM IS DEFINED AS APPLICABLE TO BOTH OPTIONS.
AND, AND I'M COMFORTABLE MOVING FORWARD.
THANK, SO WE HAVE, UM, AND, AND LARRY, IF I COULD, I JUST WANT TO CONFIRM YOUR MOTION.
THAT IS WITH, UH, THE INTENT IS THAT SIX AND A HALF MILLION IS THE FLOOR.
AND WE'RE GONNA, WE'RE GONNA CONSIDER WITH, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE DECIDED UPON AS THE MINIMUM LEVEL OF SER I THINK YOU SAID THAT THE FIRST TIME, BUT IT WASN'T SAID THE SECOND TIME.
THAT'S, SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT'S COR THAT'S CORRECT.
THAT WE TWO, I GUESS AT TWO MEETINGS AGO WE SAID SIX AND A HALF MILLION WAS THE MINIMUM.
MY MOTION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT WE PREVIOUSLY SAID.
MY MINE IS WE MAY WANT TO FAR EXCEED THAT AND BOND THAT AND DO OTHER THINGS, BUT THAT WAS THE REASON FOR IT.
THAT THAT'S THE WAY I UNDERSTOOD IT.
SO CAN I SHOW THAT THERE'S NO OPPOSITION ON OPTION TWO? OKAY.
I'D LIKE, UM, YOU TO REQUEST THE PARISH ATTORNEY ATTEND THESE MEETINGS AND PROVIDE US A WRITTEN LEGAL OPINION AS TO THE OPTIONS CONCERNING VOTE OF THE PEOPLE, BUT BY THE COUNCIL.
AND ALSO START THE BEGINNING OF A DRAFT OF AN ORDINANCE.
UM, THE, THIS, THIS IS WHERE, YOU KNOW, CREDITS AND THOSE THINGS, IT'S THE WRITTEN WORD THAT'S GONNA MAKE THE DIFFERENCE.
SO, UH, I WOULD ASK THAT, THAT, THAT HAPPEN FOR OUR NEXT MEETING.
BE HERE, OPINION AND START WORKING ON ORDINANCE.
I, I'M, I'M A, I'M NOT SURE WHAT, IF YOU CAN CLARIFY WHAT, WHAT IS THE ORDINANCE THAT WE'RE WANTING THEM TO CREATE THE FRAMEWORK, JUST LIKE WE, WE DID ON THE SEWER USER FEES WHEN THEY THAT PASSED BACK WHEN I WAS AROUND, OF WHAT THE MECHANICS OF IT'S GONNA BE.
SO WE CAN START TO SEE A FRAMEWORK AND PARTICULARLY IF IT'S GONNA HAVE ANY KIND OF LANGUAGE CONCERNING, UM, CREDITS ON IT.
WHAT, WHAT IS THAT? HOW DOES THAT ACTUALLY WORK? 'CAUSE I, WE JUST TALKING ABOUT, UM, THINGS IN GENERAL.
AND I THINK YOU, IF IF WE'RE GONNA TRY TO MEET THESE DEADLINES, WE HAVE A DEADLINE.
Y'ALL WOULD HAVE TO HAVE, IF THIS INTRODUCED WHEN I'M I WILL, THAT'LL BE PART OF THE NEXT MEETING.
IS THAT, OR BEFORE THE NEXT MEETING IS THAT WE'LL HAVE A TIMELINE.
HEY LARRY, WHAT ABOUT, OR, AND DWIGHT, WHAT ABOUT THE STORMWATER UTILITY DISTRICT THAT WAS CREATED? IS THAT HELPFUL IN, IN REGARDS TO THE FRAMEWORK AND THE ORDINANCE? DO WE, IF, IF WE COULD I GET, I I WILL, I WILL TAKE THAT BACK.
UM, AND, AND GET THAT CAN, IF WE COULD MOVE ON TO THE CREDITS THAT THAT WOULD BE GOOD.
AND THEN WE CAN AND DIANE, I'M SORRY, DID, DID YOU WANT TO US TO KIND OF REVIEW THESE PHOTOS? NO, UH, KAREN, UH, SENT ME SOME STUFF VIA TEXT AND STUFF.
SO, UH, I GUESS NUMBER ONE, IS THERE, UM, DOES SOMEONE WANT TO, UH, TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE'RE GOING TO CONSIDER CRE OR IS THERE ANY MORE DISCUSSION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WE'RE GOING TO CONSIDER CREDIT? THERE'S ALREADY A MOTION ON THE FLOOR.
WE NEED TO DEAL WITH THAT ONE.
DID ANYBODY HAVE ANY OPPOSITION TO HAVING THE PARISH ATTORNEYS? OKAY.
UM, OKAY, SO MOVING ON TO CREDITS.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON CREDITS? IS OR IS, IS, IS THERE ANYBODY OPPOSED TO A CREDIT PROGRAM? NO.
WE WILL MOVE FORWARD WITH A CREDIT PROGRAM.
ADAM, THE, THE CREDIT, THE CREDITS WILL JUST BE FOR COMMERCIAL, IS THAT CORRECT? YES.
THE CREDITS WILL ONLY BE FOR COMMERCIAL THAT YES.
[01:40:01]
THEY WOULD BE FOR NON-RESIDENTIAL.SO THE, UM, THE, IT WOULD NOT, WHERE IT, WHERE IT WILL AFFECT THE TIERED RESIDENTIAL SYSTEM IS THAT WHATEVER CREDITS ARE APPLIED TO THE NON-RESIDENTIAL, IT'S GOTTA BE CAPTURED SOMEWHERE.
SO IT, IT'LL AFFECT IT THAT WAY.
BUT THERE WOULD BE NO, I GUESS AS, AS, AS WE'RE APPROACHING IT, THERE WOULD BE NO CREDITS FOR RESIDENTIAL UNLESS THE COMMITTEE FEELS OTHER.
BUT IF YOU GIVE CREDITS, THAT'S GOTTA INCREASE THE RATE FOR OTHER PEOPLE.
BECAUSE YOU GOTTA GET THAT, YOU GOTTA GET THE TOTAL AMOUNT TO, TO SAY THE SAME.
YOU GOTTA GET THAT TOTAL AMOUNT.
WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU GIVE SOMEBODY A CREDIT, YOU'RE TAKING IT OUTTA YOUR POCKET KIND OF A THING.
AND THAT'S WHAT, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON THERE, THERE'S SOME OF THESE THAT ARE EASIER SAID THAN DONE, BUT THERE, THERE'S OTHERS THAT WE CAN MAKE SOME ASSUMPTIONS AND SAY, OKAY, WELL IF WE DO THIS, THEN WE KNOW THAT THESE FOLKS ARE GONNA AT LEAST APPLY FOR IT.
AND THEN WE CAN FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT IMPACT WOULD BE AND THEN WE CAN TELL YOU WHAT'S GOTTA BE RECUPERATED MAYBE FOR THE NEXT MEETING, OR MAYBE YOU COULD EMAIL US IN BETWEEN LIKE YOU'VE BEEN DOING TO GIVE, GIVE US A CHANCE TO DIGEST SOME OF THIS, THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE SOME EXAMPLES.
YOU MIGHT DO AN ANALYSIS OF LIKE, WELL, HERE OF THE 42 OR WHATEVER, A HUNDRED AND SOMETHING COMPANIES, YOU KNOW, 20 MIGHT QUALIFY FOR CREDITS, WHICH MIGHT LOOK LIKE X YES.
SOME OF THEM WOULD BE, WOULD BE A, A LITTLE MORE DIFFICULT TO, TO CAPTURE.
IF, IF WE, IF WE GO DOWN, UM, ALL, IF WE GO WITH ALL FIVE MM-HMM.
WELL, AND IT LOOKS LIKE SOME OF THOSE YOU WON'T KNOW UNTIL THE PROGRAM STARTS.
'CAUSE YOU CAN'T TELL WHO'S GONNA HAVE AN EDUCATION PROGRAM.
I WOULDN'T THINK THAT THAT'S CORRECT.
AND EVEN WHEN YOU SAY PROPERTIES THAT GO ABOVE AND BEYOND WILL QUALIFY FOR QUANTITY CREDITS WITHOUT REALLY ANALYZING EVERY NON-RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY, YOU WOULDN'T KNOW DEPENDING ON WHAT DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS THEY CAME UNDER, IT'S DIFFICULT TO KNOW WHO ARE GONNA QUALIFY.
AND THE SECOND THING, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THE CREDITS ARE NOT AUTOMATICALLY GIVEN IT'S A VOLUNTARY PROGRAM, THE PROPERTY OWNERS NEED TO BE WILLING TO APPLY FOR CREDITS COMPLYING WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
UM, WE BRIEFLY TOUCHED ON AT A VERY HIGH LEVEL, BUT THE CREDIT PROGRAM WILL HAVE STRINGENT REQUIREMENTS TO APPLY FOR CREDITS.
SO THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT CERTIFIED ENGINEERING DOCUMENTATION TO PROVE WHAT THEIR AS-BUILTS ARE, AS-BUILT DRAWINGS ARE WHAT ACTUALLY IS HAPPENING ON THEIR PROPERTIES.
AND ALL THE BMPS THAT THEY'RE, THEY SAY THEY HAVE IN THE PROPERTY HAS TO BE FUNCTIONAL.
SO THEY HAVE TO MEET ALL THOSE REQUIREMENTS.
SO GENERALLY SPEAKING, THE OVERALL PARTICIPATION IN THE CREDIT PROGRAM, EVEN IN THE MOST ROBUST CREDIT PROGRAM, IS NOT SIGNIFICANT IN THE COUNTRY BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO MEET THESE REQUIREMENTS AND THEY HAVE TO BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE CREDIT REQUIREMENTS.
AND THERE ARE ALSO UTILITIES THAT WOULD SAY THAT IF THE CREDIT PROGRAM TO EVEN QUALIFY FOR THE CREDIT PROGRAM, THEY CANNOT BE DELINQUENT ON EVEN TAXES IS WHAT SOMETIMES THEY WILL SAY.
SO IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURES ARE WRITTEN.
SO I JUST WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW FROM OUR EMPIRICAL ANALYSIS, UH, BASED ON CUSTOM BENCHMARKING SURVEYS THAT WE HAVE DONE FOR SOME LARGE UTILITIES, TYPICALLY THE, IN TERMS OF THE NUMBER OF CREDIT, THE NUMBER OF PARCELS THAT PARTICIPATE IN CREDIT IS LESS THAN 5% OF THE PROPERTIES, 5% OF NON RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES.
BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO MEET ALL THOSE REQUIREMENTS.
IT CANNOT BE JUST SIMPLY GIVEN AWAY, SIMPLY FOR THE REASON THAT WHEN YOU GIVE A CREDIT PROGRAM TO ONE, THAT MONEY IS COMING FROM SOMEBODY, ALL THE NON-CREDIT HOLDERS.
SO THERE IS A LOT OF ACCOUNTABILITY FOR PROPERTIES THAT ARE GOING TO RECEIVE THE CREDITS ON WHAT THE PROPERTIES SHOULD DO.
SO IS THE CREDIT PROGRAM PERMANENT OR IS THERE SOME SUNSET DATE CREDIT PROGRAM TYPICALLY IS, IS A PURPOSEFUL PROGRAM, BUT ALL THE PROPERTY HOLDERS TYPICALLY HAVE TO APPLY FOR A CREDIT RENEWAL.
AND THE CREDIT RENEWAL POLICIES UP TO THE UTILITIES.
SOME UTILITIES SAY EVERY TWO YEARS.
SOME UTILITIES SAY EVERY FOUR YEARS.
AND, AND I GUESS WHAT I WAS SAYING, I I, I KNOW WE HAVE, UH, SEVERAL COMMITTEE MEMBERS THAT ARE GOING TO APPLY FOR CREDIT.
AND WE, SO WE'VE ALREADY CALCULATED WHAT THEIR FEE WOULD BE WITH AND WITHOUT THE, AS WAS PROPOSED IN SWAC FOUR.
ASSUMING THAT THEY GET THE MAXIMUM THAT WAS PRESENTED AT SWAC FOUR.
[01:45:01]
THE, FOR INSTANCE, THE EDUCATION CREDIT IS EASY, RIGHT? I, I KNOW THAT MS. FADING IS GOING TO, UM, WORK WITH US TO HAVE A, AN EDUCATION, A STORMWATER EDUCATION PROGRAM GREAT.IN THE EAST BATON ROUGE PARISH SCHOOL SYSTEM.
THAT'S GOING TO GET THEM THE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA WANT THAT.
SO WE, I SEE SARAH HAS ALREADY CALCULATED THEIR FEES WITH THE 15% REDUCTION ON THERE.
YOU KNOW, WE WERE LOOKING AT, OKAY, BRECK, THEY DO A, UM, THEY DO SOMETHING AT THE ZOO.
WE, WE WERE LOOKING AT THOSE CREDITS.
SO WE, WE'VE ALREADY STARTED APPLYING SOME OF THESE CREDITS WHERE WE KNOW THAT THE FOLKS ARE, ARE INTERESTED, UM, ABOUT CREDITS.
UM, I THINK, YOU KNOW, COREY'S QUESTION AT THE FIRST MEETING WAS ASKING ABOUT THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
SO WE, WE KNOW THE, THE WE, WE KNOW THERE'S VERY MUCH INTEREST IN THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
SO WE'VE ALREADY, WE WE'VE GOT THOSE, THOSE NUMBERS WORKED OUT.
UM, THE, THE ONES THAT ARE, THAT ARE DIFFICULT ARE THE, UM, YOU KNOW, AND WE'D EVEN HAVE TO LOOK AT THESE, BUT LIKE PEAK DISCHARGE CREDIT, THE, UM, THE, THE QUALITY CREDIT, THOSE TYPES OF THINGS, THAT'S A LITTLE MORE DIFFICULT TO FIGURE OUT HOW THAT'S GOING TO AFFECT THINGS.
BUT, UM, BUT THE OTHERS, UM, WE CAN, WE CAN GENERALLY, UH, TAKE A PRETTY GOOD GUESS AT, AT HOW THEY'RE GONNA FALL OUT AND JUST HIGH LEVEL SEE HOW THEY COULD AFFECT THINGS ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.
SO THERE'S SEVERAL DECISION POINTS.
YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS PRESENTED WAS, UM, WHAT THE MAXIMUM CREDIT TOTAL WOULD BE.
YOU KNOW, LET, LET'S SAY YOU HAVE A, A PEAK DISCHARGE CREDIT AND AN EDUCATION CREDIT, YOU KNOW, WELL THOSE TWO, IF YOU GET BOTH OF THOSE, THAT'S A 15% MAX FOR ONE, AND THEN A 15% MAX FOR ANOTHER ONE.
SO THEN THAT'S, THAT'S 30%, YOU KNOW.
DO YOU, WHAT, UM, IS THERE A A MAXIMUM PERCENTAGE THAT WE WANT TO ESTABLISH TO THE CREDIT PROGRAM? OR, AND, AND I, THAT'S, THAT'S TYPICAL.
ARE YOU ASKING US THAT QUESTION RIGHT NOW OR ARE YOU SAYING WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT THAT NEXT TIME WHEN YOU TEE THIS UP? WELL, I, UM, I, I GUESS I'M ASKING THAT QUESTION RIGHT NOW.
JUST THE GENERAL FEELING ON IF THERE WOULD BE A, A MAXIMUM, UH, YES.
CREDIT THAT WOULD BE ALLOWED, I WOULD SAY.
DO OTHER LOCALES, MOST OF 'EM HAVE MAX? YES.
ALL CREDIT PROGRAMS HAVE A MAXIMUM AND, UH, BASED ON OUR SURVEY, TYPICALLY IT'S SOMEWHERE IN THE RANGE OF 30 TO 50%.
AND AGAIN, THE MAXIMUM IS REALLY DEFINED BY THE CIRCUMSTANCES OF EACH INDIVIDUAL COMMUNITY AND THE OBJECTIVES THAT THEY WANT TO ACCOMPLISH.
SO THE UTILITIES ARE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT THE MAXIMUM THEY SET BECAUSE OF THE FACT THAT THE REVENUE LOSS FROM THE CREDIT PROGRAM HAS TO COME FROM THE OTHER RATE PAYERS AND IT'LL INCREASE THE OVERALL SYSTEM WIDE UNIT.
BUT YEAH, UTILITIES DO HAVE A MAX, NOT ONLY FOR THE AGGREGATE MAX, AS WE EXPLAINED IN THE LAST CREDIT PROGRAM PRESENTATION, THERE'S A MAXIMUM FOR EVERY TYPE OF CREDIT AND THEN AN AGGREGATE MAXIMUM FOR THE COMBINATION OF CREDITS.
DO YOU HAVE A RECOMMENDATION OF WHAT OUR MAXIMUM SHOULD BE? UM, IN THE PROPOSAL THAT WE HAD WAS THE ONE THAT WE PRESENTED LAST TIME WAS 30% MAXIMUM AGGREGATE MM-HMM.
UM, SO THAT'S WHERE ADAM WAS GIVING THAT EXAMPLE RIGHT NOW.
AND I GOTTA BELIEVE THAT SOME ORGANIZATIONS, LIKE MY COLLEAGUE RIGHT HERE, MY FRIEND OVER HERE, MY NEW FRIEND FROM B R C C, I MEAN, I'M LOOKING AT HIS NUMBERS NOW.
GRANTED IT'S BASED ON THE 6.5 BILLION, BUT WE WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT THAT AT OPTION TWO.
IT'S 5,005 $5,300 A YEAR OR SOMETHING THAT B R C'S ON THE HOOK FOR RIGHT NOW.
I, I KNOW THAT'S JUST THE 6.5 LEVEL, BUT I MEAN, AT THE END OF THE DAY, HOW MUCH TIME DOES IT MAKE SENSE FOR YOUR PEOPLE TO TAKE TO APPLY FOR ALL THIS? TO GET WHAT, A $2,000 CREDIT? YOU'D SPEND MORE MONEY PROBABLY TRYING TO PUT TOGETHER A PROGRAM OR PAY THE PEOPLE TO WRITE THE STUFF TO KEEP TRACK OF IT.
YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT'S NOT, I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW.
I'M NOT PUTTING WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH, BUT, RIGHT.
I GUESS, SORRY YOU HAVEN'T SAID MUCH.
I JUST WOULD LOVE TO HEAR FROM YOU JUST TAKING IT ALL IN.
I AGREE WITH THE, UH, THE MAX, UH, AT B R C C, WE
[01:50:01]
LOOKED AT, I LOOKED AT THE NUMBERS.I MEAN, THE NUMBERS ARE NOT SIGNIFICANT IN TERMS OF, UH, THE PROPOSAL, BUT FOR OTHER ORGANIZATIONS LIKE BRACK AND SOUTHERN L S U, THEIR NUMBERS ARE KIND OF UP THERE.
SO I COULD DEFINITELY SEE THE NEED FOR HAVING A CREDIT PROGRAM.
AND IN MY DISCUSSION, EVEN WITH SOME OF THE ADMINISTRATION, YOU KNOW, THE CREDIT PROGRAM WAS DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD PURSUE QUITE HEAVILY.
AND, UM, WE SPOKE ABOUT IT BECAUSE A LARGE AMOUNT WATER FLOWS THROUGH RIGHT.
SOUTHERN UNIVERSITY CAMPUS IN NORTH BATON ROUGE, WE ARE DOING A $35 MILLION PROJECT NOW BECAUSE OF EROSION CAUSED BY THE, SO, UH, YOU KNOW, OUR ADMINISTRATION IS SAYING, WELL, A $35 MILLION PROJECT IS DEALING WITH EROSION BECAUSE WE HAVE A LARGE PORTION OF FLOW COMING FROM NORTH BATON ROUGE, AND YOU WANT A SUBSTANTIAL CREDIT TO BE CONSIDERED FOR THE UNIVERSITY.
AND WHO'S THE APPROVAL AUTHORITY FOR THESE CREDITS? I THINK IT WOULD BE THE UTILITY.
IT'D BE, IT'D BE THE STORMWATER UTILITY DISTRICT, WHICH IS THE METRO COUNCIL WHO, WHO'S DWIGHT DWIGHT'S, THE CHAIR OF, WAS NAMED THE CHAIR OF THAT LAST YEAR.
IS IT THE DWIGHT? I DON'T THINK IT'S MM-HMM.
NEW DWIGHT, YOU GOT A NEW ROLE? MM-HMM.
NO, HE'S BEEN THAT SINCE LAST SEPTEMBER.
NO, WE, THE QUESTION WAS ASKED, WHO IS THE APPROVING AUTHORITY FOR, UH, CREDITS? YEAH.
I THINK WE'LL NEED AN OPINION FROM THE PARISH ATTORNEY'S OFFICE ULTIMATELY, BUT, UM, I, I WOULD IMAGINE THE WAY IT COULD BE HANDLED IS, IS RESOURCE GROUP.
UM, ONCE WE LEARNED ABOUT, UM, WHAT THEY DO ALL AND, AND, AND HAVE THAT NUMBER TO BETTER HAVE SOME MORE DETAILED CONVERSATION AT THE FOLLOWING MEETING, HOW ABOUT RECOMMENDED 30%? I THINK SHE JUST SAID.
I THINK YOU, YOU, I DON'T THINK WE CAN DO IT TODAY.
I THINK YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOME IDEA OF WHAT IT IS BEFORE YOU SLAP A NUMBER ON IT.
YOU SAID IT'S BETWEEN 30 AND 50% MAX CAPPED AROUND THE COUNTRY BEST PRACTICES.
SO WE'LL START THERE, RIGHT? YES.
BUT I, BUT I THINK, UM, MAYBE OUR RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE, GIVEN THAT WE WANNA TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AT SOME OF THE CREDITS THAT YOU ALL TALKED ABOUT FOR INDIVIDUAL PROPERTIES, UM, I THINK IT MIGHT BE GOOD FOR US TO DO ANOTHER VALIDATION SO THAT IF WE FIND THAT THE, FOR EXAMPLE, EVEN THOUGH YOU'RE ALL GOING WITH OPTION TWO AT A, AT A MINIMUM, THE CREDITS THAT WE HAD KIND OF IS ROUGHLY ESTIMATED BASED ON OUR EXPERIENCE THAT CREDIT IS WHAT WE WOULD START WITH IN OPTION TWO AND TELL YOU WHAT HAPPENS TO THE UNIT RATE.
BUT IF WE FIND THAT NOW BEGINNING TO START, BEGINNING TO LOOK AT INDIVIDUAL PROPERTIES AND STUFF LIKE THAT, WE FIND THAT THE POTENTIAL REDUCTION IN CREDITS THAT WE HAVE ASSUMED IS LESS THAN PROBABLY WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN.
WE MAY HAVE TO THEN INCREASE IT, WHICH MEANS THE UNIT RATE IS GONNA GO UP AND THEN THE CHARGE IS GONNA GO UP.
SO SOME OF THE THINGS, JUST TO LEAVE YOU ALL WITH THIS THOUGHT THAT HAVING A LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPES OF CREDITS, UM, THERE ARE SOME UTILITIES THAT HAVE SIX OR SEVEN TYPES OF CREDITS, BUT THEY'RE ALL UTILITIES THAT HAVE BEEN IN PLACE FOR 20 YEARS RIGHT NOW.
BUT UTILITIES THAT ARE GENERALLY STARTING NEW BECAUSE YOU NEED TO DEVELOP SOME HISTORY, SOME CAPACITY TO ADMINISTER THE PROGRAM.
AND ALSO THESE CREDITS ARE NOT JUST GIVEN ONLY BASED ON DOCUMENTATION.
SITE VISITS HAVE TO BE DONE BY THE UTILITY STAFF TO MAKE SURE THAT EVERYTHING'S IN COMPLIANCE.
SO TYPICALLY IN THOSE CASES, UTILITY START WITH THREE OR FOUR CREDITS, NOT REALLY MORE THAN THAT, SO THAT IT CAN START IN A MEANINGFUL WAY AND THEN THE CREDIT PROGRAM CAN EVOLVE.
BUT THERE IS A NEED, THEN YOU CAN EXPAND THE MAXIMUM.
BUT IF YOU START WITH A HIGHER MAXIMUM, I'M BEING VERY HONEST, YOU CAN PULL IT BACK.
BECAUSE THEN YOU'RE AFFECTING PEOPLE WHO ALREADY GOT THE CREDITS AND WE, WE'VE DONE SOMETHING.
SO JUST, THERE ARE A LOT OF FACTORS TO CONSIDER GOOD ADVICE AND, AND CREDIT IS AN IMPORTANT ASPECT OF THE STORMWATER PROGRAM.
BUT I HAVE TO TELL YOU FROM MY EXPERIENCE, CREDITS IS NOT THE, NOT THE REASON THAT STORMWATER UTILITIES ARE APPROVED OR NOT APPROVED.
IT'S AN ENABLER, BUT IT'S NOT THE ONE THAT DECIDES WHETHER UTILITY IS GONNA HAVE A FUNDING THROUGH A STORMWATER
IT'S TRULY AN ENABLER, UH, THAT
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SUPPORTS.THAT'S GOOD, VERY GOOD ADVICE.
WHAT IS OUR CURRENT, UM, I KNOW Y'ALL TOLD ME THIS TWO YEARS AGO, BUT I FORGOT.
WHAT'S OUR CURRENT C R S RATING IN BATON ROUGE? DO YOU KNOW? IT WAS IN ONE OF YOUR REPORTS? BRAAVA, OUR, THE C R S, THE, THE CREDIT, UM, FOR STORM WATER MANAGEMENT, THE COMMUNITY RATE, YOU KNOW, THE C R S, WHAT'S OUR C R S NUMBER FOR FLOOD INSURANCE FROM FEMA? WHAT'S OUR NUMBER SEVEN? I'LL HAVE TO GET THAT FROM RACHEL.
SO WE COULD MAYBE TAKE, WE COULD BRING THAT TO THE NEXT MEETING.
I'D LOVE TO SHARE THAT WITH THE GROUP.
SO ONE THING THAT WE'VE LEARNED THAT STORMWATER MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS HELP WITH IS THEY HELP WITH THE C R S NUMBERS.
AND YOU CAN LOOK, UM, THERE'S A WEBSITE THROUGH FEMA.
YOU CAN SEE ALL OVER THE COUNTRY THE RATINGS YOU CAN SEE IN COASTAL FLORIDA TOWNS, BECAUSE THEY HAVE PERMANENTLY FUNDED AND PROFESSIONALLY MANAGED STORM WATER MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS AND HAVE HAD IN PLACE FOR MANY YEARS, MANY OF THEIR COASTAL TOWNS HAVE BETTER C R S RATINGS THAN WE DO IN BATON ROUGE.
SO AS WE GET THIS PROGRAM IN PLACE, WE CAN LOOK FORWARD TO OUR C R S RATING NUMBERS COMING DOWN, AND FOR EACH POINT THAT WE COME DOWN OR GET BETTER, THAT REPRESENTS, I, I'M SORRY I DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME, BUT I, I CAN GET YOU THE DATA FOR THE NEXT MEETING.
SOMETHING SIGNIFICANT DECREASE IN FLOOD INSURANCE BILLS.
SO I THINK THAT WOULD BE VERY IMPORTANT TO SHARE AS WE'RE EDUCATING, I THINK WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE, ED, OR MAYBE AT WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT AT THE SUMMIT.
I THINK ROBERT JOYNER IS THE FLOODPLAIN MANAGER WHO HAS THAT INFORMATION.
IT, IT IS ACTUALLY ON, I MEAN, YOU CAN SEE IT.
WE'LL GET, I CAN PULL IT UP THE NEXT TIME IT'S ON THE WEBSITE.
ARE ARE THERE ANY OF THE FIVE CREDITS THAT YOU DON'T WANNA LOOK INTO? OR AT THIS POINT ARE WE SAYING WE'RE GONNA, UH, CONSIDER ALL FIVE AND I'M NOT, I, I GUESS I'M NOT EVEN REALLY NECESSARILY ASKING FOR A, A VOTE OR A MOTION OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
IT'S MORE JUST PREPARATORY FOR THE NEXT MEETING.
ARE THERE ANY THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO THAT, THAT YOU DON'T THINK YOU WILL CONSIDER? WELL, WHY DON'T WE SEE WHAT YOU COME BACK WITH? I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION RIGHT NOW.
THERE MIGHT BE ONE WE MIGHT DECIDE WE WANNA EXCLUDE, MIGHT BE TWO, BUT I, I THINK IT'S PREMATURE FOR US TO MAKE THAT DECISION TODAY.
COULD YOU CONTINUE TO SHARE THAT SORT OF INFORMATION WITH US VIA EMAIL SO WE CAN CONSIDER IT IN BETWEEN? OKAY.
YEAH, I THINK IT'S GOOD ADVICE.
START OUT SIMPLE AND YOU CAN ALWAYS BUILD ON THIS PROGRAM ADDITIONAL CREDIT TYPES AS YOU GO FORWARD IN TIME.
THAT'S WHAT OTHER MUNICIPALITIES DO.
THEY, IT'S NOT A SET IN STONE, IT'S A, A LIVING DOCUMENT, RIGHT.
UM, YEAH, THEY, THEY DO, THEY DO SOMETIMES MODIFY THEIR CREDIT PROGRAM, BUT AGAIN, THEY'RE CAREFUL.
IT'S NOT LIKE THEY, THEY MODIFY EVERY OTHER YEAR BECAUSE THERE, THERE ARE UTILITIES THAT ARE PROPERTIES THAT ARE DEVELOPING, UH, ESPECIALLY SOME VERY LARGE DEVELOPMENT BASED ON THE CREDIT PROGRAM.
AND SO CERTAINLY THE CREDIT PROGRAM CHANGES THEN IT BECOMES DIFFICULT FOR THEM.
SO, UM, AFTER MANY, AFTER A FEW YEARS, YES.
UM, RECENTLY ONE, ONE COUNTY IN WASHINGTON REVAMPED THEIR CREDIT PROGRAM, BUT THEY DID THAT BECAUSE THEY WERE GIVING 80% CREDIT AND THEN THEY COMPLETELY REVAMPED THEIR PROGRAM, BROUGHT THE CREDITS DOWN TO 30%.
AND ALSO THEY BASICALLY SAID, THEN THEY GAVE A SUNSET OF ABOUT 10 YEARS.
SO FOR ALL THE CREDIT HOLDERS WHO ARE IN THE OLD CREDIT STANDARDS TO COME TO THE NEW CREDIT STANDARDS, EITHER THEY HAVE TO COME TO THE NEW CREDIT STANDARDS IN 10 YEARS OR THEY LOSE THEIR CREDITS AT THAT POINT.
I THINK WE NEED TO START OUT SLOW, LEARN AND THEN ADAPT.
UM, AND, AND I, I, I JUST THINK YOU, UM, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT YOU JUST THINK'S GONNA WORK ONE ONE WAY AND THEN YOU FIND OUT IT'S GONNA WORK ANOTHER WAY.
IT, IT'S GOTTA BE A, A FLUID PROCESS.
UM, SO IF WE MEET AGAIN ON THE FOURTH THURSDAY, THAT PUTS US ON AUGUST 24TH.
ARE WE GOOD WITH THAT? SAME TIME, SAME PLACE.
AND THEN, UM, MAYBE, UH, AND THEN LOOKING FORWARD TO SEPTEMBER, DO WE WANT TO HAVE, UH, CONVERSATION ON THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN IN SEPTEMBER? SURE.
JUST FOR, AGAIN, I'M JUST TRYING TO PLAN, JUST GET EVERYTHING
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PLANNED OUT.UH, WEREN'T, WEREN'T YOU GOING TO, UH, GIVE US A LIST OF POTENTIAL PROJECTS TO CONSIDER NEXT MEETING? YES.
AND AND WE WILL, WE'LL WE WILL WORK TO GET YOU SOME THINGS AHEAD OF TIME, BUT JUST TO, TO SEE IF WE CAN GET EVERYBODY SCHEDULED FOR, FOR THAT DAY.
I MEAN, THAT'S ALL ON THE STORMWATER MASTER PLAN, RIGHT? I MEAN, THERE'S A BEVY OF RECOMMENDATIONS IN THERE.
THERE IS, BUT THEY'VE, THEY'VE SINCE, LIKE I SAID, THEY UM, THEY'VE REORDERED THEM.
REORDERED 'EM AND GIVE IT PRIOR, GIVEN US A, A SHORT LIST, I GUESS IS WHAT YOU'D CALL SO PRIORITIES.
THEY TIGHTENED IT UP IN PRIORITIES.
AND, AND JUST THEY ARE STILL, THEY, THEY'RE APPLYING FOR A LOT OF FEDERAL FUNDING.
THEY'RE GOING AFTER THAT TYPE OF STUFF.
SO ANYTHING THAT, THAT THEY, THAT GETS DONE BETWEEN NOW AND THEN, WELL THEN THAT'S JUST THAT MUCH BETTER.
WE EITHER FREEZE UP MONEY FOR SOMETHING ELSE, FREE UP MONEY FOR SOMETHING ELSE, OR WE JUST, IT'S, IT'S LESS OR WHATEVER THE COMMITTEE WOULD, WOULD CHOOSE TO DO.
BUT I JUST WANTED TO, THIS PROCESS WOULD NOT STOP THEM FROM CONTINUING AND, AND WILL NOT STOP THEM FROM CONTINUING TO APPLY FOR FEDERAL GRANTS TO BE FUNDED.
SO WHAT IS GONNA BE THE FOCUS OF THE AUGUST MEETING VERSUS HAVING H N T B BRING THIS FORWARD TO AUGUST? SO THE AUGUST MEETING WAS GONNA BE CREDITS AND THEN THE SEPTEMBER MEETING WOULD BE THE, UH, THE MASTER PLAN.
IS THAT THE HEART CART BEFORE THE HORSE ON THIS ONE? DO WE NEED TO, DO WE NEED TO LAND ON THE CREDITS RIGHT NOW? IT SEEMS LIKE I'M, I'M JUST OFFERING A SUGGESTION.
IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT ADDITIONAL DOLLARS WE WANT OVER THE 6.5 AND THAT REALLY HINGED ON THE PROJECTS RELATED STUFF VERSUS THE CREDITS.
YOU KNOW, LET'S FIGURE OUT WHAT THE COSTS ARE VERSUS WHAT THE EXCEPTIONS ARE.
THAT THAT'S A GOOD, YEAH, THAT'S A GOOD POINT.
WE CAN, I, I'LL, UH, I'LL WORK WITH BRAD TO, UH, HAVE H M T B HERE AT THE NEXT MEETING.
WE'LL TALK ABOUT SOME MASTER PLANS.
SO OTHER THOUGHTS ON THAT? I JUST THOUGHT THIS A SIX.
WE NEED SOME PROJECTS TO CONSIDER IF WE WANT MORE FUNDING.
AND I, LIKE YOU SAID, I THINK IT ALL, IT WOULD ULTIMATELY, WHEN PEOPLE KNOW WHAT THAT THAT NUMBER'S GOING TO BE, THEN, YOU KNOW, UH, HOW KIND OF THE, THE DISCUSSION EARLIER, WHETHER IT'S FOR BRE WHETHER IT'S 40 MILLION, I MEAN 40,000 OR 200,000, THAT THE LEVEL OF FUNDING AFFECTS THAT.
SO THE POINT, OKAY, I WILL WITH THAT IN THE MEANTIME, I'LL, WITH THAT, CAN YOU HAVE Y'ALL HAVE SOME SIDEBAR CONVERSATIONS MAYBE AND BRING L S U UP TO SPEED 'CAUSE THEY'RE A BIG STAKEHOLDER.
IS THAT POSSIBLE? I CAN, I CAN TRY THAT.
DO I HAVE A MOTION TO ADJOURN? I MOVE.