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TECHNICIAN[6. Consider Motion to call for Examinations in the Baton Rouge Police Department:]
[*This Meeting is Joined in Progress*]
ONE AND POLICE CADET.WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? I MOVE TO CALL FOR THE EXAMINATIONS MOVED BY MR. THOMAS.
THE EXAMS FOR THE FOUR POSITIONS IS NOW CALLED AGENDA ITEM SEVEN.
[7. Consider Motion to review/accept test results]
CONSIDER A MOTION TO REVIEW OR ACCEPT TEST RESULTS.I SEE THAT WE HAVE A NUMBER OF THOSE.
PLEASE ALLOW ME JUST A MOMENT FOR YOU TO OPEN THESE.
THEY COULDN'T HAVE WRAPPED GOLD MUCH BETTER THAN THESE
I THINK THE KNIFE WOULD'VE BEEN BETTER.
WE GOT QUITE A LIST HERE FOR SEVERAL POSITIONS.
I THINK WE NEED TO PAY SPECIAL ATTENTION TO THE POLICE LIEUTENANT.
WE DO HAVE RESULTS FOR POLICE SERGEANT.
IT APPEARS THAT ALL THESE ARE POLICE SERGEANTS OR NO.
WE GOT TWO SETS OF BEFORE LIEUTENANT.
MR. CHAIRMAN, WHILE THEY'RE, WHILE THEY'RE LOOKING AT THE, UH, THE, THE TEST RESULTS, WE DO HAVE CORRESPONDENCE FROM THE, UH, STATE EXAMINER'S OFFICE REGARDING AT LEAST ONE EXAMINEE WHO WAS NOT ELIGIBLE TO SIT FOR THE POLICE LIEUTENANT EXAM.
SO, UH, WHAT I WOULD RECOMMEND IS, UH, THE BOARD SHOULD PROBABLY APPROVE THE DEPUTY FIRE CHIEF POLICE SERGEANT CRIMINAL INTELLIGENCE
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ANALYST SO LONG AS EVERYTHING CHECKS OUT AND LET'S DELAY THE POLICE LIEUTENANT UNTIL WE GET TO THAT AGENDA ITEM TO MAKE SURE WE'RE ALL SQUARED AWAY.AND THAT'S AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 11, THE CHAIR.
SO STIPULATES THAT'S WHAT WE WILL DO.
I MOVE TO APPROVE ALL TEST SCORES EXCEPT FOR THE ONE ON THE AGENDA.
WELL, WE'RE GOING TO EXCLUDE, I THINK EVERYTHING INCLUDE THE DEPUTY FIRE CHIEF, THE SERGEANT, AND THE CRIMINAL INTELLIGENCE ANALYST.
AND WE'LL DO THE LIEUTENANT AS A SEPARATE ITEM.
SO I HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE TESCO'S FOR THE DEPUTY FIRE CHIEF POLICE SERGEANT CRIMINAL INTELLIGENCE ANALYST.
THE MOTION TO APPROVE DEPUTY FIRE, CHIEF POLICE SERGEANT CRIMINAL INTELLIGENCE ANALYST TEST RESULTS WAS APPROVED.
THAT BRINGS US TO ITEM NUMBER EIGHT,
[8. Review/accept application and test results for Fire Services and Supply Technician.]
REVIEW.ACCEPT APPLICATION FOR FIRE SERVICES AND SUPPLY TECHNICIAN.
AND I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
WE HAVE A MOTION BY MR. LEMON TO APPROVE THE APPLICATIONS FOR FIRE SERVICE AND SUPPLY TECHNICIAN.
[9. Consider a request from Thomas Morse, Jr., Police Chief, to rehire Takiyah Beard, who resigned on January 26, 2021, from the position of Police Fingerprint Technician I.]
CONSIDER A REQUEST FROM THOMAS MORRIS JR.POLICE CHIEF TO REHIRE TOIA BY WHO RESIGNED ON JANUARY 26TH, 2021 FROM THE POSITION OF POLICE FINGERPRINT TECHNICIAN ONE.
ANY, UM, COMMENTS, MR. RAINS OR FROM THE POLICE DEPARTMENT? IF NOT, WHAT'S YOUR PLEASURE? BOARD MEMBERS, I MOVE TO APPROVE IT.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND.
[10. Review correspondence from an examinee who wishes to challenge examination results.]
REVIEW CORRESPONDENCE FROM AN EXAMINEE WHO WISHES TO CHALLENGE THE EXAMINATION RESULTS.THAT PERSON, UM, I SAW THAT EARLIER.
MS. PAULO IN THE AUDIENCE? NO, I DON'T THINK, NO, SHE'S NOT HERE.
I THINK THERE WERE THREE PEOPLE WHO TOOK THE TEST.
UM, SO SHE IS SAYING THAT SHE DOESN'T BELIEVE THAT THE TEST WAS, UH, A GOOD TEST OR A VALID TEST.
UM, A COUPLE WAYS THE BOARD COULD HANDLE IT.
THE BOARD COULD, OBVIOUSLY, BECAUSE WE
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DON'T CREATE THE TEST, THAT'S NOT OUR JOB.THAT'S A STATE EXAMINER'S JOB.
AND WHAT THEY DO IS THEY CONTACT PEOPLE THAT ARE CURRENTLY HOLDING THOSE POSITIONS NOW AND THEY DEVELOP THE TEST THAT WAY.
UM, SO WHAT YOU COULD DO IS HAVE A, YOU KNOW, A CONVERSATION WITH THE STATE EXAMINER WHERE WE COULD BRING HER IN AND, UH, IT WOULD BE AN EXECUTIVE SESSION.
SHE COULD TELL US ABOUT THE TEST, UM, AND KIND OF WHAT THEY DID AND, AND PUTTING IT TOGETHER.
IF THE BOARD AT THAT POINT DECIDES THE TEST WAS NOT DONE CORRECTLY, THAT WOULD INVALIDATE THE TEST RESULTS FOR EVERYBODY AND YOU'D HAVE TO GO AHEAD AND GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AGAIN.
UM, IN MY OPINION, IT'S KIND OF HARD TO SAY.
IT'S NOT VALID IF TWO PEOPLE PASS.
SO MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD TO, YOU KNOW, TO, TO LET THE TEST STAND AS IT IS.
UH, THE EXAMINEE CAN ALWAYS TAKE THE TEST AGAIN.
WHAT'S THE PLEASURE OF THE BOARD? I MEAN, I MOVE TO LET THE TEST STAND AS IT IS.
UH, I HAVE A MOTION BY MR. THOMAS TO LET THE TEST STAND AS TEST RESULTS.
UH, MR. CHAIR, MAY I ASK A QUESTION? SURE.
SO IT, MY ONLY CONCERN BECAUSE I, I AGREE WITH YOU.
IF PEOPLE ARE PASSING THE EXAM, THAT GIVES ME LESS REASON FOR PAUSE.
BUT IT'S THE ALLEGATION THAT THERE ARE QUESTIONS THAT DON'T PERTAIN TO THE EVERYDAY DUTIES THAT WOULD PEOPLE COULD POTENTIALLY GET CORRECT, BUT THEN HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE JOB.
THAT'S WHAT WOULD GIVE ME A LITTLE BIT MORE CONCERN.
I'M NOT SAYING IT'S TRUE OR FALSE, I SIMPLY DON'T KNOW.
UM, IS THERE, IS THERE ANY UNDUE HARDSHIP TO THE DEPARTMENT IF WE WERE TO ASK THE EXAMINER TO COME IN AND SPEAK TO US IN THE EXECUTIVE SESSION, UM, HOLDING THESE TEST SCORES FOR THAT TO HAPPEN? OR WOULD THAT NOT CAUSE UNDUE HARM TO THE DEPARTMENT OR DO YOU NOT KNOW? I DON'T, I, I BELIEVE IT WOULD CAUSE HARM TO THE SYSTEM.
UH, I THINK THAT THE SYSTEM IS, MAKE SURE YOUR MIC'S ON.
I BELIEVE THE SYSTEM IS FAIR, UH, ACROSS THE BOARD.
UM, UM, I MEAN SOME OF THE QUESTIONS, UH, YOU MAY NOT SEE DURING YOUR CAREER, BUT IF YOU DO RESEARCH, YOU PROBABLY WILL, WILL COME ACROSS IT.
AND I, I THINK IT, IT WOULD HOLD UP PROMOTIONS IF THERE'S A PROMOTION THAT IT'S DUE.
WE DON'T, WE DON'T HAVE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S THE CURRENT CASE OR NOT, NOT, NO.
MR. DARA, OUTSIDE OF, OF HOLDING THIS UP, IF WE WERE TO VOTE AGAINST, UM, MS. PARLOW ON THIS, WOULD WE STILL HAVE THE CAPABILITY OR CAPACITY TO REQUEST THE STATE EXAMINER TO PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION FOR THE FUTURE? OR WOULD THAT ONLY BE PART AND PARCEL WITH THIS QUESTION? NO, YOU COULD, UH, ALWAYS ASK THE STATE EXAMINER TO COME IN AND HAVE A CONVERSATION.
IS THAT, 'CAUSE I'M BEING TOLD THAT THERE IS, UH, A PROMOTION THAT WOULD BE HELD UP AND IN A VACUUM, I WOULD HESITATE TO DO THAT, BUT I WOULD ALSO HATE TOO THAT WE CONTINUOUSLY VOTE AGAINST THESE TYPES OF REQUESTS WITHOUT HAVING, AT LEAST FROM MY END, I KNOW YOU GUYS LIKELY KNOW BETTER THAN I DO, BUT WITHOUT HAVING ANY PERSONAL INFORMATION REGARDING WHAT THESE QUESTIONS LOOK LIKE, THAT TYPE OF THING.
AND SO WITH THAT IN MIND, I, I WOULD LIKE FOR THE STATE EXAMINER OR TO PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION IN THE NEAR TO MIDDLE FUTURE.
BUT I'M, I'M COMFORTABLE VOTING ON THIS AS, AS A, AN ITEM FOR TODAY.
WELL, LET'S LET THE RECORD SHOW THAT WE'VE MAKING THAT REQUEST TO THE STATE EXAMINER.
AND IN THE MEANTIME WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR FROM MR. THOMAS TO, UM, LET THE EXAM STAND.
I SECOND THAT MOTION AND SECONDED BY MR. LEMON.
ARE THERE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? NO, SIR.
IF NOT, THEN ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION SAY AYE.
ALL THOSE OPPOSED THE MOTION PASSES.
[11. Review correspondence concerning an examinee's eligibility to sit for a recent Police Lieutenant examination.]
REVIEW CORRESPONDENCE CONCERNING AND EXAMINE THESE ELIGIBILITY TO SIT FOR A RECENT POLICE LIEUTENANT EXAMINATION.THIS IS THE ONE THAT WE REFERRED TO EARLIER IN APPROVING TESCOS.
WE DO HAVE INFORMATION FROM THE STATE EXAMINER INDICATING THAT ONE PERSON, UM, DID NOT QUALIFY FOR THE POSITION.
AND THE LETTER STATES THAT AT THE TIME
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OF APPLICATION FOR EXAMINATION, THESE ARE THE QUALIFICATIONS MUST BE AN INCUMBENT IN THE CLASS OF POLICE SERGEANT WITH AT LEAST TWO YEARS IN THIS CLASS.PRECEDING APPLICATION TO THE BOARD, THE TWO YEARS IS TO BE COUNTED FROM THE DATE OF PROBATIONAL APPOINTMENT.
STATE EXAMINER SAYS THEY DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THIS PARTICULAR PERSON, UH, MEETS THOSE QUALIFICATIONS.
AND SO UNLESS WE HAVE INFORMATION TO THE CONTRARY, WE WILL THEN, UM, ELIMINATE HIM FROM APPROVING THE POLICE.
ARE THERE ANYONE THAT HAS INFORMATION TO REFUTE THE STATE EXAMINER? NO.
AND WITH THAT BEING SAID, I DID SEE THAT, UM, I JUST WENT THROUGH THE, THE LIEUTENANT NAMES.
SO WE CAN GO AHEAD AND APPROVE, UH, OKAY.
ALRIGHT, WITH THAT THEN I'LL REQUEST A MOTION TO APPROVE THE LIEUTENANT'S TEST SCORES.
MR. CHAIR, DO WE HAVE TO, AND I APOLOGIZE IF WE DON'T IT AS A SEPARATE ITEM.
AND WHAT, WHAT ITEM WAS THIS? 11.
IS THERE ANY ACTION ITEM WE NEED TO TAKE ON THAT SEPARATE AND APART? SO THE, THE ITEM IS TO REVIEW THE CORRESPONDENCE.
I WAS JUST ENSURING THAT WE DIDN'T NEED TO ADDRESS THAT BEFORE WE MOVED ON TO APPROVING OR, OR NOT APPROVING THE SCORES.
YEAH, I JUST READ THE, THE OKAY.
THE QUALIFICATIONS FROM STATE EXAMINE AND, UM, WE AGREE, I THINK, UH, THAT THIS PERSON DOES NOT MEET THE QUALIFICATION.
SO THERE IS NO ACTION ON IT TO ANSWER QUESTION.
AND THAT, AND THAT'S, I WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE DIDN'T NEED TO DO ANYTHING FORMAL TO ACKNOWLEDGE.
SO YOU TO INCLUDE IT IN IN THE MOTION.
NO, BECAUSE HE'S NOT ON THE LIST.
SO I HAVE A MOTION TO, UH, APPROVE LIEUTENANT TESCO.
IS I A SECOND APPROVE THE LIEUTENANTS TEST SCORES? YES.
[12. Approve new Scheduling Order regarding Joanell Robinson-Woodard's Appeal.]
APPROVE NEW SCHEDULING ORDER.WE REGARDING JANELLE ROBINSON WOOD'S APPEAL.
ON THIS ONE WE HAD A SCHEDULING ORDER.
UH, JUST BASICALLY, UH, IN THE EVENT THAT THE ERNEST JONES APPEAL DID NOT GO FORWARD TODAY, WE WERE GOING TO HAVE THAT APPEAL HAPPENED.
UH, THE JONES APPEAL IS GONNA GO FORWARD.
SO WHAT I WOULD ASK FOR THE BOARD TO DO IS JUST GIVE ME AND THE CHAIR AUTHORITY TO CREATE ANOTHER SCHEDULING AUTHOR, UH, ANOTHER SCHEDULING ORDER FOR THE NEXT DAY, UH, WHICH I THINK IS SOMETIME IN JANUARY, JANUARY 27TH.
RIGHT? UNLESS, UNLESS THERE IS OBJECTION, THE CHAIR WILL SO STIPULATE OR I'LL MOVE IF NECESSARY.
MR. NEWVILLE MOVES THAT, UH, WE AUTHORIZE THE ATTORNEYS TO PREPARE NEW SCHEDULING.
ALL OF THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
[13. Conduct an appeal hearing on behalf of Earnest Jones, BRPD.]
CONDUCT AN APPEAL HEARING ON BEHALF OF ERNEST JOHNS ON THE BATON ROUGE POLICE DEPARTMENT.UH, THIS IS THE APPEAL FOR, UH, MR. ERNEST JONES.
FIRST, I WANT TO APPRECIATE BOTH OF YOU GUYS FOR FOLLOWING THE, THE SCHEDULING ORDER AND COMPLYING THAT ALWAYS MAKES THINGS EASIER.
UM, I DO KNOW THAT THERE WAS A SUBPOENA DUCES TECUM.
HAVE Y'ALL WORKED THROUGH THAT IN TERMS OF PRODUCING DOCUMENTS TO EACH OTHER? MR. RAINS? I THE TEST FORM, UH, MIKE, I MICROPHONE, GO AHEAD.
YES, I BELIEVE, UH, ALL THE DOCUMENTS.
AND MAKE SURE Y'ALL ARE USING Y'ALL MICROPHONES FOR THE, FOR THE RECORD.
UM, WELL, I GUESS Y'ALL CAN MAKE APPEARANCES FOR THE RECORD AS WELL.
UH, ATTORNEY PHILLIP ROBINSON, UH,
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PRESENT WITH ATTORNEYS JTI CURLEY OF THE ROBINSON LAW FIRM PRESENT MR. EARNEST JONES.AND GENTLEMEN, I I, I KNOW THE BOARD HAS READ THROUGH EVERYTHING.
I DIDN'T SEE LIKE, ANY OBJECTIONS TO THE POLICE OFFICER BILL OF RIGHTS SPECIFICALLY.
WITH THAT BEING SAID, UH, WE'LL GET STARTED.
UH, WE'LL START WITH THE APPOINTING AUTHORITY AND THEN, UH, DOC, WE HAVE TWO DR. ROBINSON IN THE HOUSE, I THINK.
UM, UH, PRELIMINARY MATTER, WE'VE GOT WITNESSES OUT IN THE AUDIENCE.
UH, DO YOU WANNA GO AHEAD AND SEQUESTER THEM? SURE.
AND DO YOU WANNA SWEAR THEM IN NOW OR DO YOU WANT TO AS A GROUP OR DO YOU WANNA DO IT ONE BY ONE? NO, LET'S GO AHEAD AND GET EVERYBODY SWORN IN.
IF YOU'RE GONNA BE A, A WITNESS IN THIS MATTER, GO AHEAD AND COME UP TO THIS MICROPHONE HERE IN THE FRONT.
AND COUNSEL, CAN Y'ALL CONFIRM THAT THESE ARE ALL THE WITNESSES THAT ARE GONNA SPEAK? MR. JONES? YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND GO DOWN THERE TOO.
FROM US IS ALL THE WITNESS? YEAH.
ALRIGHT, EVERYBODY RAISE THEIR RIGHT HAND.
DOES EVERYBODY SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, SO HELP YOU GOD? I DO.
LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT EVERYBODY ANSWER IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.
AND WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO NOW IS PUT YOU GUYS UNDER WHAT WE CALL THE RULES SEQUESTRATION.
SO, UH, UNLESS YOU'RE THE APPOINTING AUTHORITY REP, WHICH THE CHIEF IS, OF COURSE, OR MR. JONES, THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO LEAVE THE ROOM AND YOU GUYS CANNOT DISCUSS THE CASE WITH EACH OTHER, UH, OR ANYBODY ELSE OTHER THAN THE ATTORNEYS.
ALRIGHT? ANY OTHER PRELIMINARY MATTERS, GENTLEMEN? JUST SIMPLY THE FIRST OH, NO.
UH, I, I THOUGHT I MADE IT CLEAR.
I'LL MAKE IT CLEAR AGAIN THAT, UH, MR. JONES IS EXCUSED FROM THE, UH, SEQUESTRATION ORDER.
OH, I'M GONNA PASS OUT BINDERS WHILE WE GREAT, SIR.
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THANK YOU.WE READY TO PROCEED? YES, SIR.
READY TO GO? IT'S EXACTLY 11 O'CLOCK, SO.
UH, THIS, THIS CASE IS, I, I BELIEVE, VERY SIMPLE.
UM, THIS IS A CASE OF A SUBORDINATE OFFICER FAILING TO RESPECT HIS CHAIN OF COMMAND AND REFUSING TO COMPLY WITH NUMEROUS DIRECT ORDERS FROM SUPERIOR OFFICERS.
UM, CORPORAL JONES, ERNEST JONES IS HIS NAME.
CORPORAL JONES IS, UH, YOU KNOW, HE'S A CORPORAL IN THE DEPARTMENT IN MARCH.
UH, HE HAD A FIELD TRAINING OFFICER, UM, ROOKIE GRIMES, OFFICER GRIMES.
THEY ANSWERED A CALL AND A REPORT WAS WRITTEN REGARDING AN INCIDENT BACK IN MARCH.
UH, AND THAT REPORT WAS WRITTEN BY OFFICER GRIMES.
UM, OFFICER GRIMES WAS, UM, UNDER THE SUPERVISION OF CORPORAL JONES.
CORPORAL JONES WAS HIS FIELD TRAINING OFFICER.
WHAT THAT, YOU'LL HEAR IT CALLED AN FTO LATER TODAY.
UM, WHEN YOU HAVE AN FTO, AND IF YOU'RE A ROOKIE, YOU CAN'T JUST GO OUT AND DO SOLO CALLS.
YOU, YOU ARE SUPERVISED BY YOUR FTO AS YOU'RE LEARNING TO DO THINGS, RIGHT? SO THAT WAS THE POSITION THAT THEY WERE IN.
SO THEY HAD A CALL OUT TO HOME DEPOT IN MARCH OF 2024.
AND AGAIN, OFFICER GRIMES WROTE THE REPORT.
AND THE REPORT IS PART OF WHAT WE'RE GONNA TALK A LOT ABOUT TODAY.
YOU'RE GONNA HEAR A LOT OF TESTIMONY ABOUT THE REPORT AND, AND THINGS ABOUT IT.
UM, THE VICTIM IN THE INCIDENT CONTACTED THE DEPARTMENT WHEN SHE REVIEWED THE REPORT, AND SHE HAD SOME CONCERNS ABOUT IT.
UM, AND SERGEANT ROMY SMITH, WHO YOU'LL ALSO, UM, HERE TESTIFY LATER TODAY, CALLED HER BACK, UH, RECORDED THAT CONVERSATION.
AND BASED ON HIS CONVERSATION WITH HER, DETERMINED THAT THERE'S SOME CHANGES THAT NEED TO BE MADE TO THE REPORT, HE ADVISED OFFICER GRIMES THAT THOSE CHANGES NEEDED TO BE MADE.
UH, OFFICER GRIMES TALKED TO CORPORAL JONES ABOUT THAT, AND CORPORAL JONES ADVISED HIM NOT TO CHANGE THE REPORT.
UH, THIS CONVERSATION BETWEEN SERGEANT SMITH AND OFFICER GRIMES WENT ON EVENTUALLY ON MAY 11 OF THIS YEAR, UH, SERGEANT SMITH SENT A, AN TEXT MESSAGE AND AN EMAIL TO OFFICER GRIMES AND SAID, I NEED YOU TO REVISE THAT REPORT.
IF YOU DO NOT DO IT, YOU'RE GOING TO BE WRITTEN UP.
AFTER OFFICER GRIMES RECEIVED THOSE COMMUNICATIONS FROM SERGEANT SMITH, HE REACHED OUT TO CORPORAL JONES ABOUT IT.
NOW, AT THIS TIME, AND WHAT'S IMPORTANT IS CORPORAL JONES HAD BEEN REMOVED AS HIS FIELD TRAINING OFFICER.
SO HE WAS NO LONGER HIS FIELD TRAINING OFFICER.
NO LONGER HAD DIRECT SUPERVISION OVER, OVER OFFICER GRIMES.
UM, BUT, UH, CORPORAL JONES WAS IN THE, UM, DIRECT SUPERVISION OF SERGEANT ROMY SMITH, AS WELL AS LIEUTENANT LONNIE MILLER.
AND YOU WILL HEAR THEM TESTIFY LATER TODAY AS WELL.
NOW, IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO KNOW THAT SERGEANT SMITH MADE A COMPLAINT ABOUT CORPORAL JONES LAST YEAR.
SO THERE WAS ALREADY SOME TENSION BETWEEN THEM BECAUSE OF THAT.
UM, AND BECAUSE OF THAT, SERGEANT SMITH RECORDED WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SEE HERE TODAY AND HEAR A LOT OF TESTIMONY ABOUT, UM, ONCE OFFICER GRIMES CONTACTED, UH, OR WAS CONTACTED BY SERGEANT SMITH, HE REACHED OUT TO CORPORAL JONES AND SAID, I'VE GOT THIS TEXT MESSAGE FROM SERGEANT SMITH.
CORPORAL JONES THEN REACHES OUT TO SERGEANT SMITH, UH, AND SETS UP A MEETING SO THAT THEY CAN TALK ABOUT THIS REPORT AND WHAT CHANGES NEED TO BE MADE TO THE REPORT.
AND IN THE ROOM AGAIN IS OFFICER GRIMES, CORPORAL JONES, UH, THE OFFICER HERE, AS WELL AS SERGEANT SMITH.
AND YOU'RE GONNA SEE IT ON, UH, UH, ON THE RECORDING HERE IN A BIT.
AS SOON AS SERGEANT SMITH ATTEMPTED TO START TALKING TO OFFICER GRIMES ABOUT THE REPORT, CORPORAL JONES INTERRUPTS HIM OVER AND OVER, TALKS OVER HIM.
SERGEANT SMITH ASKS HIM TO BE QUIET.
CORPORAL JONES REFUSES TO BE QUIET, CONTINUES TO TRY TO TALK.
THIS GOES ON FOR SEVERAL MINUTES.
UH, SERGEANT SMITH TELLS CORPORAL JONES DIRECTLY, YOU ARE BEING INSUBORDINATE.
UH, HE USES THE TERM HOLD WHAT YOU GOT.
A LOT OF TIMES HE'S ASKING HIM TO STOP TALKING.
UH, AGAIN, CORPORAL JONES REFUSES TO DO THAT.
UH, EVENTUALLY HE ASKED HIM TO LEAVE THE ROOM.
I'LL WORK WITH OFFICER GRIMES DIRECTLY.
HE REFUSES TO LEAVE THE ROOM AT THIS POINT.
HE'S HAD TWO DIRECT ORDERS GIVEN
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MULTIPLE TIMES, WHICH HE HAS REFUSED AGAIN.UM, SO THOSE WERE THE TWO DIRECT ORDERS.
AND THEN FOR A THIRD, HE WAS ASKED TO ASSIST OFFICER GRIMES IN REVISING THE REPORT.
HE SAID, WE'RE NOT CHANGING THE REPORT.
THAT WAS THE THIRD DIRECT ORDER THAT HE WAS GIVEN.
HE TOLD SERGEANT SMITH, I'M NOT OBEYING AN UNLAWFUL ORDER.
WELL, THERE ISN'T ANYTHING UNLAWFUL ABOUT ASKING SOMEONE TO REVISE A REPORT.
OKAY? UM, BOTH SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER TOLD, UH, AND YOU, YOU'LL HEAR LIEUTENANT MILLER AND SERGEANT SMITH TALK ABOUT THIS.
THEY TALKED TO CORPORAL JONES ABOUT THIS, AND THEY SAID, THIS IS NOT AN UNLAWFUL ORDER.
HE REFUSES TO LEAVE THE ROOM OVER AND OVER.
UM, LIEUTENANT MILLER COMES IN THE ROOM, UH, HE'S BROUGHT IN THERE BY SERGEANT SMITH.
YOU'LL SEE THIS ON THE, ON THE VIDEO.
UH, LIEUTENANT MILLER TELLS CORPORAL JONES, LOOK, I'VE TALKED TO THE TRAINING ACADEMY.
THERE IS NOTHING UNLAWFUL ABOUT THE ORDER YOU ARE BEING GIVEN.
YOU ARE BEING, UH, YOU'RE BEING INAPPROPRIATE IN FRONT OF YOUR ROOKIE.
THEY SENT THE ROOKIE OUT OF THE ROOM.
THEY CONTINUE, NOTHING GETS RESOLVED.
EVENTUALLY, THINGS CALM DOWN A LITTLE BIT.
LIEUTENANT MILLER BRINGS, OR SERGEANT SMITH BRINGS THE ROOKIE BACK IN THE ROOM TO WORK ON THE REPORT.
CORPORAL JONES STANDS UP, UH, GRABS THE COMPUTER THAT THE ROOKIE WAS WORKING WITH, CLOSES IT AND TAKES IT AWAY FROM HIM.
AT THAT POINT, THINGS HAD GOTTEN HEATED.
LIEUTENANT MILLER EVENTUALLY CALLS CHAIN OF COMMAND, AND CORPORAL JONES IS RELIEVED OF HIS DUTIES.
AN INTERNAL AFFAIRS CASE IS OPENED, A PREDIS HEARING IS HELD IN SEPTEMBER, AND HE HAS SUSTAINED ON TWO VIOLATIONS, UH, CARRYING OUT ORDERS AND INSUBORDINATION.
HE'S GIVEN TWO, UH, TOTAL OF FOUR DAYS SUSPENSION FOR THOSE.
AND THAT IS WHAT HE'S APPEALING HERE TODAY.
THERE REALLY CAN BE NO DOUBT THAT HE VIOLATED THESE POLICIES.
IN FACT, IF THE TRAINING ACADEMY WANTED TO HAVE A VIDEO ON EXACTLY WHAT DOES INSUBORDINATION CARRYING OUT ORDERS LOOK LIKE, FAILING TO CARRY OUT ORDERS.
YOU WILL SEE IT AS YOU WATCH IT HERE TODAY.
YOUR JOB AS A BOARD IS TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THE CHIEF HAD, UH, JUST CAUSE AND WAS IN GOOD FAITH FOR MAKING HIS DECISION TO UPHOLD DISCIPLINE AGAINST CORPORAL JONES FOR THOSE TWO POLICIES.
OKAY? UM, LIKE I SAID, THERE REALLY CAN BE NO DOUBT THAT HE VIOLATED THOSE POLICIES.
I CAN'T SAY IT'S IN BLACK AND WHITE.
UM, AND THE QUESTION IS NOT FOR YOU WHETHER YOU WOULD'VE RULED IN A DIFFERENT WAY, NOT WHETHER YOU WOULD'VE BEEN LESS HARSH OR MORE HARSH.
WITH CORPORAL JONES, IT'S WHETHER OR NOT THE CHIEF HAD GOOD CAUSE, UH, AND WAS IN GOOD FAITH JUST CAUSE AND GOOD FAITH FOR DOING WHAT HE DID.
UM, AND IF YOU FIND THAT THE EVIDENCE IS THERE SUPPORTING THOSE CHARGES, THEN YOU MUST UPHOLD WHAT THE CHIEF DID THAT DAY.
AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WE WILL ASK YOU TO DO AT THE END OF THE HEARING TODAY.
FIRST OFF, GOOD MORNING, AND, UH, THANK YOU TO THE LADY AND GENTLEMEN OF THE BOARD.
UH, ALLOW ME TO BEGIN BY SAYING, UM, CORPORAL JONES, UH, ERNEST JONES, AS HE SITS TO MY RIGHT, HAS BEEN A MEMBER OF THE BATON ROUGE POLICE DEPARTMENT FOR NEARLY A DECADE NOW, UH, NEARLY 10 YEARS.
UH, CORPORAL JONES IS A GREAT POLICE OFFICER.
UH, NOT MANY TIMES WHEN I'M BEFORE ANYBODY, UH, ANY TYPE OF BODY, I'M ALLOWED TO PERSONALLY SAY THAT I KNOW THE PERSON OR THAT I'M REPRESENTING.
UM, AND ALTHOUGH IT DOESN'T HAVE ANY WEIGHT INTO YOUR DECISIONS OF THIS HEARING, I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR THAT I DO KNOW CORPORAL JONES PERSONALLY, AND I'VE KNOWN HIM FOR NEARLY 15 YEARS.
UM, HE'S A PERSON OF STRONG CHARACTER AND HE'S A PERSON OF UNWAVERING LOYALTY.
UH, THESE ARE THE TYPE OF QUALITIES, I THINK A PERSON WHO IS A MEMBER OF A POLICE DEPARTMENT WOULD WANT TO HAVE.
THE PERSON SERVING NEXT TO YOU TO HAVE, UM, CORPORAL JONES IS ALL ABOUT TRANSPARENCY.
UM, THE REASON YOU'RE GONNA HEAR IN THIS VIDEO, THERE'S, THE REASON WE EVEN HEAR IS BECAUSE CORPORAL JONES WANTED TRANSPARENCY.
UH, CORPORAL JONES BELIEVES IN TRANSPARENCY AND HE BELIEVES IN ANTI-BULLYING.
HE HAS COMPASSION FOR THOSE WHO CAN'T DEFEND THEMSELVES.
AND ESSENTIALLY THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TODAY.
UM, COMPASSION FOR THOSE WHO CAN'T DEFEND THEMSELVES IN THIS MATTER WAS THE ACTIONS OF HIS ROLE AS A REPRESENTATIVE REPRESENTING, UH, A ROOKIE OFFICER, UH, OFFICER GRIMES.
UH, THESE ARE ACTIONS AND BEHAVIORS THAT SHOULD BE APPLAUDED, BUT WE FIND OURSELVES, OFFICER JONES AND CORPORAL JONES BEING DISCIPLINED
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FOR THESE, UH, THESE POSITIVE TRAITS.UM, THIS COMES DOWN TO INTEGRITY, UH, AND I THINK INTENT MATTERS IN ALL THESE THINGS, UH, WHEN GIVING AN ORDER THAT YOU FEEL IS UNLAWFUL AND YOU FEEL BEING IS BEING DECEPTIVE.
UH, HE HAD A DUTY TO SPEAK UP AND HE HAD A DUTY TO STAND UP FOR, UH, A ROOKIE OFFICER WHO BEING FORCED TO REMAIN IN THIS MEETING, YOU KNOW, WAS ASKED TO DO SOMETHING THAT CORPORAL JONES HONESTLY FELT WAS AN ILLEGAL ACT.
UM, YOU KNOW, THE VIDEO WILL BE PLAYED.
UH, AND I, I GUESS I'LL, I'LL RESERVE THIS FOR ARGUMENT LATER, BUT, UH, I JUST RESPECTFULLY ASK THIS BOARD TO, WHEN YOU WATCH A VIDEO, WATCH THE WATCH IT IN ITS ENTIRETY.
UH, YOU'LL SEE WHAT, UH, ATTORNEY RAINS MENTIONED, UH, UP UNTIL THE POINT OF CORPORAL JONES BEING RELEASED.
UH, THOSE ARE THE IMPORTANT PARTS I ASKED YOU TO WATCH AND MAINTAIN YOUR JUDGMENT ON MR. ON CORPORAL JONES' ACTIONS UNTIL YOU'VE SEEN THE ENTIRETY OF THE VIDEO.
UM, FROM THAT POINT, UM, WE FEEL THAT THERE HAS BEEN DISCIPLINARY ACTIONS TAKEN AGAINST CORPORAL JONES, UM, FROM, I BELIEVE I HAVE THE DATE HERE OF, FROM THE MAY 11TH TO AUGUST 12TH.
HE WAS RELIEVED OF HIS, THEY, THEY TOOK HIS COMMISSION CARD.
UH, THAT AFFECTS OFFICERS IN DIFFERENT WAYS THAT THAT AFFECTS THEIR ABILITY TO BE POLICE OFFICERS THAT AFFECTS THEIR ABILITY TO WORK EXTRA DUTY.
UH, THERE HAS BEEN PENALTIES THAT, UH, OFFICER JONES OR CORPORAL JONES HAS SUSTAINED IN THIS MATTER, UH, THAT WE DON'T FEEL WERE WARRANTED AT ALL DESPITE BEING WITHIN THE DISCRETION OF THE CHIEF.
UM, WE FEEL THAT HIS ACTIONS ULTIMATELY, WERE ONLY TRYING TO UPHOLD INTEGRITY FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND UTMOST TRANSPARENCY.
UM, AND WE WOULD LIKE TO PROCEED HOWEVER YOU WANT TO MOVE FORWARD.
IT SEEMS THAT THE VIDEOS AND ORDER THEM, DID THAT LIFT UP? NO.
UH, THEY WOULD START THEIR CASE IN CHIEF, THE APPOINTING AUTHORITY.
WE'LL, UH, CALL CORPORAL JONES TO THE STAND.
YEAH, IF YOU'VE BEEN SWORN IN ALREADY.
SO, UM, IF YOU WOULD PLEASE GIVE YOUR NAME AND BUSINESS ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.
THAT BUSINESS ADDRESS? YEAH, JUST, OKAY.
UH, CORPORAL ERNEST JONES, UH, 9,000 AIRLINE HIGHWAY.
UH, WHAT'S YOUR CURRENT RANK AND ASSIGNMENT? UH, I'M A CORPORAL.
I'M CURRENTLY ASSIGNED TO FORT DAYS A ROTATION.
CORPORAL JONES, IF YOU WOULD PLEASE TURN TO EXHIBIT 11, BOOK THE BINDER BEFORE YOU, THAT'S A COPY OF THE PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING NOTICE IN CASE OH 34 DASH 24, WHICH IS YOUR CASE.
AND THAT'S ADDRESSED TO YOU, IS THAT CORRECT? YES, SIR.
UM, YOUR NOTICE LETTER OUTLINES THE FACTS REGARDING THE INCIDENT THAT ROSE RESULTED IN THE INVESTIGATION INVOLVING YOU AND ALSO THE POTENTIAL POLICY VIOLATIONS.
IS THAT CORRECT? I'M ASSUMING YOU WANTED ME TO READ THE ENTIRE THING OR WELL HAVE, YOU'VE REVIEWED IT BEFORE, IS THAT RIGHT? YES, SIR, I HAVE.
SO THE, WHEN YOU REVIEWED IT BEFORE, DOES THAT LETTER OUTLINE WHAT THE FACTS ARE AND THE POTENTIAL VIOLATIONS OF A POLICY? UM, I THINK IT LEFT OUT, UM, ABOUT THE INFORMATION, SO, AND I EXPLAINED THAT IN MY, IN MY PREVIOUS INCIDENT.
BUT DOES THAT LETTER TALK ABOUT THE EVENTS THAT OCCURRED ON MAY 11TH, 2024 FOR WHICH YOU WERE ULTIMATELY DISCIPLINED? CORRECT.
MAYBE, UH, 80% OF THE INCIDENT.
[00:40:01]
IF YOU RETURN TO THE LAST PAGE OF THE DOCUMENT, CAN YOU IDENTIFY WHETHER THAT'S YOUR SIGNATURE OR NOT? YES, SIR.SO YOU, YOU DON'T DISPUTE THAT THAT IS A COPY OF THE PREDIS NOTICE THAT YOU RECEIVED AND SIGNED, CORRECT? CORRECT.
SO WE'LL OFFER THAT AS OUR EXHIBIT 11.
I HAVE TO, I EXHIBIT 11 IS ADMITTED.
NOW, ULTIMATELY ON SEPTEMBER 25 OF THIS YEAR, YOU PARTICIPATED IN A PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING.
UM, AND YOU WERE REPRESENTED BY COUNSEL AT THE HEARING? NO, SIR.
UM, AS A RESULT OF THE HEARING, ULTIMATELY YOU RECEIVED A NOTICE OF RULING, IS THAT, DO YOU RECALL THAT? YES, SIR.
IF YOU WOULD PLEASE TURN TO EXHIBIT 12.
IS THAT A COPY OF, IS EXHIBIT 12 A COPY OF THE NOTICE OF RULING THAT YOU RECEIVED FROM CHIEF MORRISE? YES, SIR.
AND IF YOU TURN TO AGAIN, THE LAST PAGE OF THAT DOCUMENT, IS YOUR SIGNATURE ON THAT PAGE? NO.
AND WE'LL MOVE THAT EXHIBIT 12.
ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE NOTICE OF RULING AS WELL? UH, MEANING HAVE, HAVE YOU REVIEWED THE NOTICE OF RULING OR AWARE OF ITS CONTENTS? OH, YES, SIR.
DO, DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHY BASED ON THE LETTER, UM, IT SAYS THAT THE CHIEF DISCIPLINED YOU? UH, I SEE THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS INVESTIGATION AND, UM, THEN I WAS QUESTIONED DURING THE HEARING AND THEN I RECEIVED A, A, A PUNISHMENT.
AND, AND THE LETTER ITSELF OUTLINES THE REASONS FOR THAT, CORRECT? WE DIDN'T, WE DIDN'T REFERENCE THIS INSIDE THE HEARING.
UM, BUT THAT COMES AFTER THE HEARING.
YOU RECEIVED IT AFTER THE HEARING, CORRECT.
THIS NOTICE THEY GAVE US, THEY GAVE US THE IA INVESTIGATION, BUT MY QUESTIONS WERE DIFFERENT INSIDE THE, UH, PREDIS.
I THINK I'M, I'M, WE'RE MISSING EACH OTHER.
UM, THE NOTICE OF RULING, THE, THE ONE THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT RIGHT THERE, EXHIBIT 12, RIGHT.
THAT LETTER DESCRIBES CHIEF MORRIS'S THAT, LIKE THE FACTS BASE THAT HE, THAT HE, UM, EXPLAINS IN THAT LETTER.
THOSE ARE THE FACTS UPON WHICH HE MADE HIS DECISION.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT, UM, HIS SIGNATURE IS ON HERE, THIS IS THE IA INVESTIGATION, CORRECT? THIS IS HIS SIGNATURE, BUT THE QUESTION WERE DIFFERENT.
AM I MISUNDERSTANDING YOU? UH, YEAH.
LET'S JUST BACK UP A LITTLE BIT.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE PURPOSE OF WHY YOU RECEIVED A NOTICE OF RULING? RIGHT.
AND THAT'S FOR THE CHIEF TO EXPLAIN TO YOU WHETHER OR NOT YOU'RE DISCIPLINED AND WHY YOU'RE DISCIPLINED, RIGHT? CORRECT.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO YOU? YES, SIR.
SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE FAMILIAR NOW WITH WHY THE CHIEF DISCIPLINED YOU BASED ON THIS LETTER, RIGHT? THE PREDIS.
UM, AND IN THAT LETTER IT SHOWS THAT YOU WERE, UH, SUSTAINED ON TWO VIOLATIONS, THREE 18 CARRYING OUT ORDERS AND THREE 19 INSUBORDINATION, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AND FOR THAT, YOU RECEIVED A TOTAL OF A FOUR DAY SUSPENSION? YES, SIR.
NOW, THE INCIDENT THAT, UH, FOR WHICH YOU WERE DISCIPLINED, THAT OCCURRED ON MAY 11TH, 2024, IS THAT CORRECT? UM, ACTUALLY IT WAS BEHIND THE REPORT, NOT SO MUCH WHAT HAPPENED ON MAY 11TH.
THEY ASKED ME ABOUT WHY DID I GIVE DIFFERENT CHARGES ON THE REPORT, WHICH I EXPLAINED.
UM, THEY ASKED ME IF I WAS GRIMES IS, UH, FTO, UH, WHEN YOU SAY THEY, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE MEETING BECAUSE I'M, YEAH.
WELL, UH, CHIEF MORRIS ASKED ME THOSE QUESTIONS.
OH, WELL, ALONG WITH THE OTHER PANEL, THEY ASKED ME WHY DID I MAKE THOSE CHARGES AND WHY DID I MAKE A DECISION TO CHARGE THE YOUNG LADY WITH A MISDEMEANOR INSTEAD OF A FELON.
BUT DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THE, THE FINDINGS OF INSUBORDINATION AND CARRYING OUT ORDERS, THOSE ARE RELATED TO THE EVENTS OF THE MEETING THAT YOU HAD WITH SERGEANT SMITH AS WELL AS LIEUTENANT MILLER ON MAY 11TH, 2024.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO YOU? YEAH.
UM, BEFORE MAY 11TH, YOU HAD BEEN, UH, AND LET'S GO BACK TO THE DATE THAT THIS, THIS REPORT THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WAS INITIALLY DONE BACK IN MARCH, RIGHT? MARCH 25TH.
SO YOU WERE THE FIELD TRAINING OFFICER FOR OFFICER GRIMES AT THAT TIME, CORRECT? THAT'S PRIMARY FIELD TRAINING OFFICER.
[00:45:01]
THE REPORT THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE, AND WE'LL SHOW YOU IN JUST A SEC THAT REPORT, YOU, YOU WERE PART OF THAT INVESTIGATION OR YOU PARTICIPATING IN THAT INVESTIGATION? YES, SIR.NOW, ON MAY 11TH, WHEN YOU MET WITH SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER, YOU WERE NO LONGER THE FTO FOR OFFICER GRIMES, CORRECT? NO.
WELL, YOU HAVE BASIS TO WHERE THEY, UM, GIVE HIM A PRIMARY FTO AND THEN THEY GO TO TWO OTHER PHASES, THEN THEY COME BACK TO THEIR PRIMARY, I'M HIS PRIMARY FTO, MEANING HE WOULD'VE CAME BACK TO ME IN HIS FINAL PHASE.
BUT YOU, YOU WERE NOT HIS FTO AT THAT TIME, CORRECT? NOT AT THAT TIME, NO, SIR.
UM, NOW, EARLIER WHEN YOUR ATTORNEY WAS GIVING HIS OPENING STATEMENT, HE REFERRED TO YOU AS THE REPRESENTATIVE OF OFFICER GRIMES.
NOBODY POINTED YOU AS HIS REPRESENTATIVE IN ANY CAPACITY, DID THEY? WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT? HE DID.
WELL, HE, ANYTIME YOU, ANYTIME YOU'RE THREATENING DISCIPLINE, A SUPERVISOR THREATENS YOU, DISCIPLINE, YOU DO HAVE THE RIGHT FOR SOMEBODY TO COME IN AND SIT WITH YOU.
WELL, SO THAT THERE IS A CONTEXT OF DISCIPLINE WITHIN WHICH THAT MIGHT OCCUR, THAT'S NOT THE PURPOSE FOR WHICH YOU WENT TO THAT MEETING? YES.
THE PURPOSE YOU WENT TO THAT MEETING WAS TO DISCUSS ISSUES RELATED TO THE REPORT, CORRECT? NO, I WENT THERE FOR, THE TEXT MESSAGE TO REPORT WAS ACTUALLY LOCKED, UH, MAY 1ST RMS LOCKED MAY 1ST.
SO IT, WE WERE UNABLE TO CHANGE THE REPORT REGARDLESS.
WE WOULD'VE HAD TO GO INTO EXXON, EXXON AND RETYPE THE REPORT COMPLETELY IN ORDER TO CHANGE IT.
YOU ARE, YOU WERE NOT A UNION REPRESENTATIVE FOR OFFICER GRIMES ON MAY 11TH, 2024, CORRECT? HE GOT OTHER, HE HAVE OTHER OPTIONS YEAH.
YOU WERE NOT NO, I'M NOT A UNION REP, NO, SIR.
SO YOU WERE NOT A RECOGNIZED UNION REPRESENTATIVE TO REPRESENT HIM WHEN MEETING WITH SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER, CORRECT? NO, I WAS NOT A UNION REP, NO, SIR.
AND YOU WERE NOT IN THE CHAIN OF COMMAND FOR OFFICER GRIMES AT THAT TIME? YES.
HIS FTO GAVE HIM PERMISSION, WHICH WE SHOWED IN A TEXT MESSAGE.
HIS FTO GAVE HIM PERMISSION TO MEET WITH ME SINCE I WAS THE PRIMARY OFFICER.
HE SAID, MEET WITH JONES AND THEN YOU CAN GO DISCUSS IT WITH SERGEANT SMIT.
AND SHE GOT PERMISSION FROM CAPTAIN SIBLEY AT THE FIRST DISTRICT.
SO YOU ARE SAYING THAT AN FTO GAVE HIM PERMISSION TO MEET WITH YOU, BUT YOU WERE NOT HIS CHAIN OF COMMAND ON MAY 11TH, 2024.
HIS CHAIN OF COMMAND GAVE HIM PERMISSION TO MEET IT.
YOU WERE NOT HIS CHAIN OF COMMAND, BUT SERGEANT SMITH WAS IN YOUR CHAIN OF COMMAND, RIGHT? YES, SIR.
LIEUTENANT LONNIE MILLER WAS IN YOUR CHAIN OF COMMAND, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
NOW, YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT, BUT ON MAY 11, OFFICER GRIMES CONTACTED YOU AND SAID THAT HE HAD BEEN CONTACTED BY SERGEANT SMITH, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AND THAT WAS ABOUT THE POLICE REPORT, RIGHT? UH, WELL, HE, HE SAID HE WAS GONNA PUNISHMENT IF PUNISH HIM IF HE DID NOT CHANGE THE REPORT, IF HE DID NOT CHANGE THE REPORT, RIGHT? CORRECT.
SO TURN TO TAB THREE FOR ME PLEASE.
THE REPORT IN FRONT OF YOU IS IDENTIFIED AS WHAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED AS EXHIBIT THREE.
ON THE TOP RIGHT HAND CORNER IT SAYS REPORT NUMBER 24 DASH 0 2 9 3 7 4, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AND THE REPORT OFFICER IS OFFICER RONALD GRIMES? YES, SIR.
AND AS THE OFFICER WHO WAS THE ROOKIE THAT, UH, YOU ARE THE FTO FOR ON MARCH 25TH? YES, SIR.
AND IF WE LOOK AT THE VERY LAST, OR SECOND TO LAST PAGE, PAGE EIGHT OF NINE, IT SHOWS THAT, UH, RONALD GRIMES IS THE PRIMARY ON THE REPORT, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AND THEN YOU WERE LISTED BE BEHIND THAT ON THE SECOND, THE, THE LAST PAGE OF THE REPORT? VERY LAST PAGE NINE NINE.
ALRIGHT, WE'LL OFFER THIS AS EXHIBIT THREE.
EXHIBIT THREE IS, UM, ACCEPTED.
NOW, WHEN WHEN YOU WENT TO MEET WITH SERGEANT SMITH, UM, YOU'RE AWARE THAT THAT MEETING WAS RECORDED, CORRECT? UH, SOMEWHERE DOWN THE, DOWN THE LINE.
AND, UM, BUT AS YOU SIT HERE TODAY, YOU'RE AWARE IT WAS RECORDED RIGHT AT TODAY? YES, SIR.
AND HAVE YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW THAT, UH, BODY CAM FOOTAGE? YES, SIR, I HAVE.
AND THAT IS FROM SERGEANT SMITH'S BODY CAMERA, IS THAT RIGHT? YES, SIR.
AND HE KEPT HIS CAMERA ON WHILE YOU WERE PRESENT IN THE ROOM WITH HIM? YES, SIR.
[00:50:01]
TO MY, TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, THE DAY OF IT, UM, IT'S LIKE UP IN THE AIR AND I EXPLAINED THAT TO THE IA INVESTIGATOR.I WASN'T SURE IF HE WAS RECORDING ME OR NOT.
YOU, YOU'RE AWARE AS OF TODAY THOUGH? YES, SIR.
YOU WERE RECORDED WHAT, DURING THAT MEETING AND AT SOME POINT DURING THE MEETING HE TOLD YOU HE WAS RECORDING IT, RIGHT? UH, HE TOLD THAT TO THE, UH, UNION REP THAT HE WAS RECORDING.
YOU DON'T RECALL HIM TELLING YOU? UH, I CAN'T REMEMBER.
I JUST FIGURED NOW I'M, I'M NOT GETTING INTO THE DETAILS OF THIS, BUT THIS, THERE WAS A PRIOR TIME WHERE SERGEANT SMITH HAD WRITTEN UP, WRITTEN YOU UP BEFORE, IS THAT RIGHT? UH, IT WAS A CONFERENCE WORKSHEET HE TOLD ME.
UM, AND, AND I DON'T REALLY WANNA GET INTO THE DETAILS OF THAT 'CAUSE THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR TODAY.
BUT, UH, LEMME JUST ASK IT THIS WAY.
WAS THERE A BIT OF FRICTION OR TENSION BETWEEN THE TWO OF YOU BECAUSE OF PAST HISTORY? LEMME JUST ASK IT LIKE THAT.
UH, I ATTEMPTED TO REPORT HIM FOR HIS, UH, HIS ACTIONS TOWARDS MYSELF AND THE SQUAD.
AND THEN THAT CREATED A, A TENSION.
I ACTUALLY REQUESTED TO SEE THE CHIEF, UH, THREE OR FOUR TIMES IN JANUARY TO DISCUSS THOSE ITEMS. ALRIGHT.
AND, UH, THAT CREATED THE ATTENTION.
NOW I'M, WHAT I'M GONNA DO IN JUST A SECOND IS I'M GONNA SHOW YOU PORTIONS OF THE MAY 11TH MEETING, OKAY? OKAY.
UM, WE'VE MARKED IT AS EXHIBIT ONE IN OUR BINDER.
AND FOR THE PURPOSE OF THE RECORD, THERE IS A THUMB DRIVE THAT'S GOT A RECORDING OF THAT.
UM, IT'S IN MR. DE'S FOLDER AS WELL AS THE RECORD FOLDER.
THE, THE VIDEO ITSELF IS VERY LONG.
THERE'S PORTIONS WHERE PEOPLE ARE JUST SITTING AROUND, NOTHING'S HAPPENING.
SO I'M GOING TO FAST FORWARD A COUPLE OF SPOTS.
THIS, THIS IS WHERE I HAVE TO INTERJECT, IF I MAY.
UM, I, I HOLD OBJECTION TO ONLY PARTIAL CLIPS OF THE VIDEO BEING PLAYED.
UH, I THINK A REMEDY FOR THAT, SINCE THE VIDEO WILL BE ADMITTED INTO EVIDENCE, LIKELY, UH, IF I'M ALLOWED TO REPLAY SIMILAR PORTIONS OF THE VIDEO, IF ONLY SECTIONS ARE PLAYED FOR THE BOARD.
I THINK IT'S NOT FAIR TO THIS HEARING AND TO THIS BOARD IF YOU'RE ONLY ABLE TO WITNESS CERTAIN EXCERPTS WITHOUT CONTEXT OF THE ENTIRETY OF THE VIDEO.
SO JUST FOR CLARITY, YOU WANT TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO PLAY YOUR OWN, UH, EXCERPTS AS WELL.
OF, OF, UH, BAT ROUGE POLICE DEPARTMENT'S EXHIBIT.
I BELIEVE THIS IS EXHIBIT, IT'S EXHIBIT ONE FOR US.
IF I CAN BE ABLE TO PLAY, I THINK THAT'LL RE REMEDY MY ISSUES WITH SURE.
THEM ONLY PLAYING EXCERPTS RIGHT NOW.
AND IOT ASK ABOUT THAT IS, 'CAUSE WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THIS, THERE ARE SOME PORTIONS THAT HE WANTS TO PLAY THAT I BELIEVE ARE IRRELEVANT TO THIS HEARING.
SO I WOULD JUST ASK THAT WHEN IT COMES TIME FOR HIM TO, TO REQUEST TO PLAY VIDEO, THAT WE JUST HAVE DISCOURSE ABOUT OUR OBJECTION OVER IT.
I, I THINK TO, TO DELAY A DECISION ON WHETHER I CAN DO IT LATER AND AGREE TO IT NOW WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, INTENTIOUS TO, TO MY ARGUMENT AND MY POSITION.
SO WHAT I, IT'S ADMITTED, I THINK THE WHOLE VIDEO SHOULD BE ADMITTED.
WHAT I THINK WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO IS THE WHOLE VIDEO IS GONNA BE ADMITTED.
MR. RAINS IS GONNA OBVIOUSLY FOCUS ON WHAT HE THINKS IS IMPORTANT.
YOU'LL HAVE THE SAME OPPORTUNITY AND AS FAR AS WHO OBJECTS TO WHETHER OR NOT IT'S RELEVANT, Y'ALL CAN DO THAT IN REAL TIME.
UM, SO I, I THINK YOU CAN SIT DOWN FOR A FEW MINUTES BECAUSE IT'S GONNA PLAY FOR A WHILE.
UM, JUST FOR CONTEXT, THIS IS GONNA BE SERGEANT SMITH, UH, CORPORAL JONES AND OFFICER GRIMES IN A ROOM TOGETHER AT THIRD DISTRICT.
UM, AND AGAIN, THIS MAY BE A RELEVANCY ARGUMENT.
UM, I UNDERSTAND WHY YOU'RE PLAYING IT AT THE SECONDS BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN THE AUDIO STARTS.
UM, WELL THERE'S A, THERE'S A PHONE CALL THAT SERGEANT SMITH IS TAKING ABOUT ANOTHER MATTER, ANOTHER POLICE MATTER.
SO I'M STARTING IT RIGHT WHEN HE GETS OFF THE PHONE.
I THINK THE, UH, THE ENTRANCE OF ALL THE WITNESSES INTO THE ROOM IS RELEVANT.
IT'S, IT'S A MINUTE AND A HALF.
I'M JUST, YOU COULD JUST PLAY IT FROM THE VERY BEGINNING AND THEN SKIP TO THIS, THIS MOMENT.
UH, IT'S ONLY A MINUTE AND A HALF.
IF IT'S TOO LOUD OR NOT LOUD ENOUGH, YOU'LL
[00:55:30]
UH, GO AHEAD KAYLA.WHAT YOU GOT? HEY, YOU UM, CHARGE AGAINST THE JUVENILE OR DOMESTIC BEEF BACK.
YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO IDENTIFY WHO THE MOM AND THE SON IS.
I JUST DON'T KNOW WHOSE SON IS.
AND MY SON IS UNKNOWN IN HIS PERSONAL PAGE.
BUT WHAT I'M SAYING, CALEB, IS THAT YOU, YOU, YOU HADN'T TALKED TO THE MAMA OR THE, OR THE SON AND YOU THERE BECAUSE SOMEBODY FROM THE STORE CONTACTED YOU.
SO THEY LEFT THE SCENE BEFORE YOU GOT THERE, GOT, SO YOU DON'T HAVE INFORMATION ON IT, YOU KNOW, SO JUST WRITE IT HOW HEADQUARTERS DISPATCHED YOU THERE AND THE PARTY WAS GONE PRIOR TO YOU ROBBERY.
YOU CAN'T PUT CHARGES ON NOBODY 'CAUSE YOU GOTTA HAVE A VICTIM IF YOU DON'T HAVE ONE.
SO WRITE IT AS A NONCRIME THEN THAT THIS WOULD BE A NONCRIME PUBLIC ASSIST.
YOU KNOW, IT WAS UH, YOU WAS DISPATCHED TO A THIRD.
UH, IT CAN ACTUALLY BE A DISTURBANCE BUT YOU AIN'T GONNA HAVE AN OFFENSE.
YOU KNOW, IT COULD BE A 4 0 1.
YOU KNOW THAT'S WHAT YOU WAS DISPATCHED TO AND EVERYBODY WAS GONE BEFORE YOU GOT THERE.
IT WAS A 4 0 2 AND UH, AND THEY LEFT BEFORE YOU GOT THERE.
HOW YOU DOING TODAY? I'M GOOD.
WHAT'D YOU SAY? I SAID I'M TRYING TO BE GOOD.
I'M TRYING JUST ROLL WITH YOU.
WHO YOU WORKING WITH? I WAS WORKING WITH YOU WAS ON DAY SHIFT? YEAH.
YOU WAS WITH WHO? AARON UH, SEYMOUR.
MR. RYANS, CAN YOU TURN IT UP? YOU WANT ME TO SEYMOUR AARON'S OFF.
HEY, SO WHAT'S IMPORTANT HOLD UP.
DO NOT BE INSUBORDINATE WITH ME.
YOU GOT THAT? THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING.
I'M TALKING TO RONALD GRIMES RIGHT NOW.
YOU WAS AS FTO, RIGHT? I'M TALKING TO RONDA GRIMES RIGHT NOW.
WHEN I FINISH TALKING TO RON, RONALD GRIMES RIGHT NOW, THEN I'M GONNA DIVERT MY ATTENTION TO YOU.
BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M DEALING WITH WITH YOU.
OKAY? UH, WHAT'S THE LAST THING I ASKED YOU? GRAHAM, SIR.
ALL RIGHT, LISTEN, I AIN'T TALKING TO YOU.
SO WHEN HE WAS ON THE SQUAD, I TRIED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THE REPORT WRITING AND HOW YOU SHOULD WRITE THE REPORT.
OKAY? AS SOON AS YOU GOT TO THE SQUAD, YOUR VERY FIRST DAY CORPORAL JONES HAD YOU.
HEY LISTEN, I'M I HEY YOU BEING INSUBORDINATE? I AM TALKING TO, I'M TALKING TO GRIMES.
I'M ASKING, I'M TALKING TO GRIMES AND I'M GONNA TALK TO YOU AFTERWARDS.
SO I NEED YOU NOT TO INTERRUPT ME AND NOT CUT ME UP.
OKAY? I NEED YOU TO HOLD WHAT YOU GOT RESTRAINING.
WHAT YOU GOT? I'M ASKING A LIEUTENANT THIRD PARTY CORPORAL JONES.
I SAID HOLD WHAT YOU GOT UNTIL I GET TO YOU.
I'M TALKING TO OFFICER GRIMES RIGHT NOW.
AND I'M NOT TALKING TO YOU ABOUT THE COURT.
SO YOU HAVE TO TALK TO, HEY, I'M GONNA PUT YOU OUTTA HERE JONES.
HOW DID YOU PUT ME OUT? OUT? 'CAUSE I'M A SUPERVISOR.
I TOLD YOU I'M GONNA TALK TO YOU LIKE THAT.
I'M TALKING TO GRINDS RIGHT NOW.
SIT THERE AND BE QUIET UNTIL I GET TO YOU.
OKAY? WHEN YOU WAS ON THIS SQUAD, UH, GRIMES, I TRIED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU THE CORRECT WAY TO WRITE REPORTS IN WHICH YOU NEED TO DO THAT SAME REPORT.
I KICKED IT BACK BECAUSE WHEN YOU INITIALLY WROTE IT, LISTEN TO CORPORATE'S ROOM, IT WAS INCORRECT.
OKAY? SO AFTER I TOLD YOU WHAT THE LADY SAID WHEN SHE CALLED UP HERE, IT IS NO DIFFERENT THAN YOU WORKING THE DESK AND SOMEBODY, HEY LISTEN, THE JOAN KNOW WHAT YOU NEED TO DO.
I'M GOING, HE GOING LISTEN, GET OUTTA HERE.
GO GO INTO THE ROLL CALL ROOM.
I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU DON'T SUPERVISE MEETING ALREADY.
I NEED YOU LI TO GET UP OUTTA HERE.
YOU I'M GONNA GET THE LIEUTENANT, OKAY? OKAY.
'CAUSE I'M GONNA WRITE YOU UP SOME
[01:00:01]
MORE.CAN YOU COME IN HERE PLEASE? NOW AS I WAS SAYING, I'M STILL TALKING TO OFFICER GRIMES AND I WOULD LIKE, HEY, I NEED YOU TO BE QUIET WHILE I'M TALKING TO GRIMES JONES.
THIS IS HAVE TO DO ABOUT THE REPORT.
WHEN YOU WAS ON THE SQUAD, I TRIED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU THE CORRECT WAY TO WRITE THAT REPORT.
'CAUSE WHEN Y'ALL INITIALLY WROTE IT FOLLOWING CORPORAL JONES' INSTRUCTIONS, YOU DIDN'T WRITE IT CORRECTLY.
THE LADY CALLED UP HERE COMPLAINED.
I THEN CONTACTED YOU LIKE I NORMALLY WOULD DO.
AN OFFICER SAY, HEY, YOU WROTE IT LIKE THIS.
THE COMPLAINANT CALLED AND SAID THIS, YOU NEED TO FIX THE REPORT.
NORMALLY OFFICER GO AND THEY'LL FIX THE REPORT.
BUT CORPORAL JONES ADVISED YOU IN OTHER DIRECTION.
OKAY? THE REPORT IS STILL PENDING.
I TRIED TO CALL YOU A COUPLE TIMES.
THEY EVEN CALLED YOUR FTO HAD THEM PUT YOU ON THE PHONE TO FIX THE REPORT.
YOU TOLD ME Y'ALL WENT TO THE TRAINING ACADEMY.
TRAINING ACADEMY SAID THE REPORT WAS CORRECT.
OKAY? CORPORAL JONES WENT OVER TO TRAINING ACADEMY AND LIEUTENANT CARL MAYO EVEN TOLD HIM WHAT HE WAS SAYING WAS INCORRECT AND HIS SUPERVISORS WAS CORRECT.
HEY, I'M NOT TALKING TO YOU JONES.
IT WAS THE DAY WE HAD UH, SQUAD TRAINING.
LIEUTENANT MAYO CAME TO SEE ME AND EVERYTHING HE'S SAYING IS CORRECT.
NOW THE REASON WHY THIS REPORT IS SO IMPORTANT BECAUSE THIS ONE REPORT CAN GO UP ALL THE WAY UP TO THE SUPREME COURT AND BECOME CASE LAW.
YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT BECAUSE YOU ARE ON PROBATION.
YOU ARE A ROOKIE AND YOU LEARNING, I GOT THAT YOU WERE BEING INCORRECTLY TRAINED BY CORPORAL JONES.
THAT'S WHY HE'S NO LONGER FTO.
SO WHAT NEED TO HAPPEN TODAY? YOU NEED TO WRITE THE REPORT HOW HE'S SUPPOSED TO BE.
SO WHAT YOU GOT IN THE REPORT, THE REPORT IS NOT GONNA HOLD UP IN COURT.
THAT REPORT CAN'T GO TO COURT.
OKAY JONES, YOU GOT NINE AND A HALF YEARS ON THIS DEPARTMENT AND YOU'RE ON RIGHT? OKAY.
LISTEN, WHEN YOU WRITE THE REPORT, IT IS A NARRATIVE DESCRIPTION OF WHAT HAPPENED.
SO WHEN YOU WENT OVER THERE THE FIRST DAY, A LOT OF EVENTS WAS NOT INCLUDED IN THE REPORT.
THAT'S WHAT I CALLED AND I TOLD YOU ABOUT THE NEXT DAY.
HOW THE REPORT IS WRITTEN RIGHT NOW WOULD NOT HOLD UP IN COURT.
OKAY? BECAUSE I'M TELLING YOU HOW TO CORRECT THE COURT.
NOW, WHEN YOU GRADUATE THE FTO PROGRAM, WHATEVER SQUAD YOU GET ON WHATEVER DIVISION THAT YOU MAY GET IN, YOUR SUPERVISOR GONNA TELL YOU THE CORRECT WAY TO WRITE THE REPORT SO IT CAN HOLD UP IN COURT.
YOU AIN'T LYING, YOU AIN'T FALSIFYING NOTHING.
YOU JUST WRITING IT HOW IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE WRITTEN.
EVEN I TO THIS DAY SOMETIMES HAVE TO CALL THE LTLT.
HOW SHOULD I WRITE THIS? I'M KIND OF CONFUSED ON THIS.
AND, AND WE GIVE INSTRUCTIONS AND WE WRITE IT, OKAY? WHAT YOU NEED TO DO IS GO IN THERE AND WRITE THE REPORT CHRONOLOGICAL HOW IT IS AND FIX IT SO IT CAN BE APPROVED TODAY.
HOW YOU GONNA SAY WHEN YOU NOT GONNA CHANGE THE REPORT? FIRST OF ALL, HOLD, HOLD, HOLD UP BRIAN.
BRIAN AND LIEUTENANT MAYO CONTACTED YOU, CORRECT? YEAH, WE DID EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID.
LISTEN, LISTEN TO THE LIEUTENANT.
THAT'S HOW IT'S SUPPOSED TO LISTEN.
SO WHAT YOU DOING RIGHT NOW? SO I GOT YOU ON BODY CAMERA.
YOU SAYING YOU AIN'T GONNA CHANGE IT.
SO WHAT YOU'RE DOING, YOU FAILING TO CARRY OUT ORDERS? NO, THIS IS WHAT
UNDERSTAND? SO YOU SAYING YOU'RE NOT GONNA DO IT RIGHT? YOU FT.
SERGEANT, ARE YOU SAYING YOU'S WHY ASKED TO SIGN OFF ON ALL HIS DOCUMENTS? NO.
THAT'S NOT SUPPOSED, THAT IS INCORRECT.
THAT'S IN THE EMAIL AND AN EMAIL FOR HIM TO TO, TO DON APPROVE THE IS IN EMAIL BECAUSE IT'S CORRECT.
ALRIGHT, LOOK, SO YOU LISTEN TO A TURN AFFAIRS BECAUSE, BECAUSE IT, BECAUSE THIS CONCERNS GRIND ALL EXACTLY.
LIEUTENANT MAYO COME TO SEE ME.
EVERYTHING YOU'RE SAYING IS INCORRECT.
I KNOW YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR THAT.
HE TOLD ME YOU TRIED TO ARGUE WITH HIM AND EVERYTHING.
[01:05:01]
ARGUED WITH HIM.I I DIDN'T SEE YOU BEING UGLY.
JUST AS A SERGEANT IS WANTING THIS MAN TO FIX THE REPORT, YOU CAN PUT IN THERE I CONSULTED WITH THE SUPERVISOR OR WHATEVER YOU DID, BUT YOU CANNOT PUT, HE TOLD ME TO DO THIS 'CAUSE HE WASN'T MAD.
HE MAY HAVE CONSULTED WITH YOU.
SITTING DOWN ON THE HEAD THAT THAT'S FINE.
BUT THAT'S NOT HOW HE WROTE IT.
DID YOU? NO, I READ THE REPORT.
I READ IT AND IT IT'S TOLD ME TO DO.
WHO TOLD HIM TO DO IT NOW? HE TALKED TO THE COMPLAINANT, CORRECT? WELL, YOU HAVE TO WRITE, HE TALKED TO THE COMPLAINANT.
IF HE DIDN'T TALK TO NO, I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO EXPLAIN ANY THIS.
YOU KNOW HOW THE INVESTIGATION GOES, RIGHT? YES SIR.
AND THAT'S ALL WE WANT TO DO IS TO DO IT CORRECT.
IT'S AN EMAIL THAT THIS REPORT IS CORRECT.
I, THAT REPORT IS NOT CORRECT.
THAT PARTICULAR REPORT IS NOT, THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING WE DON'T, THAT'S WHY THEY HAVE FTO ATIONS LIKE THIS FROM THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE.
TO SUBMIT THE REPORT TO FIX IT.
WHAT'S FIXING IT? WHY WE CAN'T PUT THAT IN THE NUMBERS.
SO I'M ASKING AGAIN, I'M I'M ASKING AGAIN.
HEY, I'M ASKING LISTEN, I'M I'M ASKING ONE MORE TIME.
I'M JUST GONNA ASK YOU ONE MORE TIME.
JONES, ARE YOU REFUSING TO FIX THE REPORT? REFUSING TO FOLLOW AN UNLAWFUL ORDER THAT'S NOT UNLAWFUL.
ORDER TO, TO PUT SOMETHING IN A REPORT THAT'S NOT UNLAWFUL.
ORDER INVESTIGATOR FIX THE REPORT TO PUT SOMETHING IN A REPORT THAT HE NEVER INVESTIGATED IS NOT UNLAWFUL.
WHAT? WHAT? MY BODY CAN STOP MY BODY.
YOU WANNA STEP OUT? PLEASE? YOU CAN GO AHEAD IN THE, UH, ROLL CALL ROOM FOR ME.
I, I'LL I WE'LL BE WITH YOU IN A MINUTE, OKAY? OKAY.
THIS THIS PART AIN'T GONNA CONCERN ME.
WHY, WHY DO YOU YELL IN FRONT OF HIM LIKE THAT? BUT, BUT WHY IS HE REACHING OUT TO ROUNDS? HOW DOES THIS WORK? BECAUSE YOU INCORRECTLY MADE HIM WRITE THAT REPORT AND THEN LISTEN.
I'M TELLING YOU, I SPOKE WITH CARL MAY LIEUTENANT CALLED MAY, DECEMBER EVENING.
HE SAID YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN LETTING HIM WRITE THOSE REPORTS IN HIS FIRST, IN HIS FIRST WEEK.
I SPOKE TO THIS MAN PERSONALLY.
OKAY? I DON'T BELIEVE HE'S WRONG.
I'VE KNOWN CALL MAYO FOR A LONG TIME.
HE SAID YOU WENT OVER THERE WITH THAT PARTICULAR REPORT.
HE TRIED TO CORRECT YOU AND HE SAID YOU BUCKED HIM ON IT.
OKAY, WE GOT SOME EMAILS TO CORRECT THAT REPORT.
THIS MAN IS TRYING TO TELL THAT OFFICER HOW TO CORRECT IT.
WE'RE NOT TELLING HIM WHAT TO PUT IN IT.
WE'RE TELLING HIM TO DO HIS INVESTIGATION.
AND IF FOR SOME REASON OR ANOTHER HE WAS UNABLE TO INVESTIGATE A CERTAIN THING, HE, HE NEEDS TO PUT THAT IN THERE.
OKAY? THAT'S ALL WE'RE ADVISING TO DO.
AND IF YOU'RE GONNA STEP IN AND SAY NO, THAT'S INSUBORDINATION, OKAY? WE'RE NOT TELLING HIM TO FALSIFY ANYTHING.
WE WANT THE MAN TO CORRECT OR REPORT THE BEST OF HIS ABILITY WHILE HE WAS ON SCENE AND INTERVIEWED A VICTIM.
WHAT DID, WHAT DO HE WANT HIM TO CORRECT? WHATEVER HE, WE, WE CAN'T LOSE MINDS, WHATEVER'S IN THAT MAN'S BRAIN AND HE CAN REMEMBER HE NEEDS TO CORRECT.
CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN CORRECT? 'CAUSE ALL IT SAYS IS CORRECT MR. YOU IS REPORT JONES WHAT? FIRST? CORRECT.
SO FIRST OF ALL, AS I EXPLAINED TO YOU BEFORE YOU THREATENED TO WRITE 'EM UP, I WILL WRITE 'EM UP 'CAUSE AND I'M GONNA WRITE YOU UP TOO.
BECAUSE, BUT, BECAUSE IF YOU ARE DEFINE ORDERS HERE, THAT'S WHAT YOU DON'T, THERE'S NOT ILLEGAL ABOUT TELLING A MAN TO FIX THE REPORT.
THIS IS, THIS IS WHY I, I PREFER EMAILS.
THIS IS WHY I PREFER NOAH TO BE IN THIS MEETING BECAUSE THE EMAILS SAVED IN MY LAST DISCIPLINARY HEARING, MY EMAILS.
YOU WOULDN'T SAY ONE SUSTAINED ONET SUSTAINED.
JUST, JUST LISTEN, READ THE LETTER BECAUSE YOU WERE CLEAR TO SOMETHING.
DOESN'T MEAN IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
OKAY? SO, OKAY, HOW MANY TIMES YOU SAID STOPPED SOMEBODY FOR A TRAFFIC TICKET AND YOU LET 'EM GO? DOES THAT MEAN YOU STOPPED THEM ILLEGALLY? MY EMAILS SAY, BECAUSE IT IS Y'ALL WERE VERSUS MY RIGHT.
SO THAT'S WHY I YOUR PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARINGS, I'M NOT TRYING TO HEAR ALL THAT.
ONE OF THE THING ONE, ONE NOT SUSTAINED QUESTION.
THAT REPORT IS WRITTEN INCORRECTLY AND YOU KNOW IT.
WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT? ALL OF IT.
CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT'S WRONG? ALL OF IT.
WHAT SERGEANT? ALL OF ESPECIALLY EXPRESS PART.
WHEN YOU SAY I, SERGEANT SMITH TOLD ME THIS, SERGEANT.
SO THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE JONES THAN WHEN YOU'VE WRITTEN A REPORT AND IT WAS INCORRECT AND A COMPLAINANT CALLED TO GET THE REPORT FIXED AND YOU SAID, JONES, YOU WROTE THIS WRONG.
THIS OUTTA THE COMPLAINTANT SAID FIX IT.
WHEN DID YOU KNOW? BECAUSE NOT
[01:10:01]
HE RECORD THIS, RIGHT? OH YEAH.WHEN DID HAPPEN? PLEASE GIMME A TIME AND A DATE.
DID YOU NOT HEAR WHAT I SAY? DID YOU NOT HEAR WHAT I SAY? OKAY.
CAN YOU TELL HIM WHAT HE NEEDS TO FIX? CAN YOU TELL ME RIGHT NOW? LISTEN, WHAT HE NEEDS TO ALL OF IT.
CAN YOU TELL ME YOU KNOW WHAT, WHAT HE NEEDS TO FIX? I'LL FIX IT MYSELF PLEASE.
WHO? YOU IF HE I I'M DONE TALKING TO YOU.
I'M, I'M GONNA HAVE PICTURE MYSELF.
YOU TEND TO, YOU'RE NOT TOUCHING THAT REPORTS ARE YOU? OH, OH, SO YOU DEFINE ORDER, DEFINE WHAT ORDERS YOU PRAY TO CARRY ORDER.
SO, SO YOU'RE NOT AN FT SERGEANT, RIGHT? DON'T DON DON'T GRIND.
WHERE YOU AT? GET YOUR COMPUTER.
OKAY, LIEUTENANT, AGREE WITH THIS OFFICE.
OH, YOU'RE NOT LEAVING BECAUSE HE'S STILL THERE.
HE STILL, HEY, YOU ARE TEN EIGHT.
YOU NO LONGER HE, HE NEED HIS FT.
YOU ARE FAILING TO FILE A LAWFUL ORDER.
GRIME GO INTO SERGEANT'S OFFICE RIGHT THERE.
I I, CAN I SPEAK IN THE FTO PROGRAM? DID Y'ALL READ THE F GO SIT OVER THAT DESK OVER THERE.
SIT IN THAT DESK RIGHT OVER THERE.
HEY, I'M PUTTING A LETTER ON YOU JONES.
LEMME TELL YOU WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS REPORT.
NO, AND I'M NOT GOING, I'M GIVING YOU A DIRECT ORDER TO LEAVE THIS.
I'M GIVING YOU A DIRECT ORDER TO LEAVE THIS OFFICE FROM THE ACADEMY.
HE NOT YOU ARE GIVING A DIRECT ORDER.
DON'T, THIS IS ALL INAPPROPRIATE.
HOW? BECAUSE YOU, BECAUSE YOU TRYING TO GET A SUPERVISOR IN FRONT OF THE TRAINEE LEAVE.
I'M ASKING HIM TO LEAVE WITH ME.
LEAVE THE ROOM AND THERE WILL BE NO MORE ARGUING.
YOU THIS CLOSE TO ME PULLING YOUR BADGE TODAY AND SENDING YOU HOME.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME? I UNDERSTAND THAT.
LEAVE THE ROOM BECAUSE I WON'T FOLLOW ON YOU.
I'M TELLING YOU ONE MORE TIME.
I'M ABOUT THE WELL, CAN I GET THAT MEAN I ON REPRESENTATION, RIGHT, JONES? NO, WE, WE WE'RE NOT IN HEARING RIGHT NOW.
I NEED REPRESENTATION BECAUSE I BROUGHT HIM HERE SO WE CAN GET THIS CLIP JONES STEP OUT OF THE ROOM.
YOU GOT BEFORE PULLED UP? YEAH, I GOT IT PULLED UP.
TOLD OH, SO NOW YOU, NOW THAT'S THIS COMPUTER.
IT'S IN YOUR, IT IS IN YOUR POSSESSION.
I'M NOT DRIVING HIM OR NOTHING.
HEY, HOLD, WHAT YOU GOT? JUST HOLD WHAT YOU GOT? I MIGHT NEED SOME.
HEY, UH, HE WENT AND TOOK HIS COMPUTER FROM MLT TRYING TAKE ANYTHING.
SOMEBODY, SMITH, I'M GONNA GET WITH YOU GROUNDS, UH, LET THE LIEUTENANT TALK TO THE CAPTAIN, BUT THEN WE'LL MOVE FORWARD.
BUT THEY DON'T MARCH 25TH TO TOLD BECAUSE HE WANTED HIM TO SOMETHING THAT HE DIDN'T.
I TOLD HIM TO LEAVE THE, I DUNNO, THEY TRYING TO BE INSUBORDINATION AND STUFF BECAUSE I WON'T, I WON'T LEAVE BROWNS.
I'M ABOUT TO GET ON THE PHONE.
IA, CAPTAIN CLAIRE WILL BE IN THE NOTIFIED.
I JUST SPOKE TO, UH, DEPUTY CHIEF DANIEL,
[01:15:02]
YOU ARE RELIEVED OF YOUR DUTIES.ARE YOU GONNA STEAL? DEFINE ME? YOU, YOU'RE NOT GETTING UP, HUH? NO, YOU SAID I'M LEAVE, MAN.
LIKE YOU, YOU TURN, YOU TURN IN YOUR BADGE, YOUR COMMISSION.
SO WHO DO I TALK TO ABOUT ME SAYING WE'RE WAY BEYOND THAT? AT THIS POINT YOU HAVE GOTTEN NO, YOU, YOU DO NOT, YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU JUST DID.
I'M ASKING CAN HE HAVE REPRESENTATION? GIVE HIM MY NAME AND ALL THIS.
LIEUTENANT, LIEUTENANT JUST SAID HE TALKED TO DEPUTY CHIEF MINE DANIELS.
MY DEPUTY CHIEF DANIELS TOLD HIM THAT YOU ARE RELIEVED OF YOUR DUTIES, WHICH MEAN THAT YOU TURNED YOUR BADGE, YOUR COMMISSION, YOUR FIREARM, AND YOUR UNIT TO THE LIEUTENANT RIGHT NOW.
JONES MEAN THAT THE CONVERSATION IS OVER WITH.
NOW THE ADMINISTRATION IS GONNA TAKE IT FROM HERE YOU ARE TO LEAVE YOUR DUTIES AND YOU ARE TO GO HOME WITHOUT YOUR UNIT, YOUR FIREARM, YOUR BADGE, AND YOUR COMMISSION.
NOW LIEUTENANT JUST GAVE YOU THAT ORDER.
OKAY? I'M EXPLAINING IT TO YOU.
OKAY? PUT ALL YOUR STUFF ON THAT DESK THAT YOU'RE STANDING BY.
PUT IT ON THAT DESK, TURN ALL YOUR STUFF IN, OKAY? MAKE YOUR WEAPON SAFE AND PLACE IT ON THAT DESK.
UH, PUT YOUR BADGE ON THE DESK.
I HAVE MY COMMISSION CARD AND MY BADGE.
YOU DON'T HAVE YOUR BADGE ON? JUST AT MY HOUSE.
WHY HAVE YOU SUPPOSED TO HAVE YOUR BADGE ON COMMISSION ON YOU AT ALL TIMES? RIGHT HERE? MY COMMISSION? NO.
HEY, PUT THE COMMISSION ON THERE.
YOU AIN'T GOT YOUR BADGE? I LET ADMINISTRATION DEAL WITH THAT.
DO YOU, YOU HAD SECURITY AUDITS? YOUR YES SIR.
YOUR TASER KEY FILE, YOUR COMMISSION FIREARM KEYS TO YOUR UNIT.
I WAS, I WAS PASSING ON TO HIM, BUT CAN CAN YOU ASK HIM CAN HE HAVE SOME REPRESENTATION? HEY, THEY GOT I LEVEL.
WASN'T YOU COMMISSIONED WHEN YOU JUST FLIPPED IT UP? NO.
IS THAT THE CURRENT COMMISSION? ALRIGHT.
AND, AND YOU SAY YOU DON'T HAVE YOUR BADGE ON YOU.
I KNOW YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO KEEP YOUR BADGE ON YOU ALL TIMES, RIGHT? THAT'S NOT A, THAT'S NOT A BADGE.
I'M, UH, TIED OFF ON SOMETHING TONIGHT.
YOU TAS CAN'T HAVE HIS BADGE IS AT THE HOUSE.
ALRIGHT, WELL I GOT, HE'S GONNA HAVE TO DO THE PAPERWORK ON THAT.
ANYTHING ELSE? ANYTHING ELSE? HE RADIO, RADIO COMMISSION.
KEA UNIT IS, UH, HE LEFT THIS KEY FOB RIGHT HERE.
EXCUSE, GET SOME MESSED STUFF OFF MY PERSONAL STUFF.
WHAT YOU GOT IN THERE? I GOT MY, UH, PRINTER.
GOT MY RIFLE, GOT MY, UH, WE'RE GONNA GOT MY, MY PERSON ITEMS FROM MY, FROM MY HOUSE.
YOU YOU DID WHAT? I YOU DO WHAT? I GET MY BAG.
WELL, WE'RE, WE'RE BEYOND ALL THIS.
YOU, YOU TOOK THIS TOO FAR BECAUSE I WOULDN'T LEAVE OUT, WALK OUT, TALK TO MY, UH, CORRECT.
OH, SO, SO EVERYBODY ELSE WAS WRONG.
I, I SAID CAN HE COME WITH ME OFF HANDICAP
[01:20:01]
REPUTATION? YOU'RE NOT A FTO JONES AND YOU'RE NOT A LAWYER.WHEN DID, DID I GET, I'M TALKING ABOUT IT.
THE DAY YOU LEFT HIM, UH, DAY HE WAS MOVED FROM YOU.
HE STILL, NO, YOU'RE NOT, YOU'RE NOT FF NEGATIVE.
I JUST, I'LL JUST HIT YOU BACK.
YEAH, I'M FIXING TO SEE RAW TIED UP.
ALL AT THIS TIME YOU'RE BEING PLACED ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE.
YOU'LL, UM, GET A RIDE HOME, BE TAKEN HOME.
YOU NOT HAVE TO YOUR UNITS, TO YOUR GUN COMMISSION, ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
UH, WE WILL GET THE PAPERWORK PREPARED THIS WEEKEND AND YOU'LL COME IN TO SIGN IT MONDAY.
UH, THERE WILL BE OBVIOUSLY A FOLLOW UP INVESTIGATION RELATED TO YOUR ACCIDENT THAT THE, UH, ACCUSATION, UH, FROM YOUR LIEUTENANT.
AND THAT'S, UH, WE'LL CONTINUE THIS ON MONDAY.
OKAY? CAN I, CAN I GET MY BAG OUT? THE CALL, THE BAG HAS LIKE MY MEDICATION AND EVERYTHING.
DEPARTMENT ISSUE, PROPERTY UNIT.
DO WE NEED MR. JONES BACK ON THE STAND? YEAH.
CORPORAL JONES, IF YOU WOULD COME BACK TO THE STAND.
UM, HAVING SEEN THE VIDEO THAT WE JUST PLAYED, UM, DOES THAT CAPTURE YOUR INTERACTIONS WITH, UH, BOTH SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER ON MAY 11 OR 2024? YES, SIR.
WE'LL ADMIT THAT AS EXHIBIT ONE.
NOW, BEFORE YOU MET WITH SERGEANT SMITH ON MAY 11TH, UM, THAT WE JUST SAW THE ONLY SOURCE THAT YOU HAD FOR HIS CONCERNS REGARDING THE REPORT, WAS THAT THROUGH OFFICER GRIMES? YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION? YEAH.
WAS THE ONLY SOURCE FOR WHAT SERGEANT SMITH'S CONCERNS WERE ABOUT THE REPORT? DID YOU JUST HEAR THAT THROUGH OFFICER GRIMES? YES, SIR.
YOU HADN'T TALKED TO SERGEANT SMITH DIRECTLY, CORRECT? NO, SIR.
ALRIGHT, SO YOU DID, YOU DID NOT KNOW EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTED TO CHANGE WHEN YOU WALKED INTO THAT ROOM, UH, ON THAT DAY, CORRECT? UM, NO, SIR.
THE, THE REPORT WAS WRITTEN ON THE 29TH.
WELL COMPLETED, EVERYTHING WAS COMPLETED ON MARCH 29TH.
AND, UH, THROUGHOUT THAT TIME HE, HE NEVER REACHED OUT TO ME ABOUT THE REPORT.
UM, SO WHEN YOU WALKED IN THE DOOR ON MAY 11, WHEN WE SAW YOU THERE, UM, AND THE VIDEO OF EXHIBIT ONE, WHEN YOU WALKED IN THERE, YOU DID NOT KNOW EXACTLY WHAT SERGEANT SMITH WANTED TO CHANGE OR DELETE OR ANYTHING FROM THAT REPORT, RIGHT? RIGHT.
NOW, AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING OF WHAT WE JUST SAW, UM, HE BEGAN TALKING AND YOU BEGAN INTERRUPTING HIM, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
UM, YOU TALKED OVER HIM, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
WHEN HE ASKED YOU AND HE TOLD YOU TO BE QUIET, THAT WAS A DIRECT ORDER, WASN'T IT? YES, SIR.
UH, WOULD YOU AGREE WITH ME THAT YOU DID NOT BE QUIET WHEN HE ASKED YOU TO? I AGREE.
HE ASKED AFTER, UH, YOU KEPT INTERRUPTING HIM, HE TOLD YOU THAT YOU WERE BEING INSUBORDINATE, DID HE NOT? HE TOLD YES, SIR.
UM, EVEN AFTER HE SAID THAT YOU CONTINUED TO TALK OVER HIM AND INTERRUPT HIM, CORRECT? YEAH.
BEFORE SERGEANT SMITH GOT LIEUTENANT MILLER TO COME INTO THE ROOM, HE DIRECTLY TOLD YOU TO LEAVE THE ROOM, CORRECT? YEAH.
UM, BUT YOU DIDN'T LEAVE THE ROOM, RIGHT? RIGHT.
[01:25:01]
UM, AND YOU TOLD SERGEANT SMITH IF HE'S GOING ONGOING OR IF I'M GOING, HE'S GOING RIGHT? YEAH.SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT OFFICER GRIMES, IS THAT RIGHT? YES, SIR.
NOW, AGAIN, ON MAY 11TH, SERGEANT ROMY SMITH, THE ONE THAT WAS TAKING THE VIDEO, HE WAS YOUR DIRECT SUPERVISOR, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
UM, SO YOU AGREE THAT BOTH OF THOSE THINGS, THE TELLING YOU TO BE QUIET AND THE TELLING YOU TO LEAVE THE ROOM, THOSE WERE BOTH DIRECT ORDERS, IT CAN, YEAH.
IT CAN BE CONSIDERED A DIRECT ORDER? YES, SIR.
AND YOU WOULD AGREE THAT YOU DIDN'T COMPLY WITH EITHER ONE OF THOSE, RIGHT? NO, SIR.
NOW, AFTER LIEUTENANT MILLER CAME INTO THE ROOM, SERGEANT SMITH EXPLAINED WHAT HE WANTED TO CHANGE WITH THE REPORT, AND DO YOU RECALL SAYING, AND IT WAS ON THE VIDEO, WE JUST WATCHED IT, IT SAID, SARGE, HE'S NOT CHANGING THE REPORT? NO, HE, HE DIDN'T SAY WHAT HE WANTED TO CHANGE.
HE JUST SAID DELETE THE WHOLE THING.
HE DISCUSSED THAT HE WANTED, HE, HE ASKED YOU ACTUALLY TO ASSIST WITH REVISING THE REPORT.
YOU SAW, YOU REMEMBER THAT HE ASKED THAT QUESTION? YES, SIR.
UM, AND IN FACT, HE, THAT'S A DIRECT ORDER, RIGHT? I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO CHANGE.
HE DIDN'T, HE DIDN'T TELL ME WHAT TO CHANGE.
BUT THE ORIGINAL ORDER WAS, I WANT YOU TO ASSIST GRIMES IN REVISING THE REPORT, RIGHT? YEAH.
AT THAT POINT, YOU DIDN'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTED CHANGED, CORRECT? CORRECT.
BUT YOUR RESPONSE WAS, I'M NOT GONNA COMPLY WITH AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, RIGHT? CORRECT.
NOW, YOU JUST TOLD ME THAT YOU DID NOT KNOW WHAT SERGEANT SMITH WANTED TO CHANGE SPECIFICALLY? CORRECT.
OKAY, SO YOU'RE TELLING US THAT, OR TOLD HIM THAT IT WAS AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, BUT YOU DIDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT EXACTLY HE WANTED TO DO, RIGHT? NO, I STOPPED IN THE LEGAL ACT.
THEY DELETED THE REPORT ALREADY.
THEY DELETED OUR ARREST REPORT, WE ARRESTED THE GIRL, UM, THEY DELETED THE REPORT AND PUT IN A WHOLE SEPARATE REPORT.
I STOPPED THAT FROM HAPPENING.
THAT'S WHY HE SAID, GET RID OF THE WHOLE REPORT.
WELL, YOUR TESTIMONY IS THAT THEY DELETED A REPORT IF IT WAS ALREADY DELETED, HOW DID YOU STOP IT FROM HAPPENING? SO THE REPORT WAS COMPLETED MARCH 29TH.
THE SUMMONS WAS ISSUED, WAS GIVEN TO MY SUPERVISOR MARCH 29TH.
LIEUTENANT MILLER SIGNED OFF AND AGREED TO THAT CHARGE.
AND THEN, UM, WHILE I WAS ON VACATION, OFFICER GRIMES CALLED ME, HE SAID, HEY, THEY'RE TRYING TO GET ME TO CHANGE ALL MY REPORTS.
I SAID, OKAY, WHATEVER, WHATEVER HE ASKED YOU TO DO, JUST DO IT.
WAIT ON ME, I, UM, I'LL REVIEW IT AND THEN WE CAN SUBMIT 'EM.
HE SAID TEN FOUR, HE, HE STARTED REDOING ALL THE REPORTS AND THEN I LOOKED AT THIS SPECIFIC REPORT AND, UM, SEEING THAT THE ORIGINAL REPORT WAS DELETED ALONG WITH THE ARREST THAT WE MADE.
UM, WE LOOKED AT EXHIBIT THREE A MINUTE AGO.
THAT'S THE POLICE REPORT THAT'S AT ISSUE, CORRECT? WHAT? THIS WAS THE ONE THAT WAS PRINTED OUT, UH, MAY 14TH, AND IT WAS ALREADY ALTERED.
THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING COULD SOMEONE ACTUALLY LOOK INTO HOW MANY TIMES THE REPORT WAS ALTERED.
BUT YOU, YOU, YOU TESTIFIED A MINUTE AGO THAT THE REPORT HAD BEEN DELETED, BUT WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A REPORT FROM OFFICER GRIMES, RIGHT? RIGHT, RIGHT.
AND IT'S REGARDING THE INCIDENT FROM MARCH 25TH, 2024.
THE REPORT DATE WAS APRIL 9TH, 2024, CORRECT? LIKE WE'RE HOLDING THE REPORT? NO, SIR.
YEAH, AND THAT, THAT'S WHY I WAS TRYING TO EXPLAIN THAT THE PRINTOUT DATE IS, UH, MAY 14TH.
WE COMPLETED THE REPORT, UH, MARCH 29TH.
THE DAY WE ARRESTED THE YOUNG, YOUNG LADY AND THEN THEY DELETED THAT ARREST REPORT AND OFFICER, WHICH I HAVE IN EMAIL, OFFICER BROWNS, AND I WENT BACK AND FORTH.
IF SOMEBODY MAKE, IF SOMEBODY TELLS YOU TO MAKE A CHANGE, WE HAVE TO CREATE A SUPPLEMENT REPORT INTO WHAT HE'S SAYING.
SO, SO WE WENT BACK IN AND ONCE, ONCE WE CREATED THE REPORT TO WHERE I BELIEVE WAS CORRECT, WE LEFT IT AS SUCH.
BUT YOUR, WHAT YOU SAID ON THE VIDEO THAT WE JUST WATCHED WAS, HE'S NOT CHANGING THE REPORT, SARGE, DO YOU REC DO YOU RECALL SAYING THAT? YEAH.
AND THAT WAS DIRECTED AT SERGEANT SMITH? YEAH.
I TOLD HIM WE'RE NOT CHANGING THE REPORT, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AND THE REPORT THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS EXHIBIT THREE, THAT REPORT? YES, SIR.
[01:30:01]
OKAY.UM, NOW THERE'S SERGEANT SMITH IN THERE, THERE'S LIEUTENANT MILLER IN THERE, BOTH YOUR SUPERVISORS, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER WERE IN THE ROOM AND YOU WERE TOLD OR ASKED, ARE YOU REFUSING TO, TO COMPLY WITH A DIRECT ORDER, THE ACT? YES, SIR.
I SAID, I, I, I SAID I DIDN'T WANT TO COMMIT THAT, UH, TYPE OF ACT.
I WASN'T GONNA FORCE CRIMES TO COMMIT THAT TYPE OF ACT.
WELL, I THINK YOUR INITIAL RESPONSE WAS, I REFUSED TO, TO COMPLY WITH AN UNLAWFUL ORDER.
I'M REFUSING TO, TO OBEY AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, RIGHT? CORRECT.
THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT YOU TOLD, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
SO SERGEANT SMITH ADVISED YOU THAT THE ORDER WAS NOT UNLAWFUL, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
LIEUTENANT MILLER ADVISED YOU THAT THAT ORDER WAS NOT UNLAWFUL, CORRECT? CORRECT.
LIEUTENANT MILLER TOLD YOU ON THE VIDEO THAT HE TALKED TO CARL MAYO, WHO IS THE HEAD OF THE TRAINING ACADEMY, CORRECT? CORRECT.
AND HE SAID, I'VE TALKED TO CARL MAYO.
HE TOLD ME THAT IT WAS NOT AN UNLAWFUL ORDER.
SO YOU HAD TWO LIEUTENANTS AND A SERGEANT TELLING YOU THAT, CORRECT? WELL, THE INFORMATION WAS INCORRECT.
THAT, THAT WAS BECAUSE WE ACTUALLY MET WITH LIEUTENANT CARL MAYO AND GROUNDS WAS WITH ME.
SO THE INFORMATION THAT, UM, LIEUTENANT MILLER STATED WAS INCORRECT.
ALRIGHT, LET'S TALK ABOUT THAT.
SO YOU MET WITH LIEUTENANT CARL MAYO, AND YOU'VE PUT IT IN A SUBMISSION TO THIS BOARD THAT HE AGREED WITH YOU THAT IT WAS AN UNLAWFUL ORDER.
HE SAID, HE SAID, DO NOT PUT ANYTHING IN A REPORT.
SO AT ANY POINT DID CARL MAYO TELL YOU THAT THE ORDER THAT YOU RECEIVED TO REVISE THE REPORT WAS UNLAWFUL? NO, SIR, IT DID NOT.
SO WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THAT THE TRAINING ACADEMY STAFF REVIEWED AND APPROVED YOUR REPORT AS TRUE AND CORRECT, AND ALLOWING SERGEANT SMITH'S INTENTIONAL ACTIONS TO DIRECT TO DIRECT OFFICER GRIMES TO PERFORM ANY SUCH UNLAWFUL ACT WOULD BRING DISHONOR OR DISGRACE, YOU WERE NOT ADVISED BY LIEUTENANT MAYO THAT ANYTHING SERGEANT SMITH WAS DOING WAS UNLAWFUL? CORRECT? YOU WERE NOT TOLD THAT ANYTHING HE WAS DOING WAS UNLAWFUL.
WE, WE WERE ABLE TO EXPLAIN THE ENTIRE STORY TO LIEUTENANT MAYO.
RIGHT NOW, I'M UNABLE TO EXPLAIN THE ENTIRE STORY.
BUT LIEUTENANT MAYO DID NOT AGREE WITH YOU, CORRECT? UH, NOT THAT DAY.
HE DID NOT, HE DID NOT TELL ME THAT HE DISAGREED WITH MY DECISION.
WELL, GUESS HE WILL TESTIFY AS TO WHAT HIS BELIEFS WERE AT THAT DAY? YES, SIR.
WHAT WAS OFFICER GRIMES BEING TOLD TO DO, EDIT REVISE THAT YOU DID THAT YOU THOUGHT WAS UNLAWFUL? HE, HE DIDN'T GIVE US, HE NEVER GAVE US INSTRUCTIONS ON WHAT TO DO.
I WAS THERE FOR THE TEXT MESSAGE.
HE THREATENED TO WRITE 'EM UP IF HE DIDN'T ALTER THE REPORT.
SO THEN HOW, HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT HIS ORDER WAS UNLAWFUL IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT HE WAS GOING TO CHANGE? BECAUSE HE ALREADY DELETED THE REPORT.
HE ALREADY CAME IN, UM, PER GRS.
HE CAME INTO THE OFFICE WHEN I WAS ABSENT AND THEY DELETED THE ENTIRE ARREST REPORT.
I WAS THERE TO PREVENT HIM FROM DELETING THE REPORT AGAIN.
AND IF YOU SAW IN THE BODY CAM, HE, HE COPIED AND PASTE THE ENTIRE REPORT AND PUT IT INTO WORD.
WE COULDN'T, WE COULDN'T, WE COULDN'T TYPE IN RMS AGAIN ANYWAY BECAUSE RMS WAS LOCKED, BUT THEY WAS GONNA HAVE TO, UM, ALTER THE REPORT COMPLETELY.
AND THE YOUNG LADY COURT DATE WAS WITHIN LIKE THE NEXT TWO WEEKS.
SO WE TALKING ABOUT A REPORT, AN INVESTIGATION THAT HAPPENED ON MARCH 25TH, AND WE ARE ALTERING A REPORT ON MAY 11TH.
WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT SEVERAL ORDERS THAT YOU WERE GIVEN THAT YOU DID NOT AGREE WITH, YOU DID NOT COMPLY WITH.
WE'LL SAY IT THAT WAY, RIGHT? RIGHT.
ASKED TO BE QUIET, ASKED TO LEAVE, ASKED TO REVISE THE REPORT.
THE LAST ONE WAS YOU WERE ASKED TO GO TEN EIGHT, CORRECT? CORRECT.
FOR THOSE THAT ARE NOT POLICE OFFICERS ON THE BOARD, CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHAT TEN EIGHT MEANS? TEN EIGHT MEANS GO AVAILABLE BACK INTO THE FIELD.
AND SO WHEN YOU WERE ASKED TO GO 10, EIGHT, WHAT'D YOU DO? UH, I STAYED WITH GRIMES.
I DIDN'T WANT, I DIDN'T WANT HIM TO BE FORCED TO CHANGE THE REPORT AGAIN.
[01:35:01]
IN FACT, YOUR LANGUAGE WAS, YOU'RE NOT TOUCHING THE REPORT, SARGE.CORRECT? THAT'S WHAT YOU HEARD.
I SAID, I SAID, WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT TOUCHING THE REPORT.
YOU SAID WE ARE NOT YOUR, BUT EITHER WAY.
NO, YOU'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT GONNA CHANGE THE REPORT.
NOT TOUCHING THE REPORT, CORRECT? RIGHT.
SO, AND THE REASON YOU SAID YOU WERE REFUSING TO LEAVE THE ROOM BECAUSE HIS FTO WASN'T THERE, IS THAT BASICALLY IT, UH, HE DIDN'T HAVE NO REPRESENTATION, WHICH IF YOU CONTINUE THE VIDEO, IT WOULD SHOW, UH, LIEUTENANT MILLER ASKING SERGEANT SMITH TO WALK OUTSIDE WITH ME WHEN HE SAID, NO, HE DON'T THINK THAT'S SMART.
HE STAYED IN WITH OFFICER GRIMES AND HE SAID, OPEN YOUR COMPUTER.
WE'RE ABOUT TO FIX THIS REPORT.
SO WHEN I WAS AT, SO NOW THAT I'M OUT OF THE ROOM AGAIN, HE WAS ABOUT TO, UM, YOU KNOW, FORCE HIM TO CHANGE THAT REPORTING.
THEY WERE GONNA, IF YOU, IF YOU, LIKE I SAID, IF YOU CONTINUE THE VIDEO, YOU'LL SEE HIM GOING UP TO GRIMES, NOT WALKING ME OUTSIDE, GOING UP TO GRIMES AND SAYING, HEY, WE'RE GONNA CHANGE THIS REPORT.
IT'S CERTAINLY NOT YOUR TESTIMONY THAT YOU'VE NEVER, UH, BEEN ASKED TO FIX SOMETHING ON OUR REPORT.
IS IT, SIR, YOU'VE BEEN ASKED TO FIX THINGS ON REPORTS BEFORE, HAVEN'T YOU? YEAH, SOMETHING LIKE TIMES AND DATES.
UH, IF, AND WE ALREADY HAD THAT DAY, WE HAD A SUPERVISOR ON SCENE, A ACT, THE ACTING SERGEANT WAS ON SCENE, AND HE TOLD OUR LIEUTENANT EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED.
THEY GAVE US THOSE CHARGES AND THEY APPROVED OF THAT REPORT.
AND THEN WHEN SERGEANT SMITH CAME BACK TO WORK, HE THEN THIS, ALL OF THIS HAPPENED.
SO THE ORDER TO BE QUIET, YOU DON'T BELIEVE THAT WAS AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, DO YOU? RIGHT.
UM, WHEN SOMEONE ASK YOU TO LEAVE THE ROOM, A SERGEANT, A LIEUTENANT, THAT IS NOT AN, UH, THAT IS NOT A, AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, IS IT? WHEN SOME NO, THAT'S NOT UNLAWFUL.
UM, A DIRECTIVE TO GO TEN EIGHT, THAT'S NOT AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, IS IT? NO, SIR.
UM, AND IF YOU'RE ASKED TO REVISE A REPORT, THAT'S NOT AN UNLAWFUL ORDER, UH, DEPENDING ON WHAT THE CORRECTIONS ARE, BUT YOU DIDN'T KNOW, RIGHT.
SO YOU REFUSED TO DO IT, BUT YOU DIDN'T KNOW WHAT YOU WERE BEING ASKED TO DO AND YOU CALLED IT UNLAWFUL, CORRECT? WELL, IT WAS MAY, IT WAS MAY 11TH.
THAT'S LIKE CLOSE TO SIX OR SEVEN WEEKS AFTER WE ARRESTED THE SUSPECT.
THE COURT DATE WAS WITHIN LIKE TWO WEEKS.
SO, AND MY, FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, WHY WOULD WE, UH, DELETE OR ALTER ANY REPORT WHEN IT'S TWO WEEKS BEFORE THE COURT DATE? OKAY.
YOU DO REALIZE THAT THERE'S OTHER WAYS YOU COULD HAVE HANDLED THE SITUATION, RIGHT? YEAH.
I ASKED FOR, UH, OFFICER GRIMES BECAUSE AGAIN, OFFICER GRIMES GOT OFF AT FOUR O'CLOCK.
I BOUGHT, I BROUGHT HIM INTO THE MEETING BEFORE HE WAS OFF WORK, AND THEN THEY KEPT HIM AFTER HIS SHIFT.
SO THERE ARE OTHER WAYS THAT YOU COULD HAVE HANDLED THE SITUATION.
YOU COULD HAVE DONE WHAT YOU WERE ASKED TO DO, RIGHT? RIGHT.
YOU COULD HAVE BEEN QUIET, YOU COULD HAVE LEFT THE ROOM, AND THEN IF SOMETHING ON THE BACK END TURNED OUT TO BE SOMETHING THAT WAS ILLEGAL, YOU COULD HAVE REPORTED IT.
AND, AND THAT'S WHAT, AND I WOULD REFER TO MY COUNSELOR, THIS, THIS INCIDENT ACTUALLY HAPPENED TO ME BEFORE.
AND IF YOU PAY ATTENTION TO ANY OFFICER INVOLVED, YOU, YOU WILL NOT SEE THE SUPERVISOR THAT'S ON ADMIN LEAVE.
YOU'LL SEE THE OFFICER, IF THEY DID SOMETHING ILLEGAL, THEY'LL BE ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE OR OFF WORK FOR UP TO THREE YEARS UNTIL WE FIGURE THIS OUT.
I MEAN, NO WORK THAT MEAN EVERYBODY.
ASSUMING YOU'RE GUILTY AND YOU'RE OUT OF WORK FOR THREE YEARS, I, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO.
BUT LET JUST ASK YOU THIS ONE MORE TIME.
YOU COULD HAVE WALKED OUT OF THAT ROOM AND COMPLIED WITH THE ORDER OF YOUR SUPERIORS, AND THEN IF SOMETHING TURNED OUT TO BE WHAT YOU THOUGHT WAS UNLAWFUL, YOU COULD HAVE MADE A COMPLAINT TO INTERNAL AFFAIRS ABOUT THAT.
COULDN'T YOU HAVE NO, I HAVE, I I'VE TRIED MULTIPLE TIMES, MULTIPLE TIMES, MULTIPLE TIMES.
THIS, THIS IS NOT THE FIR AND THIS, AND I DO APOLOGIZE, BUT THIS, THIS WAS NOT THE FIRST TIME THIS HAS HAPPENED.
BUT YOU DID NOT COMPLY, YOU DID NOT FILE AN IA COMPLAINT, CORRECT? I DID.
IT NEVER GOT SUBMITTED TO THE CHIEF.
HE DENIED IT ALL THREE TIMES AT HIS LEVEL REGARDING THE INCIDENT ON MAY 11TH, 2024.
OKAY, SO YOU, YOU DID NOT, YOU, YOU COULD HAVE, AND I, I UNDERSTAND YOU'VE WRITTEN LETTERS BEFORE ABOUT COMPLAINTS, BUT YOU HAVE NOT FILED AN INTERNAL AFFAIRS COMPLAINT ABOUT THE EVENTS OF MAY 11TH, 2024, CORRECT?
[01:40:01]
I HAVE, I, I, I, I WROTE A GRIEVANCE THAT'S, THAT WAS NOT SUBMITTED.I WROTE A GRIEVANCE, GAVE IT TO THE, UH, UNION PRESIDENT, AND HE NEVER SUBMITTED MY GRIEVANCE.
AND YOU'VE NOT RECEIVED ANYTHING FROM THE CHIEF REJECTING ANY KIND OF GRIEVANCE REPORT OF YOURS, CORRECT? NO, I, UM, WE HAD A, A 'CAUSE MY MAGNOLIA REP HAD TO EVENTUALLY SUBMIT MY GRIEVANCE, UH, THREE MONTHS LATER AND WE DID GET A, A TIMESTAMP ON IT, WHICH WAS LIKE, UM, I HAVE IT WRITTEN DOWN.
BUT IT WAS LIKE THREE MONTHS LATER THAT MY MAGNOLIA REP HAD TO SUBMIT MY GRIEVANCE.
NOW I WANT TO GO BACK TO SOMETHING THAT WE SAW IN THE VIDEO.
UM, SERGEANT SMITH, UM, HAD DIRECTED YOU TO LEAVE THE ROOM.
AND YOU DID NOT GO, GRIMES CAME IN, SAT DOWN AT A DESK, OPENS UP HIS COMPUTER, YOU WALK OVER, YOU SHUT THE COMPUTER AND YOU PUT IT IN FRONT OF YOURSELF? YES, SIR.
YOU RECALL DOING THAT? YES, SIR.
YOU, YOUR PURPOSE THERE WAS TO DIRECTLY INTERFERE OR PREVENT THE REPORT FROM BEING CHANGED, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
EVEN THOUGH YOU HAD YOUR LIEUTENANTS AND SERGEANT TELLING YOU THAT THAT WAS NOT AN UNLAWFUL THING TO DO, NO.
THEY HAD ALREADY TOLD YOU THAT THAT WAS NOT UNLAWFUL.
AND YOU TOOK THE COMPUTER AWAY FROM OFFICER GRIME SO THAT IT COULD NOT BE DONE, RIGHT? RIGHT.
SO HE COULDN'T ALTER OR CHANGE THE REPORT? YES, SIR.
AND THAT WAS YOUR PURPOSE TO INTERFERE WITH THEM BEING ABLE TO DO THAT, RIGHT? YES, SIR.
AND THEN BECAUSE YOU WOULD NOT LEAVE THE ROOM, YOU DID NOT COMPLY WITH YOUR ORDERS, YOU PREVENTED OFFICER GRIMES FROM BEING ABLE TO DO THE WORK THERE FOR A MINUTE.
THOSE ARE ALL THE REASONS WHY YOU ULTIMATELY WERE DISCIPLINED.
CORRECT? THEY NEVER BROUGHT IN, UM, TERRANCE NOAH, WHICH I REQUESTED BECAUSE HE, UM, OUR FIRST MEETING, INITIAL MEETING APRIL 10TH, HE SAID THAT THAT WAS ILLEGAL IF WE ADD SOMETHING TO THE REPORT, THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
SO WE HAD A MEETING SIMILAR APRIL 10TH, AND THAT'S WHY I KEPT REQUESTING FOR WHEN YOU SAY I WAS TALKING OVER SERGEANT SMITH, I WAS REQUESTING, CAN TERRANCE NOAH BE HERE THAT WAY GROUNDS WOULD HAVE SOMEBODY TO PROTECT HIM? GARRITY HAD NOT BEEN READ TO HIM.
CORRECT? HE WAS THREATENED PUNISHMENT.
HE, IF HE DID NOT CHANGE THE REPORT RIGHT, THEN HE MIGHT GET WRITTEN UP.
THAT WAS THE COMMUNICATION TO HIM.
HE WAS BROUGHT THERE TO REVISE THE REPORT, CORRECT? RIGHT.
HE WAS NOT GIVEN ANY KIND OF GARRITY RIGHTS.
IT WASN'T READ GARRITY, HE WAS NOT IN A DISCIPLINARY CONTEXT.
CORRECT? I DON'T, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT PART.
YOU SAYING, ARE YOU ASKING IF THE TEXT MESSAGE APPEARED THREATENING, LIKE WRITE YOU NO.
THE SITUATION WHEN SOMEONE WOULD HAVE A REPRESENTATION, THAT IS WHEN YOU'RE IN A DISCIPLINARY CONTEXT.
SO OFFICER GROUND WAS IN HIS PROBATIONAL PERIOD.
SO, UM, IF SOMETHING WAS TO HAPPEN, THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE TO GIVE HIM A REASON TO TERMINATE HIM.
HE WAS IN HIS PROBATIONAL PERIOD.
THAT'S WHY I SPOKE UP FOR HIM.
EVEN THOUGH YOU WERE NOT HIS FTO AND NOT AN APPOINTED REPRESENTATIVE FOR HIM, CORRECT? NO, THEY, UH, HIS CURRENT FTO GAVE HIM PERMISSION TO MEET WITH ME SO THAT WE CAN MEET WITH, UH, SERGEANT SMITH 'CAUSE OF THE TEXT MESSAGE.
HE MAY HAVE GIVEN YOU PERMISSION TO MEET, BUT IT DID NOT GIVE YOU SUPERVISORY AUTHORITY OVER OFFICER GR CORRECT.
AGAIN, YOU AGREED EARLIER YOU WERE NOT HIS APPOINTED REPRESENTATIVE THAT DAY? I WASN'T HIS FTO THAT DAY, NO, SIR.
AND NOBODY FROM THE UNION APPOINTED YOU TO REPRESENT THIS MAN IN A MEETING WITH SUPERVISORS, OKAY? CORRECT.
ALRIGHT, TURN TO EXHIBIT 13, PLEASE.
YOU WERE FOUND TO HAVE VIOLATED TWO POLICIES OF THE DEPARTMENT, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
FIRST ONE IS THREE 18 CARRYING OUT ORDERS, IS THAT RIGHT? YES, SIR.
YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THAT SECTION? YES, SIR.
NOW, THREE 18 REQUIRES YOU TO FOLLOW A LAWFUL VERBAL ORDER OF A SUPERIOR.
YOU WOULD AGREE THAT EVERYTHING THAT YOU WERE DIRECTED TO DO IN THE VIDEO WAS VERBAL, CORRECT? EVERYTHING WAS VERBAL? YES, SIR.
[01:45:01]
ALRIGHT.AND YOU WERE VERBALLY DIRECTED TO DO SEVERAL THINGS AND WE TALKED ABOUT THOSE JUST A MINUTE AGO? YES, SIR.
UM, SO YOU, YOU ALREADY A, A ADMITTED FROM THE STAND.
YOU WERE TOLD TO BE QUIET, YOU DIDN'T DO THAT.
UM, YOU WERE TOLD TO LEAVE, YOU DIDN'T DO THAT, YOU'RE TOTAL GOOD TO GO TEN EIGHT.
UM, AND YOU WERE, YOU WERE TOLD TO ASSIST GRIMES IN REVISING THE REPORT AND YOU DID NOT DO THAT, CORRECT? CORRECT.
OKAY, SO YOU WOULD AGREE YOU WERE GIVEN DIRECT ORDERS, YOU DID NOT DO IT RIGHT.
UM, THE OTHER ONE IS THREE 19 INSUBORDINATION.
ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THAT PARAGRAPH? YES, SIR.
ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS IN THAT PARAGRAPH, IT SAYS, NOR SHALL A MEMBER BE DISRESPECTFUL OF ANY OFFICER SUPERIOR TO HIMSELF WHILE THAT SUPERIOR OFFICER IS IN THE EXECUTION OF HIS DUTIES.
UM, WAS SERGEANT SMITH AND WERE, UH, WAS LIEUTENANT MILLER, WERE THEY IN THEIR, UH, IN THE EXECUTION OF THEIR DUTIES WHEN YOU HAD THAT MEETING ON MAY 11TH? YES, SIR.
UH, DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOUR CONDUCT WAS RESPECTFUL OF THEM? YES, SIR.
SO YOU THINK THAT YOU TALKED TO THEM IN AN APPROPRIATE MANNER? I DIDN'T, UH, I DIDN'T CALL 'EM OUT THEIR NAME.
I, I SIMPLY ASKED FOR SOMEBODY ELSE TO BE HERE WITH GRIMES.
BUT YOU ALSO ADMITTED THAT YOU REPETITIVELY TALKED OVER AND INTERRUPTED YOUR SUPERVISOR, CORRECT? RIGHT.
TO ASK FOR ANOTHER REPRESENTATIVE TO COME IN.
UM, AND YOU ALSO, UH, TOLD YOUR SUPERVISOR WHAT WAS OR WAS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN THAT DAY, CORRECT? RIGHT.
SO YOU THINK THAT THAT IS RESPECTFUL CONDUCT YEAH.
WHEN IT COMES TO THE INTEGRITY OF THE DEPARTMENT? YES, SIR.
IS THERE A POLICY THAT YOU, YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU THAT SAYS THAT A A A CORPORAL WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT IS THE ONE THAT GETS TO DETERMINE WHAT THE, OR HOW TO ASSESS THE INTEGRITY OF THE DEPARTMENT? UH, THE OATH, THE OATH THAT WE TOOK WHEN WE, UM, FIRST APPLIED FOR THE JOB.
IT'S A, IT IS TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT? CORRECT.
UM, AND DOES THAT TELL YOU THAT A CORPORAL HA GETS TO DETERMINE THAT AND GETS TO TELL HIS SERGEANT AND HIS LIEUTENANT THAT THEY'RE INCORRECT ABOUT THINGS? UH, ANY, ANY OFFICER WHEN THEY CEASE, UM, ANOTHER OFFICER, UH, CONDUCTING AN ILLEGAL ACT, YOU HAVE THE DUTY TO INTERVENE.
BUT YOU ALSO SAID THAT YOU DIDN'T EVEN KNOW AT THIS POINT WHAT SERGEANT SMITH WANTED TO CHANGE, RIGHT? SO YOU DIDN'T, HOW COULD YOU HAVE BEEN INTERRUPTING AN ILLEGAL ACT IF YOU DIDN'T KNOW WHAT HE WAS GOING TO DO? BECAUSE THEY DELETED THE REPORT ALREADY.
SO HISTORY WILL SHOW IF I WOULD'VE LEFT THAT ROOM, HE WAS TRYING TO DELETE THE REPORT AGAIN.
IF YOU WOULD GO BACK TO EXHIBIT THREE FOR ME.
DO YOU SEE THE CHARGES THERE ON THE REPORT? YES, SIR.
WE SEE THAT THERE'S TITLE 14 CHARGES AND TITLE 13 CHARGES.
AND YOU HAVE A 1456 AT THE TOP AND AT THE BOTTOM YOU'VE GOT A 1356.
DO YOU RECOGNIZE THAT THE TITLE 13 CHARGE IS A BATON ROUGE ORDINANCE CHARGE THE CITY CHARGE? YES, SIR.
THEN YOU'VE GOT TITLE 14 CHARGES AS A DISTRICT COURT CHARGE, RIGHT? THAT'S A STATE CHARGE, RIGHT? YES, SIR.
SO YOU'VE GOT MIXED CHARGES ON THAT REPORT.
THIS, THIS IS NOT THE, AND THAT'S WHY I ASKED, COULD THAT BE INVESTIGATED? THIS THIS IS NOT, THAT'S WHY I KEPT REFERRING TO THIS REPORT BEING PRINTED OUT MAY 14TH, BECAUSE NOW, AND, UM, YOU, YOU WOULD DISCREDIT, UM, LIEUTENANT MAYO, UM, CORPORAL BLACKMAIL, WHICH IS THE FTO, UH, COORDINATOR, UH, THE UNION REP WHO WAS PRESENT AT THE TIME, WHO, WHO REVIEWED THE REPORT AND SAID NOTHING IS WRONG WITH THE REPORT, WHICH IS LATER ON THE BODY CAM.
UH, ALL THOSE PERSONNEL SAYING THE REPORT WAS CORRECT BEFORE MAY 11TH, THIS REPORT BECAME INCORRECT AFTER MAY 11TH.
THAT'S THE DATE AT THE BOTTOM.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT HAVING MIXED CHARGES OF CITY COURT CHARGES AND DISTRICT COURT CHARGES CAN, IS A PROBLEM? I UNDERSTAND THAT.
BECAUSE YOU EITHER WANT THE, YOU WANTED THEM YOUR REPORT TO BE UNIFORM, MEANING ALL YOUR CHARGES GO TO ONE COURT, CORRECT? RIGHT.
SO THIS REPORT, THIS IS AN UNAPPROVED REPORT WRITTEN BY GRIMES AND IT HAD MIXED CHARGES.
WERE YOU AWARE THAT THAT IS ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT SERGEANT SMITH
[01:50:01]
HAD WITH IT? THIS THIS WASN'T LIKE THIS, UH, ON MAY 11TH, THIS WAS THE REPORT THAT WAS ISSUED TO ME AT MY, UM, IA HEARING AT MY IA INTERVIEW.DO YOU RECALL ON THE VIDEO, SERGEANT SMITH TALKING ABOUT A PORTION OF THE REPORT WOULD NOT HOLD UP IN COURT? UH, HE SAID SOMETHING, YES, SIR.
LET'S LOOK AT, UH, KIND OF THE SECOND TO, TO THIRD TO LAST PARAGRAPH THERE IN THE NARRATIVE, SERGEANT SMITH'S ADDITIONAL ORDERS ARE AS FOLLOWS, ADD AGGRAVATED ASSAULT DUE TO LEWIS STATING ON THE PHONE CALL WITH SERGEANT SMITH THAT MOSS HAD THREATENED HER WITH A BOX CUTTER AND A CHANGE 1356 STATUTE ON THE SUMMONS TO 1456 BECAUSE ALL CHARGES NEED TO BE FILED WITH THE SAME COURT.
AND THEN IT TALKS ABOUT HIM NOTIFYING YOU OF THINGS.
THESE, THESE ARE ALL ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING WITHIN THE OFFICE.
CORRECT? MEANING THIS IS, HE TOLD ME TO DO THIS, THEN I CONTACTED THIS PERSON.
THESE ARE ALL ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS.
THIS IS NOT THE KIND OF THING YOU TYPICALLY PUT IN THE REPORT, CORRECT? WELL, I I ALWAYS REFERENCE WHERE I GOT MY INFORMATION FROM AND THAT'S HOW I TREAT, THAT'S HOW I TRAIN MY TRAINEES.
YOU, YOU ALWAYS REFERENCE WHERE YOU GOT THAT INFORMATION FROM AND THEN I COULDN'T LOCATE IT ANYWAY.
UH, OFFICER GRIMES TOLD ME HE HAD IT RECORDED ON HIS CELL PHONE.
I DIDN'T SEE IT NOWHERE IN EVIDENCE.COM TO WHERE THAT STATEMENT WAS GIVEN.
BUT YOU WOULD NOT WRITE YOUR REPORT.
SERGEANT SMITH INSTRUCTED ME TO ADD VEHICLE BERGER.
YOU WOULD GIVE THE INFORMATION.
SERGEANT SMITH INTERVIEWED SO AND SO, AND THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION WAS LEARNED AND BECAUSE OF THAT, THE FOLLOWING CHARGES WERE ADDED.
I MEAN, THAT'S HOW SOME PEOPLE WOULD WRITE IT, BUT THAT'S HOW I, UM, ADVISE GROUNDS TO WRITE IT.
BUT DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT SERGEANT SMITH SAID HE DID NOT BELIEVE THIS PORTION OF THE REPORT WOULD HOLD UP AS WRITTEN? HE, HE NEVER TOLD ME THAT I WASN'T PRESENT WHEN HE, HE SET UP.
I WAS NOWHERE AROUND, THERE'S NO EMAIL.
WHEN HE GAVE THAT, UH, WHEN HE GAVE THAT ORDER.
SO YOU ASSUMED THAT HIS REQUEST WAS UNLAWFUL WHEN IN REALITY THERE WERE THINGS THAT HE WANTED TO REVISE ABOUT THE REPORT SO THAT IT WOULD HOLD UP IN COURT AND READ PROPERLY.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? RIGHT.
HE NEVER TOLD ME WHAT TO CHANGE.
ALL I KNOW IS THEY DELETED THE REPORT.
THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO EXPLAIN.
BUT YOU WERE WILLING TO INTERVENE TO THE EXTENT OF BEING RELIEVED OF DUTIES WHILE NOT UNDERSTANDING WHAT IT WAS THAT HE WANTED TO CHANGE.
THAT'S WHY I ASKED, THAT'S WHY I ASKED ON BODY CAMERA.
BUT YOU ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT IT, THAT WASN'T YOUR ROLE THAT DAY, CORRECT? I WAS REPRESENTING CRIMES, CORRECT.
UH, WAS THERE'S SUPPOSED TO BE A QUESTION.
UM, YOU WENT TO THE PREDIS HEARING, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
YOU UNDERSTAND CHIEF MORSE LOOKED AT THIS SAME ISSUE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT? CORRECT.
HE REVIEWED YOUR VIDEO, HE REVIEWED THE PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING LETTER.
HE SIGNED IT, HE LISTENED TO YOU, CORRECT? YEAH.
AND EVEN AFTER HEARING ALL OF THOSE THINGS, HE DETERMINED THAT IT WAS APPROPRIATE TO DISCIPLINE YOU FOR INSUBORDINATION AND FAILURE TO CARRY OUT THE ORDERS THAT YOU WERE DIRECTED TO DO, TO DO ON THAT VIDEO FROM MAY 11TH, RIGHT? RIGHT.
SO NOW YOU HAVE A SERGEANT, TWO LIEUTENANTS AND THE CHIEF OF POLICE TELLING YOU THAT YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT THIS, BUT HERE WE ARE TODAY ON AN APPEAL HEARING MM-HMM
SO YOU STILL THINK YOU'RE RIGHT? WELL, HE, I, AND THIS IS, UM, I'M NOT SURE WHAT, UH, CHIEF MORRIS, UH, REVIEWED AND I'M, I'M, I DON'T WANT TO SIT HERE AND GO AGAINST, UH, CHIEF MORRIS IN THIS TYPE OF MANNER.
AND, UM, BUT ME STANDING MAKING SURE THAT GROUNDS DOES NOT ALTER THAT REPORT, I THINK WAS CORRECT ON MY BEHALF OR AT LEAST ATTEMPTING TO GET SOMEONE TO STAND WITH GROUNDS TO BE THERE WITH HIM.
YOU UNDERSTAND THAT HE, YOU WERE ABLE TO TALK THAT DAY, RIGHT? YES, SIR.
[01:55:01]
INTERVIEWED FOR THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS CASE.OTHERS WERE INTERVIEWED FOR THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS CASE YOU SPOKE THAT DAY MM-HMM
UM, AND WERE ALLOWED TO PRESENT WHATEVER IT WAS THAT YOU WANTED TO PRESENT IN YOUR PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING, CORRECT? RIGHT.
CHIEF LISTENED TO THAT, MADE A DECISION.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT AN APPEAL, WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR TODAY IS YOUR APPEALING HIS DECISION? YOU'RE SAYING THAT HIS DECISION WASN'T FAIR, RIGHT.
IT IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR SERGEANTS OR LIEUTENANTS TO DIRECT THEIR SUPERVISEES TO REVISE REPORTS, IS IT? THAT'S NOT UNCOMMON.
DO YOU THINK, I'M GOING BACK TO THE INSUBORDINATION THING.
'CAUSE YOU THOUGHT THAT YOU TALKED APPROPRIATELY IN THAT SITUATION.
DO YOU THINK IT'S RESPECTFUL TO YOUR SUPERIOR OFFICER TO TALK OVER HIM AND TO INTERRUPT HIM WHEN HE TRIES TO TALK TO ANOTHER OFFICER? OH, IF, IF YOU REMOVE THE, THE CONTEXT, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? MEANING HIM YELLING? CORRECT.
AND, AND IN GENERAL, IS IT RESPECTFUL? BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS RESPECT, RESPECT OF YOUR SUPERIOR OFFICER, RIGHT.
IS IT RESPECTFUL TO INTERRUPT THEM AND TALK OVER THEM WHEN THEY'RE TRYING TO TALK TO ANOTHER OFFICER? I, UM, THAT LIKE A YES OR NO? YEAH.
UH, IN CERTAIN, IN CERTAIN INSTANCES, NO, IT'S NOT, UH, IT'S NOT RESPECTFUL.
DO YOU THINK IT'S RESPECTFUL TO TELL YOUR SUPERIOR OFFICER THAT THEY ARE NOT OR YOU ARE NOT OR ANOTHER OFFICER IS NOT GONNA DO SOMETHING LIKE THEY'RE NOT CHANGING THE REPORT WHEN IT'S TO PREVENT AN ILLEGAL ACTION OR A CRIMINAL ACTION? I DIDN'T, I DIDN'T SEE AN ISSUE WITH IT.
DID YOU THINK IT WAS RESPECTFUL TO CLOSE AND TAKE THE COMPUTER FROM OFFICER GRIMES WHEN SERGEANT SMITH WAS TALKING TO HIM AND DIRECTING HIM TO DO THINGS ON THE COMPUTER? RIGHT.
TO PREVENT A CRIMINAL ACTION? I FELT LIKE I DID THE RIGHT THING.
AND YOU WOULD BE OKAY WITH YOUR SUBORDINATES BEHAVING LIKE THAT TO YOU? I WOULDN'T HAVE GAVE THAT ORDER.
BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHICH ORDER HE GAVE? WE THEY DELETED THE REPORT.
WHAT'S THAT? THIS IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO EXPLAIN.
THEY DELETED OUR ARREST REPORT LIKE THAT THE REPORT WAS GONE.
THIS WAS, THIS WAS SOMEWHAT, SOMEWHAT OF A REVISED REPORT INITIALLY.
LIKE THIS REPORT HAPPENED WAY BACK IN MARCH.
WHO ARE YOU SAYING DELETED IT, SIR? WHO ARE YOU SAYING DELETED THE REPORT? SO WHEN I REVIEWED THE REPORT, I CON, WHICH I HAVE AN EMAIL, I CONTACTED, UH, BROWNS VIA EMAIL.
I SAID, HEY MAN, THIS IS NOT WHAT WE DO.
WE DO NOT, UM, DELETE ARREST REPORT AND REPORTS AND REPLACE THEM.
AND THEN THAT'S WHEN HE SAID, SERGEANT SMITH GAVE ME THAT ORDER TO DELETE THE REPORT AND REWRITE IT.
I SAY, PUT THE ORIGINAL REPORT BACK IN, WHICH I ENCOURAGE HIM TO SAVE ALL THIS REPORTS.
THAT'S HOW WE WAS ABLE TO PUT THE ORIGINAL REPORT BACK IN.
AND THEN WHATEVER ORDER HE GAVE YOU TO DO, WE'RE GONNA CREATE A SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT AND THEN, SO THAT WAY WE'RE FILING ALL ORDERS.
HE SAID, THIS IS WHAT HE INVESTIGATED.
SO WE'RE GONNA CREATE A SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT TO SAY, OKAY, THESE ARE THE ADDITIONAL CHARGES.
SO YOUR CLAIM IS THAT OFFICER GRIMES DID IT, IS THAT RIGHT? SIR, YOUR CLAIM IS THAT OFFICER GRIMES DELETED A REPORT? NO, UM, CORPORAL PENSON WAS PRESENT AND, UH, CORPORAL NOAH WAS PRESENT WHEN, UM, OFFICER GRIMES WENT IN THERE.
SO YOU HAD A, YOU HAD A, A ACTING SERGEANT AND YOU HAD A SENIOR CORPORAL, UH, IN THE ROOM.
WHEN, WHEN, UH, WHEN I'M ASSUMING SERGEANT SMITH CAME IN WITH THE RECORDING.
SO YOUR, YOUR, YOU DO REALIZE THOUGH THAT EXHIBIT THREE, THE REPORT THAT WE'RE WORKING OFF OF DOES HAVE GRIME'S NAME ON IT, RIGHT? RIGHT.
YEAH, HE, HE'S THE PRIMARY OFFICER.
IF YOU'RE THE PRIMARY OFFICER, YOUR NAME DON'T COME OFF.
AND HE WROTE THIS REPORT AS FAR AS YOU KNOW? CORRECT.
AND THAT'S WHY I MENTIONED SERGEANT SMITH'S NAME IN THE SUPPLEMENT TO SAY HE GAVE US THIS INFORMATION BECAUSE OFFICER GRIME'S NAME IS ON A REPORT HE CANNOT ANSWER, BUT WHAT SOMEBODY ELSE INVESTIGATED.
[02:00:01]
ALL RIGHT.AND WHEN YOU STOOD UP IN THE ROOM AND TOOK THE COMPUTER FROM HIM AND DID ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU DID, REFUSED TO COMPLY WITH ORDERS, YOU WERE, YOU, YOU WERE DOING THAT BASED ON YOUR BELIEF THAT A PRIOR REPORT HAD BEEN DELETED, BUT YOU WERE REFUSING THE DIRECT ORDERS AND YOU DID NOT KNOW WHAT IT WAS THAT SERGEANT SMITH WANTED TO CORRECT ON THE REPORT.
HE JUST SAID DELETE THE WHOLE THING.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT ALL OF IT MEANT.
WELL, YEAH, BUT THAT, BUT THAT CONVERSATION HAPPENED LATER ON THE VIDEO.
YOU STARTED OFF REFUSING TO LEAVE THE ROOM, CORRECT? YEAH.
I WAS ASKING FOR ANOTHER, UH, PERSON TO BE PRESENT.
ANOTHER SUPERVISOR, RIGHT? CORRECT.
THAT'S ALL THE QUESTIONS I HAVE.
ARE YOU GONNA TAKE 'EM NOW OR ARE YOU RESERVED? UH, I WANT GIVE TO THE BOARD.
I DON'T KNOW IF THE BOARD BREAKS FOR LUNCH OR IF YOU WANT TO ME TO KEEP GOING THROUGH MY LINE OF QUESTIONING.
UH, I COMPLETELY YIELD TO THE TIME.
HOW LONG DO YOU THINK YOUR QUESTION'S GONNA BE? NOT RUSHING YOU? I'M JUST ASKING.
UM, I, I ONLY HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS, BUT, UM, BUT I DO NEED TO, WELL, I KNOW TIME-WISE, MAYBE 20, 20 TO 30 MINUTES.
BUT THIS WAS, THIS IS YOUR DIRECT THOUGH, RIGHT? CORRECT.
WE'LL GO AHEAD AND LET YOU FINISH YOUR QUESTION.
Y'ALL GOOD WITH THAT? MM-HMM
CORPORAL JONES, BRIEFLY, COULD YOU GIVE US A DESCRIPTION OR FROM WHEN YOU INITIALLY ARRIVED ON THE SCENE, WHAT HAPPENED TO WHEN YOU SAW THE FIRST REPORT DRAFTED? JUST BRIEFLY IN YOUR OWN WORDS.
UM, WE, WE ARRIVED, WE ARRIVED ON SCENE, UH, LIKE I WAS SAYING, 'CAUSE OFFICER BROWN'S TRAINING, WE HAVE YET TO AFFECT AN ARREST.
UH, AND IT WAS SOMETHING THAT WE COULD AFFECT AN ARREST ON.
UH, SO WE ACTUALLY TOOK THE CALL FROM ANOTHER OFFICER.
UH, UPON FURTHER INVESTIGATION, WE HAD A SENIOR OFFICER THERE, WHICH WAS ACTING SERGEANT NOAH AT THE TIME ON SCENE.
SHE HAD TO BE TRANSPORTED TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE, UH, SHE RAN AWAY FROM A MENTAL INSTITUTION AND SHE WAS NONVERBAL.
SO WE PUT IN THE VAN, UH, THEY TOOK HER TO THE HOSPITAL.
WE FOLLOWED, AND THIS IS WHEN I RECEIVED A MESSAGE, TEXT MESSAGE FROM MY LIEUTENANT AND ACTING SERGEANT, STATING TO CHARGE HER WITH A MISDEMEANOR.
AND, UM, AT THE TIME, WE COULDN'T GET ALL THE INFORMATION WE NEED.
UM, MARCH 29TH, WE RECONTACTED HER AT ONE OF THE MENTAL INSTITUTIONS, UH, IN FRONT OF, UH, MAYBE FOUR OR FIVE OF HER, UH, REPRESENTATION.
UH, ISSUED HER THE SUMMONS, UM, COMMITTED IT TO MY LIEUTENANT, WHICH HE SIGNED OFF ON IT, UH, THAT SUNDAY, WHICH WAS THE 31ST.
UM, THEN I TOOK OFF THE FOLLOWING WEEK, OFFICER GRIMES CALLED ME, UM, SAYING, HEY, THEY'RE TRYING TO GET ME TO CHANGE ALL MY REPORTS AND I, AND THAT THAT'S WHAT MADE ME STAY HOME FROM VACATION.
I SAID, OKAY, WELL, UH, GO AHEAD AND COMPLY.
I'LL REVIEW ALL YOUR REPORTS AND THEN WE CAN JUST, UH, SUBMIT 'EM.
WHEN I SAW THIS REPORT, THE ARREST REPORT, THAT'S WHEN I TOLD HIM HE CANNOT TRANSFER REPORT.
WHAT WAS, WERE YOU ON THE, SO YOU WERE ON THE SCENE WITH GRIMES INITIALLY? YES, SIR.
WHAT WAS THE CHANGE THAT YOU NOTICED IN THE REPORT? THE ORIGINAL REPORT WAS NOT IN AT ALL, LIKE THE REPORT WE INVESTIGATED.
SO IF YOU JUST REMOVE THIS ENTIRE REPORT AND KEEP A PORTION OF THAT STUFF, BECAUSE I'M, I ACTUALLY HELPED HIM ADD, UH, CERTAIN ELEMENTS TO THE REPORT THAT SAY, HEY, THIS IS WHERE WE GOT OUR INFORMATION FROM.
THIS IS WHAT THE, UH, VICTIM ACTUALLY SAID.
SO THE ORIGINAL REPORT WASN'T IN THERE AT ALL.
CAN YOU EXPLAIN YOUR ROLE AS A FTO OF GRIMES? WHAT ARE YOUR DUTIES AS AN FTO? UM, SO YOU PRETTY MUCH TRAIN EM, BE A SOLO OFFICER.
SO LEARNING, UM, THE, THE POLICY AND, AND THE LAW CAN BECOME CRUCIAL, RIGHT? UM, SO IN, IN AN INSTANCE LIKE THIS, UH, THIS CAN REACH FEDERAL LAW.
IF THEY WAS TO DISCOVER THAT THE, UM, INITIAL ARREST REPORT WAS THE DELETED AND SUBMITTED AS, UM, FELONY CHARGE, RIGHT? SO, UH, PROTECTING HIM FROM, UM, JUST MAKING, YOU KNOW, BAD AND, AND TOUGH DECISIONS, FIRST LINE OF COMMUNICATION.
DID YOU FEEL, DID YOU FEEL RESPONSIBLE FOR OFFICER GRIMES? YEAH.
UM, I'M, WELL, I WAS HIS PRIMARY FTO THAT MEAN I, I SIGNED OFF ON 'EM AT THE END.
[02:05:01]
UH, OF THE FTO PROGRAM, YOUR PRIMARY OFFICER HAS TO SIGN OFF TO SAY, OKAY, UH, YOU, I FEEL YOU DID EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO DO TO, TO GRADUATE ON MAY 11TH.UH, DO YOU RECALL WHO CALLED THAT MEETING? YES, I CALLED IT.
UH, WHY DID YOU CALL THAT MEETING? UH, OFFICER GRIMES REACHED OUT TO ME.
UM, HE PRETTY MUCH SAID HE WAS, UM, HE DIDN'T WANT TO GO MEET WITH SERGEANT SMITH BY HIMSELF BECAUSE SERGEANT SMITH, UM, KEPT SAYING THAT HE WAS GONNA WRITE HIM UP.
AND IN MY CASE, UM, SERGEANT, SERGEANT SMITH ALREADY SENT ME TO A PREVIOUS HEARING FROM, UH, HEARSAY.
AND SO HE WAS LIKE, OKAY, CAN YOU COME WITH ME TO BE A WITNESS? AND I WAS JUST LIKE, YEAH.
I SAID, OKAY, TALK TO YOUR FTOS.
HE WAS LIKE, I DID, I EVEN TALKED TO THE CAPTAIN.
THEY GAVE ME PERMISSION TO MEET WITH YOU, TO MEET WITH SERGEANT SMITH.
AND THAT'S WHY I WANTED ALL THREE SUPERVISORS PRESENT SO I CAN HAVE A LEG TO STAND ON AND SAY, HEY, I'M NOT BEING INSUBORDINATE, OR MAYBE ANOTHER SUPERVISOR CAN SPEAK UP FOR ME.
WHO ELSE DID YOU ASK TO COME TO THAT MEETING? UH, CORPORAL TERRANCE NOAH.
IN THE VIDEO WE SAW WAS CORPORAL TERRANCE.
IN THE VIDEO, YOU APPEAR TO HAVE SOME PASSION.
WHY DO YOU, WHY WERE YOU SO PASSIONATE, UH, ABOUT MR. GRIMES, OFFICER GRIMES? UH, WELL, IN ALL HONESTY, UH, IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED TO ME, UH, FEW YEARS AGO.
UH, THEY HAD A, A LIEUTENANT REWRITE MY REPORT, WHICH I HAD THE SAME COMMAND, SAME CHAIN OF COMMAND.
UH, SERGEANT SMITH WAS THE ACTING SERGEANT.
LIEUTENANT MILLER WAS MY SERGEANT, AND, UM, CAPTAIN BILL CLARA WAS MY LIEUTENANT.
MY REPORT GOT REWROTE, REWRITTEN, AND AN ANONYMOUS LETTER WENT TO INTERNAL AFFAIRS.
UM, SERGEANT OSBORNE CALLED ME IN REFERENCE TO THAT MATTER.
ONCE I STATED THAT REPORT WAS NOT MINE.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENED TO THE SITUATION, BUT I KNOW IT CAN BE LED UP TO LIKE TERMINATION.
AND, UM, THEN YOU HAD PEOPLE GET PROMOTED AFTER THAT.
AND, UH, I DIDN'T WANT GROUNDS TO OFFICER GRIMES OR ANY OTHER OFFICER TO EXPERIENCE WHAT, WHAT I WENT THROUGH.
UH, LET'S, LET'S TALK ABOUT REPORTS.
SO, STANDARD PROCEDURE FOR A REPORT.
WHAT ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO PUT IN A REPORT? UH, UH, THE ELEMENTS OF THE CRIME.
AND, UM, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO REFERENCE, UH, ALL YOUR RESOURCES, TIME, DATE, LOCATION, WHERE YOU GOT THE INFORMATION FROM.
ARE, ARE POLICE REPORTS WRITTEN IN NARRATIVE FORM BASED ON YOUR OWN APPEARANCE? YES.
THE REPORT THAT WAS LISTED AS EXHIBIT PREVIOUSLY STATED AS EXHIBIT THREE, UM, ON PAGE EIGHT OF THAT REPORT, THE PARAGRAPH REFERENCED THIRD FROM THE BOTTOM.
WHAT'S UNCOMMON IN YOUR OPINION ABOUT THAT STATEMENT? UH, UH, NOTHING.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, UM, HOW I WRITE REPORTS.
NOTHING IS UNCOMMON ABOUT THAT.
UH, IS IT COMMON FOR, OKAY, WELL YOU, YOU WERE ON THE SCENE FOR THIS INITIAL REPORT, RIGHT? DO YOU AGREE WITH PAGE EIGHT, WITH SPECIFICALLY PARAGRAPH THIRD FROM THE BOTTOM, STARTING WITH SERGEANT SMITH? YES, I AGREE WITH HIM.
DID YOU SEE ANYTHING ON THE SCENE THAT DAY THAT, TO GIVE YOU A REASON TO CHARGE INITIALLY FOR AGGRAVATED ASSAULT? UH, WELL, I WAS ACTUALLY GIVEN AN ORDER AND NO, I DID NOT TO CLEAR THAT UP, BUT, UM, I DIDN'T SEE THAT, UH, NO KNIFE OR ANYTHING.
AND THEN I RECEIVED AN ORDER FROM MY LIEUTENANT WHO WAS, UH, HEAD OF OUR SHIFT TO CHARGE HER WITH, UM, AT THE TIME HE SAID CRIMINAL MISCHIEF.
THEN IT CHANGED THE, UH, CRIMINAL DAMAGE TO PROPERTY.
SO INITIALLY IN YOUR INITIAL REPORT, RIGHT? IS IT YOUR TESTIMONY YOU DID WHAT YOU WERE TOLD TO DO? RIGHT? SO REPORTS ARE WRITTEN IN NARRATIVE FORM BASED ON WHAT THE OFFICER PERCEIVED.
IS THAT CORRECT? INVESTIGATIVE, YES, SIR.
WHEN ADDITIONAL INFORMATION COMES IN ABOUT A REPORT, UH, A COMPLAINANT CALLS AND NEW INFORMATION IS, IS MADE AVAILABLE, HOW IS THAT, IN YOUR OPINION, SUPPOSED TO BE HANDLED? UH, YOU CAN EITHER, UM, REFER TO A DETECTIVE, UM, THAT IF IT'S LIKE A FELONY OR, UH, OR LIKE TRUMPED UP CHARGES, YOU CAN REFER TO A DETECTIVE OR YOU CAN CREATE A SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT, MEANING LIKE, THIS IS WHAT
[02:10:01]
WAS INVESTIGATED LATER.AND, AND YOU'VE SEEN THE ENTIRETY OF THIS VIDEO, CORRECT? YES, SIR.
AT THIS POINT IN THE VIDEO OR AT ANY POINT ARE, ARE YOU AWARE OF THE REPORT THAT WAS SAID TO BE INCORRECT THEN BEING ACTUALLY APPROVED? UM, THE, AND I'M NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT ACCURATE.
I MEAN, UH, SURE, BUT THE INITIAL REPORT WAS APPROVED AND THE SUPPLEMENT WAS DENIED.
SO THIS MAY 11TH EVENT WAS, WAS IT DISAGREEMENT OVER THE SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT? UH, FROM, FROM MY UNDER WATCHING THE ENTIRE VIDEO, FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, YES.
CAN WE, YOU MADE REFERENCE TO, UH, AN INITIAL, THE INITIAL REPORT BEING SEEN AND BEING DELETED.
UH, COULD YOU ELABORATE ON THAT? DID YOU, WHERE WERE YOU WHEN YOU SAW THAT VID, THAT INITIAL REPORT? UM, I, LIKE, I, I STAYED, STAYED HOME, UH, WHEN I PUT IN FOR VACATION, BUT WHEN OFFICER GRIMES TOLD ME WHAT WAS GOING ON, I ACTUALLY STAYED HOME.
AND, UH, I STARTED REVIEWING HIS REPORTS, UH, SOME FROM THE HOUSE.
AND I, I WANT TO SAY I WAS EITHER AT EXTRA DUTY OR AT, AT MY HOUSE WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT HIS REPORT.
AND THEN THAT'S WHEN I EMAILED HIM.
UM, JUST SO WE CAN HAVE RECORDS.
SO I ALWAYS TELL HIM TO PUT EVERYTHING IN WRITING JUST SO WE CAN NEVER SAY WHAT I SAID OR WHAT HE SAID.
SO WE'LL NEVER GET A MISUNDERSTANDING OF WHO SAID WHAT.
I EMAILED HIM, UH, I SAID, THIS IS NOT WHAT WE SUPPOSED TO DO.
I THINK I WANNA SAY THAT WAS, UH, APRIL, UH, SEVENTH, APRIL 7TH IS WHEN I NOTICED, UM, THE REPORT COMPLETELY ALTERED.
AND, UH, I EMAILED HIM, HE TOLD ME WHAT, UH, SERGEANT SMITH ADVISED HIM TO DO, AND THEN WE WENT THROUGH WITH THE CORRECTIONS.
UM, THAT SAME NIGHT I TOLD HIM, HURRY UP AND SUBMIT IT.
I MEAN, HURRY UP AND MAKE THE CORRECTIONS BEFORE THEY APPROVE THE REPORT.
ONCE THEY APPROVE IT, THEN WE COULDN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
UH, BEFORE YOU SET UP THE MAY 11TH MEETING MM-HMM
UH, DID YOU HAVE ANY CONVERSATIONS WITH GRIMES ABOUT HAVING THE MEETING? DID DID RONALD GRIMES ASK YOU TO COME TO THIS MEETING? YEAH, HE DID.
HE CALLED ME, HE TEXT ME FIRST AND THEN HE CALLED ME AND WE TALKED ABOUT IT AND I SAID, OKAY, THIS, THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT TO DO.
HE SAID, YEAH, HE JUST THREATENED TO WRITE ME UP.
HE SAID, MAN, YOU KNOW, HE ACTUALLY LIKED WORKING HERE.
HE SAID, I'M NOT TRYING TO GET FIRED.
UH, ALL PRETTY MUCH EXPERIENCED WHAT I'VE BEEN GOING THROUGH AS FAR AS BEING UNDER SERGEANT SMITH'S, UH, COMMAND.
AND IT WAS YOUR TESTIMONY EARLIER THAT YOU WEREN'T, YOU WERE NOT HIS FTO THAT DAY, BUT WAS HE STILL UNDER YOUR CHAIN OF COMMAND? RIGHT.
I, I WAS HIS PRIMARY FTO, I'M HIS PRIMARY FTO, THAT MEANING IN THE END WHEN IT'S OVER, UH, I CAN RECOMMEND, UH, REMEDIAL, UH, F HE ADVANCE.
FTO ASIDE, DID HE PERSONALLY ASK YOU TO APPEAR WITH HIM? YEAH.
UM, AND HE STILL, TO THIS DAY, HE'LL CALL ME AND, AND, UH, ASK FOR ADVICE AND, AND BEFORE THEN HE'LL EMAIL ME AND SAY, HEY MAN, I'M NOT TRYING TO DO NOTHING ILLEGAL, IMMORAL OR UNETHICAL.
AND, UM, THAT'S OUR JOB TO BUILD OUR TRUST INSIDE OF THE ROOKIES SO THEY CAN, UM, SO IF I DO GIVE AN ORDER, HE WON'T HESITATE TO FOLLOW IT.
SO IF I, IF I TELL HIM WHAT'S RIGHT ALL THE TIME, I CAN SHOW HIM WHAT'S RIGHT ALL THE TIME, THEN HE WOULDN'T HAVE TO HESITATE IF MY ORDER WAS ILLEGAL.
AND AS OF MAY 11TH, WERE YOU RONALD GRIME'S SUPERIOR OFFICER? YES.
AND ON MAY 11TH, WERE YOU HIS PERSONAL REPRESENTATIVE? YES.
ARE YOU, CAN YOU, ARE YOU ENTITLED TO HAVE PERSONAL REPRESENTATION? YES.
THERE'S TALK ABOUT THE ORDER ITSELF TO ALTER THE REPORT TO, TO THIS DAY IN FRONT OF THIS BODY, DO YOU FEEL YOU WERE GIVEN AN UNLAWFUL ORDER TO ALTER A POLICE REPORT? I, I FELT I, I STOOD, I STOOD IN A WAY FROM THEM CHANGING THE REPORT FROM THEM CHANGING THE REPORT.
SO THAT'S WHAT MADE ME SAY THE ORDER WAS UNLAWFUL, BECAUSE IF I WOULD'VE LEFT, THEY WOULD'VE CHANGED THE REPORT AGAIN.
WHICH, LIKE I SAID, IF THE BODY CAM CONTINUED, YOU WOULD SHOW, ONCE I'M RELIEVED OF MY DUTIES, HE'LL GO BACK UP TO, UM, OFFICER GROUND AND OFFICER GROUNDS HAD TO SHOW HIM A TEXT STATING THAT CAPTAIN SIBLEY TOLD HIM NOT TO CHANGE THE
[02:15:01]
REPORT AND THAT THEY WOULD COME TO HIS AID IF HE FORCED IT.WAS IT, WAS IT YOUR INTENTION? HOLD ON.
I WAS GONNA SAY, I'M GONNA OBJECT TO GETTING INTO HEARSAY FROM OTHER PEOPLE LIKE THAT.
SO, MR. CHAIRMAN, THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE HEARING, SO HEARSAY IS IN ADMISSIBLE IF IT'S RELIABLE.
IS HE PLANNING TO TESTIFY? IS THE PERSON TALKING GONNA TESTIFY TO THAT? NO, THAT INDIVIDUAL IS NOT A PART OF THIS AT ALL, NOR WERE THEY A PART OF THE PREVIOUS HEARING.
I THINK WE SHOULD STAY AWAY FROM THAT.
WAS THE INDIVIDUAL YOU'RE REFERRING TO? UH, YEAH.
DID YOU SAY THAT THE, SOME CAPTAIN TEXTED CAP CAP, HIS FTO REACHED OUT TO CAPTAIN SIBLEY AND HE GAVE, CAPTAIN SIBLEY GAVE HIM THAT ORDER NOT TO, UH, CHANGE THE REPORT.
SO LIEUTENANT SIBLEY AND THE FTO ARE NOT HERE TO TESTIFY, CORRECT? NO, THEY'RE NOT.
AND I, WE, WE HAVE IT IN TEXT.
I DON'T THINK THAT WE, WE WOULD NOT GET INTO THAT.
IF THEY'RE NOT HERE TO TESTIFY, THEN WE CAN'T VERIFY THAT.
WAS IT YOUR INTENTION TO BE DISRESPECTFUL, UH, TO SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER MILLER THAT DAY? NO, NOT AT ALL.
UM, LIKE I WAS TRYING TO EXPLAIN EARLIER, UM, HEAR HEARSAY ACTUALLY GOT ME IN MY FIRST PRE DEATH, BUT FOCUSED ON, ON YOUR ACTIONS ON MAY 11TH, RIGHT? NO.
WAS IT YOUR INTENT TO BE DISRESPECTFUL TO A SUBORDINATE OFFICER OR NO? NO.
UH, A HIGHER RANKING OFFICER? NO, SIR.
UH, DOCUMENTATION REALLY DOES SHOW THAT.
UH, THIS IS HOW WE'RE TRYING TO RECTIFY THE, THE ISSUE.
SO NOT AT ALL TO BE DISRESPECTFUL IN ANY FORM.
WERE YOU TRYING TO COMPLY WITH THE REQUEST ASKED OF YOU AND RESOLVE YES.
WHATEVER ISSUES ON MAY 11TH? YES.
WHAT STOPPED YOU FROM A RESOLUTION ON MAY 11TH? UH, HE DIDN'T, UH, SPECIFICALLY TELL ME WHAT TO CHANGE OR ASSIST, UH, ASSIST THE OFFICER WITH CHANGING THE REPORT, AND THEN I WAS, UH, RELIEVED OF MY DUTIES.
SO AT THIS POINT, I MEAN, YOU CAN BE UP FOR TERMINATION IF, YOU KNOW, CONTINUE.
SO ONCE THEY RELIEVED OF MY DUTIES, I COULDN'T HELP THEM ANYMORE.
DID YOU EVER RECEIVE ANYTHING FROM, OR HAVE, TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, WERE THERE ANY INFORMATION FROM LEGAL THAT WAS SENT TO YOU THAT SOMETHING YOU DID WAS WRONG WITH THIS REPORT? NO.
UM, DID YOU RECEIVE ANY INFORMATION FROM CORPORAL BLACKWELL, UH, THAT THE REPORT AS WRITTEN AS EXHIBIT THREE WAS, WAS, WAS INCORRECT IN ANY WAY? UH, NONE.
HE SENT A FEW GRAMMATICAL ERRORS TO OFFICER GRIMES, UM, THE LAST DAY WAS APRIL 19TH, AND THAT'S WHEN HE, UH, FINALIZED THE REPORT, MEANING LIKE GRAMMATICAL ERRORS.
HE CORRECTED IN, LEFT IT ALONE AFTER.
AND THIS EXHIBIT THREE REPORT AS IT SITS IN FRONT OF US RIGHT NOW.
UNSURE IF IT'S APPROVED OR UNAPPROVED STILL.
BUT IS THIS THE FINAL REVISIONS THAT YOU'RE AWARE OF? THIS, THIS WASN'T THE REPORT ON, UH, ON MAY 11TH.
AND, UH, I'M, I WAS, I'M UNABLE TO DO, UM, YOU CAN'T PER POLICY, YOU CAN'T INVESTIGATE ANOTHER OFFICER, SO I'M NOT, I WASN'T ALLOWED TO, YOU KNOW, GO TO MOB DAD AND SAY, I, I GUESS WHAT I'M ASKING SPECIFICALLY IS WHEN YOU SAID IN THAT MEETING, THEY TOLD YOU THAT THE REPORT WAS WRONG AND TO CHANGE IT.
UM, ARE YOU AWARE AS OF RIGHT NOW, IF ANYTHING WAS WRONG WITH THIS REPORT? RIGHT.
NOTHING WAS WRONG WITH THE REPORT.
SO THE REPORT THAT THEY TOLD YOU ON VIDEO WAS INCORRECT AND IT NEEDED TO BE CHANGED.
YOUR UNDERSTANDING RIGHT NOW IS THE REPORT THROUGH OTHER FTO PROGRAMS, ET CETERA, IS A FINE REPORT.
YOU ASKED ME IF THE REPORT WAS YEAH.
ANY, YOU, YOU, THEY TOLD YOU LIEUTENANT MILLER SAYS THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE WRONG, THEY NEED TO CHANGE THIS REPORT.
I MEAN, IS THIS REPORT CORRECT AS OF RIGHT NOW? IS THIS THE CORRECT SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT? UH, YEAH.
YEAH, IT IS OF AS OF MAY 11TH.
AS OF MAY 11TH, THE REPORT WAS CORRECT.
AND LIKE I SAID, YOU CAN SEE IT AGAIN, IF WE CONTINUE WITH THE VIDEO, UH, CORPORAL HALEY WILL COME IN AND SAY THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THE REPORT.
YEAH, WE'LL DO, OH, SHE'S ANOTHER RELEASE.
UH, REGARDING THE PENALTY YOU RECEIVE, UH, FROM THE CHIEF AT THE LAST HEARING,
[02:20:01]
UM, DO YOU AGREE OR DISAGREE WITH THAT, THAT DECISION? UH, I, I DISAGREE.I DISAGREE WITH THE DECISION WHY, AND, UM, AS FAR AS THIS POINT, I DON'T, I DON'T THINK THEY, UH, TOOK IN A, UH, TOOK IN THE FACTS OF WHAT I WAS STANDING FOR, YOU KNOW, UM, IF THAT REPORT WAS ALTERED OR DELETED, THIS CAN GO WELL BEYOND WHERE WE AT NOW.
SO, UH, I'M NOT SURE IF HE WAS PRESENTED ALL THE FACTS, UH, JUST DID NOT SEE HIM, BUT I DON'T AGREE WITH THE DECISION BECAUSE OF WHAT WAS AT STAKE AND OFFICER GRIMES BEING A EIGHT WEEK OFFICER AT THE TIME, FOUR WEEK OFFICER WHEN THE REPORT HAPPENED.
I, I FELT LIKE THIS INCIDENT COULD HAVE WENT A WHOLE LOT FURTHER IF THEY WOULD'VE DELETED THE ARREST REPORT AND, AND, AND PUT IN THEIR OWN INVESTIGATION.
IN YOUR OPINION, DOES CORRECT POLICE REPORTING, UH, AFFECT PUBLIC TRUST? RIGHT.
IS IT YOUR TESTIMONY TODAY THAT YOU WERE TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, FOLLOW A PROCEDURE? YES.
AS FAR AS, UH, YEAH, THE LEGAL RAMIFICATION.
COUPLE OF FOLLOW UPS, UM, AGAIN, YOU WERE AT THE PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING, YOU SAID YOU DIDN'T THINK CHIEF CONSIDERED EVERYTHING, YOU SAID WHATEVER YOU WANTED TO SAY AT THAT PRE-DISCIPLINARY HEARING ABOUT THIS CASE, CORRECT? YEAH.
AND CHIEF WAS THERE, YOU THINK HE WAS LISTENING TO YOU? UH, YEAH, YOU CAN SAY THAT.
SO YOU, YOU JUST, YOU YOU JUST THINK THAT HE DIDN'T CONSIDER EVERYTHING BECAUSE IT DID, IT WENT AGAINST YOU? NO, IT, IT IS, IT'S ILLEGAL.
LIKE IF YOU DELETE AN ARREST REPORT AND PUT IN YOUR OWN INVESTIGATION, THAT IS ILLEGAL.
THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO EXPLAIN.
WE ARRE AND THE LIEUTENANT SIGNED OFF ON THE ARREST.
HE GAVE THE ORDER AND HE SIGNED OFF ON THE ARREST.
SAYS YOU, HOWEVER YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE TWO LIEUTENANTS, A SERGEANT AND A CHIEF OF POLICE WHO DISAGREE WITH YOU ON THIS.
WELL, YOU CERTAINLY INTERFACED WITH TWO OF 'EM THAT DAY.
WHO DISAGREED WITH YOU, RIGHT? WITH, UM, SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER.
THEY DISAGREED WITH YOU, RIGHT? NO, THEY, THEY NEVER TOLD ME WHAT THE CORRECT, THAT'S WHAT, SO OKAY.
THEM SAYING DISAGREE, THEY NEVER SAID WHAT NEEDS TO BE FIXED.
NOW, YOUR, YOUR TESTIMONY A MINUTE AGO IS YOU WERE THERE BECAUSE OFFICER GRIMES ASKED YOU TO, BUT YOU DON'T BELIEVE THAT AN A REQUEST BY A ROOKIE OFFICER TO BE PRESENT TRUMPS A DIRECT ORDER FROM A SERGEANT OR A LIEUTENANT, DOES IT? UH, YEAH.
HE, HE'S, HE IS ALLOWED TO HAVE REPRESENTATION.
HE WAS ON, HE WAS IN HIS PROBATION PERIOD.
SO AS AN FTO, YOU ARE REQUIRED TO BE WITH YOUR ROOKIE IN A DISCIPLINARY MATTER, HE WOULD BE ENTITLED TO REPRESENTATION, CORRECT? RIGHT.
AND THAT GOES THROUGH THE ACADEMY.
WE'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL TESTIFY ABOUT THAT LATER.
UM, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE ALSO NOT THE FINAL SAY AND WHETHER A REPORT IS CORRECT OR NOT, RIGHT? YES, SIR.
DOES THE BOARD HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. JONES BEFORE WE BREAK? I THINK JUST ONE FROM ME.
I KNOW DURING QUESTIONING SOME TIME WAS SPENT ON THAT PARAGRAPH IN THE REPORT IN HOW IT COULD HAVE OR SHOULD HAVE BEEN CHANGED.
DO YOU REMEMBER THAT DISCUSSION WITH, UH, SERGEANT SMITH'S NAME BEING IN THE REPORT? SO LET'S MAKE SURE.
SO IN SECTION THREE OF THE BINDER, THE THREE, OKAY, THERE THREE.
UM, THE PARAGRAPH THIRD FROM THE BOTTOM, SERGEANT R SMITH'S ADDITIONAL ORDERS.
DO YOU REMEMBER THAT DISCUSSION? YEAH.
AND IN THAT DISCUSSION, THE ATTORNEY FOR THE DEPARTMENT TALKED TO YOU ABOUT DIFFERENT WAYS IT COULD HAVE BEEN ALTERED.
DO YOU RECALL THAT DISCUSSION WITH WITH HIM? YES.
HE GAVE ME DIFFERENT WAYS WE CAN CHANGE, AND I APOLOGIZE IF I'M BEING UNCLEAR.
SO, TO MY RECOLLECTION, AND TELL ME IF I'M RECALLING INCORRECTLY, UM, THE ATTORNEY ASKED YOU ESSENTIALLY IF IT WOULD'VE BEEN APPROPRIATE TO ALTER THAT PARAGRAPH INSTEAD OF TO SAY, SERGEANT R SMITH'S ADDITIONAL ORDERS ARE AS FOLLOWS,
[02:25:01]
TO SIMPLY HAVE PUT SERGEANT SMITH CONVEYED OR SAID THAT HE HAD THIS PHONE CALL, AND THIS IS WHAT WAS SAID.AGAIN, I'M NOT ASKING YOU WHETHER THAT'S TRUE OR FALSE.
I'M ASKING IF YOU REMEMBER THIS CONVERSATION.
BEFORE TODAY, HAS ANYONE DISCUSSED WITH YOU IN ANY MEASURE OF DETAIL, THAT TYPE OF THING, DID ANYONE TELL YOU WHAT THEY WANTED CHANGED OR IS TODAY THE, THE FIRST TIME YOU WERE HEARING ABOUT WHAT THEY BELIEVED THEY WANTED YOU TO CHANGE? SO I WAS ABLE TO REVIEW THE BODY CAM IN ITS ENTIRETY, AND THAT'S WHEN I HEARD IT ON BODY CAM.
WHEN, UH, CORPORAL HALEY, UH, SCENE COMES UP, THAT'S WHEN I HEARD THAT, UM, SERGEANT SMITH WANTED HIS NAME OUT A REPORT.
BUT BEYOND THAT, IT WAS NEVER, THAT INFORMATION WAS NEVER GIVEN TO ME A A FOLLOW UP.
AND THOUGH I IMAGINE THIS MIGHT BE BETTER ANSWERED BY VIDEO, TO YOUR RECOLLECTION, DID SERGEANT SMITH WANT HIS NAME OUT ENTIRELY OR DID HE WANT IT ALTERED IN THE WAY THAT WAS PREVIOUSLY DISCUSSED TO SIMPLY REFERENCE HIM HAVING HAD THIS PHONE CALL, UM, AND REMOVING THE PART ABOUT THESE BEING ORDERS FROM SERGEANT SMITH? AND, AND IF YOU DON'T RECALL, THAT'S OKAY.
I, I DON'T, LIKE I SAID, I, I HEARD IT FROM ON THE BODY CAM, SO I CAN'T, UH, RECITE IT VERBATIMLY, SO I DON'T OKAY, THANK YOU.
IS THAT IN THIS, UH, SEGMENT OF THE YEAH.
MR. THOMAS, YOU'RE SAYING AT FIRST, UH, THE ORIGINAL REPORT WAS WROTE ON, UM, MARCH 29TH, AND IT WAS DELETED PRIOR TO THE, UH, AFTER MARCH 29TH.
SO WE, UH, OFFICER GRIMES AND I SUBMITTED THAT REPORT AND THE SUMMONS MARCH 29TH, MARCH 29TH, AND SOMEWHERE IN BETWEEN MARCH 29TH AND APRIL 7TH, THE REPORT WAS, UH, THE NARRATIVE WAS DELETED, UH, FELONY CHARGES WAS ADDED, AND A DIFFERENT NARRATIVE SET IN, UH, THE NARRATIVE BOX.
SO DID, UH, SERGEANT SMITH WANT Y'ALL TO UPGRADE THE CHARGES? I KNOW YOU SAY THE ORIGINAL REPORT, Y'ALL ISSUE A SUMMONS ON IT? YES, SIR.
AND AT THAT POINT, HE WANTED THE CHARGES UPGRADED.
UH, DID, WERE Y'ALL EVER INSTRUCTED TO CON CONTACT BURGLARY DIVISION OR ANYONE? NO.
AND, UH, THE VIDEO HE HAD, AND I'M NOT SURE NOW, BUT IT WAS NEVER SUBMITTED, SO WE, WE COULD NEVER LIKE, REFERENCE ANYTHING.
SO WE DIDN'T CONTACT ANY DETECTIVE.
UM, AND THAT'S WHAT I ASKED, UH, OFFICER GRIMES, HE WAS JUST LIKE, NO, HE TOLD ME TO PUT IN THE, UM, REPORT AS HE SAID IT.
SO, UM, WE DIDN'T CONTACT ANYBODY, UH, ON ANY FOLLOW UP DIVISION, IF I'M HEARING YOU CORRECTLY.
AND WERE YOU EVER INSTRUCTED TO UPGRADE THE CHARGES? NOT, NOT ME, NOT ME.
ANY FURTHER, UH, QUESTIONS, COMMENTS ON THE BOARD? IF NOT, THEN I THINK WE'D LIKE TO TAKE A, UM, A BREAK AND LET'S COME BACK AT ONE 30.
EVERYBODY READY? THE BOARD MEETING IS RECONVENED.
IT IS 1:33 PM MR. DARA, WHO'S NEXT? NEED? ALL GOOD? YEAH.
UM, WE'LL GO, UH, WE'RE GONNA CALL SERGEANT, UH, ROMY SMITH.
UH, YOU'VE ALREADY BEEN SWORN IN? YES, SIR.
SO IF YOU WOULD PLEASE STATE YOUR, UH, NAME AND CURRENT ASSIGNMENT.
SERGEANT SMITH, THIRD DISTRICT UNIFORM PATROL EVENING SHIFT.
AND HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN WITH THE DEPARTMENT APPROXIMATELY? UH, 21 YEARS.
[02:30:01]
ALSO IN THE MILITARY, IS THAT CORRECT? YES SIR, I CURRENTLY AM.AND WHAT'S YOUR RANK THERE? I'M A COLONEL.
SO FAIR TO SAY, YOU'VE GOT A BIT OF EXPERIENCE WITH CHAIN OF COMMAND, IS THAT RIGHT? YES SIR, I DO.
UM, YOU'RE ALSO FAMILIAR WITH UH, CORPORAL JONES, CORRECT? YES SIR, I AM.
NOW I JUST FROM THE OUTSET, WE'VE ALREADY HEARD CORPORAL JONES TESTIFY, WE'VE ALREADY WATCHED THE VIDEO SO THEY'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE, WITH THE SITUATION.
SO THAT'LL HELP CUT US DOWN AS FAR AS TESTIMONY GOES.
UM, AND THE RECORDING THAT WE SAW, THAT WAS YOUR BODY CAMERA, IS THAT CORRECT? YES SIR.
ALRIGHT, I WANNA TALK FIRST, JUST BRIEFLY ABOUT THE POLICE REPORT.
THERE'S A BINDER IN FRONT OF YOU IF YOU HAD TURNED TO EXHIBIT THREE FOR ME.
THE INCIDENT THAT TOOK PLACE ON MARCH 25TH OF THIS YEAR, THAT REPORT'S DATED APRIL NINE, IS THAT RIGHT? YES SIR.
TOP RIGHT HAND CORNER GOOD? YES SIR.
AND THE VERSION THAT WE HAVE IS AN UNAPPROVED REPORT, CORRECT? UH, CORRECT SIR? YES SIR.
DO YOU RECALL HOW THE REPORT ISSUE CAME TO YOUR LEVEL? YES SIR.
WHAT HAPPENED? THE, UH, THE VICTIM WHO HAD A CAR BURGLARIZED AT THE HOME DEPOT, SHE CALLED THE DISTRICT TO SPEAK WITH A SUPERVISOR TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THE REPORT BECAUSE SHE FELT THE REPORT WAS NOT ACCURATE AND WAS MISSING, UH, SPECIFIC DETAILS REGARDING TO THE CHARGES, UH, OF IT.
AND SO WHEN I GOT OFF THE PHONE WITH HER, I WENT AND LOOKED AT THE BODY CAMERA FROM THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT AND SAW HER COMPLAINTS AND THE ISSUES WAS VALID.
SO, UH, THAT'S WHEN I MADE CONTACT WITH UH, CORPORAL JONES AND, UH, TRAINEE GRIMES TO HAVE A REPORT FIXED.
THAT'S HOW I GOT INVOLVED IN IT.
NOW LET'S FAST FORWARD TO MAY 11, THE DAY OF YOUR MEETING.
IS THE REPORT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW EXHIBIT THREE, IS THAT THE REPORT THAT YOU WANTED TO REVISE? UH, YES SIR, IT IS.
JUST FROM LOOKING AT THE FIRST PAGE.
IF WE LOOK AT THAT FIRST PAGE, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE ARE MIXED CHARGES, MEANING THAT YOU HAD SOME CHARGES THAT WERE STATE CHARGES AND SOME CITY CHARGES IN THERE.
IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT SIR.
AND WAS THAT AN ISSUE FOR YOU? IS THAT SOMETHING YOU WANTED TO BE FIXED? YES SIR, IT WAS.
UM, LET'S ALSO THEN GO TO PAGE EIGHT.
THERE'S THREE PARAGRAPHS, UM, AND KIND OF THAT WORD THE IN RED UNAPPROVED COVERS THE THREE PARAGRAPHS.
IT STARTS WITH ON THURSDAY, APRIL FOUR, UM, AND THEN IT GOES DOWN THROUGH THE LAST WORD OF THE THIRD PARAGRAPH IS THE WORD PENDING.
DO YOU SEE THOSE THREE PARAGRAPHS? UH, I SEE ON YOU SAY TUESDAY, APRIL THE SECOND.
UH, IT STARTS WITH ON THURSDAY, APRIL 4TH, 2024.
IT'S A THIRD PARAGRAPH ON THAT PAGE.
UM, AND IT TALKS ABOUT YOU INFORMING HIM ABOUT MS. LEWIS CONTACTING YOU AND THEN IT TALKS ABOUT INSTRUCTIONS YOU GAVE HIM AND ORDERS THAT YOU GAVE HIM.
UM, ARE THOSE THE PARAGRAPHS THAT YOU WANTED REVISED IN THE REPORT? YES SIR.
UM, QUESTION TO YOU IS IF, WELL FIRST OF ALL, LET ME BACK UP.
THAT KIND OF LANGUAGE THAT'S IN THAT REPORT, IS THAT SOMETHING YOU PERCEIVE AS MORE LIKE ADMINISTRATIVE LANGUAGE, THINGS THAT WOULD YOU, WOULD, UH, THAT YOU WOULD NOT PUT IN A REPORT? CORRECT? YES SIR.
IF THE REPORT HAD BEEN REVISED TO SAY SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES OF, OF COURSE I'M NOT WRITING IT, BUT YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU SAID SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES OF, UM, SERGEANT SMITH SPOKE WITH MS. LEWIS AND SHE PROVIDED THE, THIS ADDITIONAL INFORMATION AND BASED ON THAT INFORMATION WE'RE ADDING ADDITIONAL CHARGES SUCH AS X, Y, AND Z, UM, WOULD THAT LANGUAGE HAVE BEEN MORE APPROPRIATE, DO YOU BELIEVE? YES SIR.
AND THAT WOULD'VE BEEN SOMETHING THAT MAY HAVE GOTTEN THE REPORT, UM, APPROVED THAT AND UH, CORRECT THE CHARGES HAD CITY AND DISTRICT CHARGES IN IT.
GOING INTO THAT MEETING, UM, YOU KNOW, YOU HAD ADVISED, UH, OR I GUESS LEMME BACK UP.
CORPORAL JONES TESTIFIED THAT HE DID NOT KNOW EXACTLY GOING INTO THAT MEETING WHAT CHANGES YOU WANTED MADE.
SO WHEN HE, UM, STARTED SPEAKING, WAS THAT INTERFERING WITH THE INSTRUCTIONS THAT YOU WERE TRYING TO GIVE TO OFFICER GRIMES? YES SIR, IT WAS.
UM, DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU GAVE HIM DIRECT ORDERS IN THAT INSTANCE TO BE QUIET? YES SIR, I DID.
THEN AFTER THAT THERE CONTINUED WITH AN INTERRUPTION INTO THE THINGS THAT YOU WERE TRYING TO SAY TO OFFICER
[02:35:01]
GRIMES AND YOU ASKED HIM TO LEAVE, CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT.DO YOU BELIEVE THAT WAS A DIRECT ORDER? YES SIR, IT WAS.
AND DID YOU INTEND FOR IT TO BE A DIRECT ORDER? YES SIR, I DID.
AND DID HE COMPLY WITH YOUR DIRECT ORDER? NO SIR.
UM, YOU AFTER THAT YOU ASKED HIM OR DIRECTED HIM TO ASSIST OFFICER GRIMES IN REVISING THE REPORT, CORRECT? I DID.
UM, WHAT WAS HIS RESPONSE TO THAT? HE REFUSED.
HE SAID THAT HE WASN'T GONNA DO IT.
UM, AND YOU ASKED HIM TO LEAVE THE ROOM AFTER THAT, IS THAT RIGHT? I DID.
AND DID HE COMPLY WITH EITHER OF THOSE ORDERS? HE DID NOT.
YOU WENT AND GOT LIEUTENANT MILLER.
WHY DID YOU DO THAT? BECAUSE I WASN'T, I WAS TRYING TO FIX THE REPORT AT MY LEVEL AND I COULDN'T GET ANYWHERE WITH JONES IN THE ROOM AND HE REFUSED TO LEAVE AND SO I JUST WENT AND GOT THE LIEUTENANT.
WHEN YOU BROUGHT THE LIEUTENANT IN THE ROOM, DID CORPORAL JONES' BEHAVIOR CHANGE? IT DID NOT.
DID HE CONTINUE TO DEFY DIRECT ORDERS BETWEEN YOU OF YOU AND BOTH LIEUTENANT MILLER? HE DID.
THE LAST THING THAT YOU ASKED HIM TO DO OR DIRECTED HIM TO DO MULTIPLE TIMES WAS TO GO TEN EIGHT, CORRECT? I DID.
AT ANY POINT DID HE VOLUNTARILY GO TEN EIGHT AFTER HE WAS BEING DIRECTED TO DO SO? HE DID NOT.
YOU AWARE OF ANY POLICY THAT ALLOWS A SUBORDINATE TO DISOBEY DIRECT ORDERS? UM, IN AN INSTANCE LIKE WHAT WE WERE DEALING WITH THAT DAY THAT WAS ON VIDEO? IT'S NOT ACTUALLY, IT'S A CATEGORY THREE DISOBEYING A, UH, ORDERS FROM THE, UH, SUPERIOR.
NOW, WHEN YOU GAVE THIS ORDER, UH, YOU WERE ON DUTY, CORRECT? CORRECT.
AND WAS CORPORAL JONES ON DUTY? HE WAS.
SO BOTH OF YOU ARE BEING PAID IN YOUR DIRECT CAPACITY AS UH, YOU AS A SERGEANT AND HIM AS A CORPORAL, CORRECT? CORRECT.
UM, AND SAME GOES TRUE FOR LIEUTENANT MILLER, CORRECT? YES SIR.
NOW I WANT TO JUST BRIEFLY GO OVER A COUPLE OF THINGS IF YOU WOULD TURN TO EXHIBIT FOUR FOR ME.
UM, YOU TESTIFIED A MINUTE AGO THAT YOU HAD ALREADY ASKED, UH, OFFICER GRIMES TO REVISE THE REPORT, CORRECT? CORRECT.
AND WE KNOW FROM TESTIMONY PREVIOUSLY THAT THERE WAS A COMMUNICATION THERE BETWEEN YOU AND OFFICER GRIMES, IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT.
THERE ARE TWO PAGES TO EXHIBIT FOUR, IF YOU WOULD, OR I'M SORRY, THREE PAGES.
UM, THE FIRST TWO PAGES, IT LOOKS LIKE AN EMAIL BETWEEN YOU AND OFFICER GRIMES DATED MAY 11.
AND WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF SENDING THAT EMAIL? THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT? MYSELF AND THE LIEUTENANT RECEIVED A NOTIFICATION FROM CRIMINAL RECORDS ABOUT THE REPORT BECAUSE THE REPORT HAS TO BE APPROVED AND FORWARDED TO, UH, EITHER CITY OR DISTRICT COURT AND IT WASN'T APPROVED AND IT COULDN'T BE FORWARDED TO CITY OR DISTRICT COURT WITH THE MIXED CHARGES IN IT.
SO WE HAD TO FIX THE REPORT AND THEY'LL EMAIL US MAYBE TWO TIMES AND THEN ON THE THIRD TIME THEY START PUTTING THE OTHER MEMBERS OF THE CHAIN OF COMMAND IN IT, LIKE IT MAY BE THE DISTRICT COMMANDER.
AND IF IT STILL DON'T GET FIXED, THEN THE UP COMMANDER GET IN IT AND WE TRY TO SOLVE IT AT ALL LEVEL TO KEEP THE, UH, DISTRICT COMMANDER, UH, FROM COMING TO US ABOUT IT BECAUSE IT'S A SQUAD LEVEL THING.
SO WE TRY TO FIX IT AT OUR LEVEL SO CRIMINAL RECORDS CAN DO THEIR PART.
SO YOU HAD ALREADY REACHED OUT TO OFFICER GRIMES AND I TAKE IT THAT IT HAD NOT BEEN FIXED PRIOR TO MAY 11, IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT.
IF WE TURNED TO THE THIRD PAGE, UM, THERE'S ALSO A TEXT MESSAGE THERE.
IS THAT A TEXT MESSAGE FROM YOU TO OFFICER GRIMES? CORRECT? IT IS.
UM, AND YOU SAID THE ACADEMY AND LEGAL ARE ASKING FOR THIS REPORT TO BE CORRECTED AND APPROVED FOR THE COURTS, IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT.
AND YOU, YOU ADVISED, UM, MY NEXT ACTION WILL BE TO WRITE A LETTER REGARDING YOU NOT FOLLOWING INSTRUCTIONS.
WAS THAT ONLY IN THE, IF HE DID NOT REVISE THE REPORT, IF IT DIDN'T FIX IT? YES SIR.
SO IF HE FIXED IT THEN THAT WASN'T GONNA BE, UH, A DISCIPLINARY ISSUE.
UH, BASED ON THE TESTIMONY WE'LL OFFER, UH, EXHIBIT FOUR ON GLOBO ACCEPTED.
NOW, AFTER YOU SENT THOSE MESSAGES, DID YOU RECEIVE CONTACT FROM CORPORAL JONES ABOUT MEETING? YES SIR.
AND WAS THERE ANYTHING ODD THAT, DID YOU FIND ANYTHING ODD ABOUT HEARING FROM CORPORAL JONES ABOUT THE REPORT AT THIS POINT? YES SIR.
I, UH, HE CALLED ME ON THE RADIO, THE 10 19, THE THIRD DISTRICT, AND I HAD NO IDEA WHY HE WANTED ME TO COME THERE.
[02:40:01]
AS I GOT OUTTA MY UNIT IN THE PARKING GARAGE AND WHEN I GRABBED THE DOOR HANDLE TO KEY FO MY WAY IN, I JUST TAPPED MY BODY CAMERA BECAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT HE WAS CALLING ME FOR.AND UH, I JUST HAD SOME TRUST ISSUES WITH HIM, SO I REALLY HIT THE BODY CAMERA FOR MY SAFETY 'CAUSE I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT HE WANTED.
SO I CAME TO SEE WHAT HE WANT AND THAT'S WHEN I SAW HIM AND GRIMES SITTING IN A ROLL CALL ROOM.
UM, AND THEN YOU WERE MADE AWARE, YOU BECAME AWARE THAT IT WAS ABOUT THE REPORT.
AND ONCE SAW GRIMES, IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT.
NOW, WAS THIS A MEETING ON DISCIPLINE? IT WAS NOT.
UM, I MEAN IF IT WAS A MEETING ON DISCIPLINE, COULD, COULD HE HAVE A REPRESENTATIVE IF HE WERE IN A DISCIPLINE MEETING? YES SIR.
KEYING OFFICER GRIMES? UH, HE COULD.
BUT IN YOUR OPINION, THIS WAS NOT THE REASON FOR THE MEETING, IS THAT RIGHT? IT WASN'T, I HAD NO IDEA GRIMES WAS THERE.
AND BASED ON WHAT IT WAS ABOUT, UM, DID YOU THINK IT APPROPRIATE, NOW LOOKING BACK, THE CORPORAL JONES WAS THERE FOR A MEETING ON THIS REPORT.
IT WAS INAPPROPRIATE FOR CORPORAL JONES TO BE THERE BECAUSE AT THAT TIME HE WAS RELIEVED OF HIS DUTIES AS A FIELD TRAINING OFFICER.
AND CORPORAL AND TRAINEE GRINDS WAS ACTUALLY ASSIGNED TO ANOTHER DISTRICT, TO ANOTHER FIELD TRAINING OFFICER BECAUSE HE WAS, HE WAS RELIEVED OF HIS DUTIES BY THE TRAINING ACADEMY.
SO IS IT ACCURATE THEN THAT HE NO LONGER HAD SUPERVISORY DUTIES OVER OFFICER GRIMES ON MAY 11TH, 2024? THAT'S CORRECT.
UM, NOW AGAIN, WE SAW YOU GIVE HIM SEVERAL ORDERS.
LEAVE THE ROOM, BE QUIET, GO TEN EIGHT AND ASSIST IN REVISING THE REPORT.
DO YOU PERCEIVE ANY OF THOSE DIRECT ORDERS THAT YOU GAVE AS BEING UNLAWFUL? NO, SIR.
DID YOU COMMUNICATE THAT WITH CORPORAL JONES THAT YOU BELIEVE THAT YOUR ORDERS WERE LAWFUL? YES SIR.
UH, DID LIEUTENANT MILLER ALSO ADVISE THAT THE ORDERS WERE LAWFUL? YES SIR, HE DID.
AND AGAIN, EVEN AFTER YOU COMMUNICATED THAT WITH CORPORAL JONES, HE DID NOT FOLLOW THOSE ORDERS, CORRECT? HE DID NOT.
LET'S TURN TO EXHIBIT SIX, PLEASE.
THIS IS A LETTER DATED MAY 12, UM, FROM YOU TO CHIEF MORRIS, IS THAT CORRECT? YES SIR, IT IS.
AND WAS THIS A COMPLAINT REGARDING, UH, THE BEHAVIOR OF CORPORAL JONES IN THAT MAY 11 MEETING AND SOME OTHER CONDUCT PR PRIOR TO THAT? IT IS, IT STARTS OFF WITH THE, UH, WITH THE INCIDENT FROM HOME DEPOT.
UM, WHY THE LADY INITIAL CALLED AND COMPLAINED ABOUT THE REPORT.
UM, AND BUT THIS WAS THE, THE CULMINATION OF EVENTS THERE WAS THE MAY 11TH, 2024 INCIDENT, CORRECT? YES SIR.
UM, AND YOU WROTE THAT BECAUSE OF WHAT HAPPENED THAT NIGHT, CORRECT? I DID THAT DAY, I SHOULD SAY.
DID, BASED ON JUST YOUR EXPERIENCE THAT DAY WITH CORPORAL JONES, DID YOU BELIEVE THAT SOME TYPE OF DISCIPLINE WAS WARRANTED RELATIVE TO HIS CONDUCT THAT DAY? YES SIR.
AND YOUR BELIEF ABOUT THAT, THAT'S JUST ABOUT THE EVENTS THAT HAPPENED IN THAT ROOM THAT ARE ON THAT RECORDING, IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT.
THAT'S ALL THE QUESTIONS I HAVE,
UH, IN PREPARATION FOR TODAY'S HEARING, UH, WHAT MATERIALS HAVE YOU REVIEWED IN PREPARING FOR TODAY? NONE.
HAVE YOU, SINCE THIS INCIDENT OF MAY 11TH, HAVE YOU WATCHED THIS VIDEO? I WATCHED THIS VIDEO, UH, THE DAYS PRIOR TO IT.
'CAUSE I HAVE TO WRITE THIS LETTER WITH THE CHIEF'S OFFICE.
SO I REVIEWED THE, UH, THE BODY CAMERA, MY BODY CAMERA, AS WELL AS THE BODY CAMERA FROM THE HOME DEPOT.
SINCE THEN, I HAVEN'T, UH, REVIEWED ANYTHING.
AND WHEN YOU WATCHED THIS VIDEO, DID YOU WATCH THIS VIDEO IN ITS ENTIRETY? I DID.
DO YOU RECALL YOUR INTERACTIONS, UH, WITH, UH, HALEY ALEXANDER? I DO.
BEING NOTIFIED OVER THE RADIO ABOUT THE MEETING, UH, ON MAY 11TH.
WERE YOU INSTRUCTED OF, WAS IT, WAS THE MEETING JUST WITH YOU OVER THE RADIO OR DID YOU KNOW IF ANYONE ELSE WAS ASKED TO COME TO THE MEETING? I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS A MEETING.
HE ASKED ME THE 10 19, THAT MEETING AND POLICE LANGUAGE COME TO HEADQUARTERS OR COME TO WHERE I'M AT.
[02:45:01]
AND SO I JUST SIMPLY WENT TO HEADQUARTERS WHERE HE WAS.UM, WHY DID THE, THE MEETING START WITHOUT, WHEN, WHEN, UH, TERRANCE NOAH WAS ASKED TO BE AT THE MEETING? UH, DID YOU HAVE ANY REASON TO PAUSE OR TO WAIT FOR HIM OR COULD YOU HAVE GOTTEN HIM OR IS THAT AN OPTION? WHEN, WHEN WHO WAS ASKED TO BE AT THE MEETING? UH, OFFICER NOAH.
WHEN WAS HE ASKED TO BE AT THE MEETING? UH, IN THE VIDEO? UH, I BELIEVE ERNEST JONES ASKED, CAN, CAN MR. NOAH, OFFICER NOAH BE PRESENT? WELL, TERRENCE UH, OFFICER NOAH IS THE, UH, AT THE TIME HE WAS THE NEXT SENIOR GUY ON THE SQUAD.
AND NORMALLY, UH, IF I'M MEETING WITH ANOTHER OFFICER, I HAVE THE NEXT SENIOR GUY THERE, UH, AS A THIRD PARTY WITNESS BECAUSE I DON'T MEET PRIVATELY WITH INDIVIDUAL OFFICERS ALONE BECAUSE, UH, YOU KNOW, UM, THEY MAY HAVE FORGETFUL MEMORIES ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED.
ALWAYS HAVE AT LEAST, UH, ONE, I JUST DO THAT THROUGHOUT MY CAREER, BOTH CAREERS.
UH, I ALWAYS DO, BUT IT JUST WASN'T, IT WASN'T DONE THAT DAY THOUGH.
BE, I DIDN'T ALLOW NOR TO COME BECAUSE THE BODY CAMERA WAS ROLLING.
I, I HAD ALREADY ACTIVATED MY BODY CAMERA.
HE KNEW IT WAS ROLLING BECAUSE IT BEEPS EVERY TWO MINUTES.
AND I PERSONALLY TURNED IT UP LOUD.
AND SO IF YOU LISTEN TO THE VIDEO EVERY TWO MINUTES, THAT A BEEP THAT LET THE OFFICERS KNOW THAT SOMEBODY IS RECORDING.
I GUESS I'M ASKING, SO IS GENERALLY IT'S YOUR POLICY TO HAVE A LEVEL OF ACCOUNTABILITY AND HAVE MULTIPLE PEOPLE THERE.
IS THAT CORRECT? I DON'T HAVE A POLICY, WRITTEN POLICY.
UNDERSTAND, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE ASKING ME.
NO, I'M I BUT YOU MEAN, IS IT SOMETHING THAT I NORMALLY DO? HOW YOU, HOW YOU NORMALLY CONDUCT BUSINESS.
YOU, YOU LIKE TO HAVE WITNESSES PRESENT, IS THAT CORRECT? UM, WHEN ASKED FOR WITNESSES THIS DAY, IS IT YOUR TESTIMONY YOU DIDN'T DO IT BECAUSE YOUR CAMERA WAS ROLLING? MY WITNESS WAS THE DEPARTMENT AXON BODY CAMERA.
THAT WAS A WITNESS THAT DON'T BLINK.
SO WHEN HE WANTED OFFICER NO, IN THERE, WE DON'T NEED NO, I I GOT THE BODY CAMERA ROLLING.
SO WHAT, WHAT, WHAT EXACTLY DO YOU WANT? OKAY.
SO IN OTHER MEETINGS WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE A BODY CAMERA, YOU, YOU HAVE OTHER PERSONS PRESENT.
BUT I ALWAYS HAVE A BODY CAMERA.
UH, SO YOU MENTIONED EARLIER YOU TESTIFIED TO TRUST ISSUES AND THAT'S WHY YOU ACTIVATED THE BODY CAMERA.
UM, COULD YOU ELABORATE, ELABORATE ON THE TRUST ISSUE? ON, ON WHAT'S YOUR TRUST ISSUES WITH CORPORAL JONES? I'VE BEEN KNOWING CORPORAL JONES FOR SEVERAL YEARS AND I'VE LEARNED THAT, UH, UM, HE EXAGGERATES AND NOT ALWAYS CORRECT ON INFORMATION THAT HE BRING FORWARD.
I JUST, UH, I LEARNED THAT FROM KNOWING HIM OVER SEVERAL YEARS.
AND IN A SITUATION LIKE THIS WHERE I'M HIS SUPERVISOR, I HAVE TO PROTECT MYSELF.
REGARDING THE, YOUR THE REPORT ITSELF MM-HMM
UH, YOUR TESTIMONY IS THAT THE VICTIM CONTACTED YOU AND SHE TOLD YOU THINGS THAT HAPPENED ON THE INCIDENT.
UM, DO YOU KNOW HOW SHE RECEIVED THE REPORT? DO I KNOW HOW SHE RECEIVED THE REPORT? I DON'T KNOW HOW SHE RECEIVED THE REPORT OR IF SHE DID RECEIVE A REPORT, BUT SHE SPECIFICALLY TOLD ME THAT THE REPORT WAS INACCURATE.
SO FOR HER TO TELL YOU THAT THE REPORT WAS INACCURATE, I MEAN, IS IT LOGICAL TO ASSUME THAT SHE MUST HAVE SEEN THE REPORT OR HAD SOME ISSUE WITH IT FROM SOMEWHERE? WELL, IN ORDER FOR HER TO TELL ME THAT IT WAS INACCURATE, SHE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE SEEN IT.
UH, BECAUSE SHE SPECIFICALLY TOLD ME THAT THE CHARGES WAS WRONG AND INCORRECT AND OFFICER GRIMES SAID THIS AND SAID THAT.
AND I WENT BACK AND LOOKED AT THE VIDEO, UH, THE BODY CAMERA VIDEO.
NOT ONLY, UH, I LOOKED AT EVERYBODY BODY CAMERA VIDEO THAT WAS OUT THERE.
'CAUSE WHEN YOU PULL IT UP, IT PULLS UP ALL ASSOCIATES THAT'S OUT THERE.
AND I LOOKED AT ALL OF THEM BEFORE YOU MADE CONTACT WITH, UH, CORPORAL JONES.
AND, AND WHAT DID YOU FEEL LOOKING AT ALL THE BODY CAMERA FOOTAGE WAS, WAS MISSING FROM THEIR REPORT? UM, FOR STARTERS, CORPORAL JONES WAS SHIRTING DUTIES BECAUSE, UH, HER, HER VEHICLE WAS BURGLARIZED AND HE DIDN'T CHARGE IT WITH BURGLARY.
SHE HAD SEVERAL MISSING ITEMS, UH, $10 A FACE MASK.
AND NONE OF THAT WAS IN THE REPORT.
UM, SHE WAS TRYING TO GET HER CAR FIXED.
SHE SAID THAT THE GIRL DID APPROXIMATELY $500 WORTH OF DAMAGE AND SHE NEEDED A REPORT TO GET HER INSURANCE TO, UH, TO FIX IT.
AND SO WHEN I LOOKED, THE REPORT WAS NONE OF THAT IN IT.
SO WHEN YOU WERE TALKING, WAS THIS A PHONE CALL OR, YES.
UM, WOULD YOU CALL THIS AN INTERVIEW? WAS IT AN INTERVIEW? YEAH.
MEANING WITH, WITH THE VICTIM.
IT WAS A TELEPHONE CONVERSATION.
UH, IS THERE ANY I'M TAKING A COMPLAINT 'CAUSE IT WAS A COMPLAINT AND IT WAS A SUPERVISOR
[02:50:01]
LEVEL COMPLAINT.BUT NONE OF THIS WAS RECORDED OR YES, IT WAS RECORDED.
HOW WAS IT RECORDED? PHONE CONVERSATION LIKE ON YOUR PERSONAL CELL PHONE ON THE APP? YES, BECAUSE, UH, SHE CALLED AT ANY POINT.
WAS ANY OF THAT UPLOADED TO MAYBE EVIDENCE? UM, I GAVE IT TO IA AND ALSO GAVE IT TO, UH, MR. JAMES RIMES.
DO YOU, I GUESS CORPORAL JONES DID TELL YOU, AND YOU'VE HEARD THAT, YOU KNOW, HE WAS TOLD TO GIVE CERTAIN CHARGES BY LIEUTENANT MILLER.
UH, DO YOU DISPUTE THAT OR? I DON'T REMEMBER HIM TELLING.
LIEUTENANT MILLER TOLD HIM TO CHARGE HIM WITH CERTAIN CHARGES.
'CAUSE LIEUTENANT MILLER GOT INVOLVED AS WELL.
AND HE AND HIM AND I AGREED THAT THE REPORT WASN'T RIGHT AND IT NEEDED TO BE CORRECTED.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THE REPORT.
OTHER THAN YOU SAID THAT THERE'S MISSING CHARGES.
UH, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE REPORT THAT YOU FELT WAS WRONG? WHAT DO YOU MEAN? YOU GOTTA YOU GOTTA BE SPECIFIC LIKE DATE, TIME GROUP.
NO, OTHER THAN YOU MENTIONED THE MIXING OF CHARGES.
AS, AS AN ISSUE YOU HAD WITH THE REPORT.
I'M ASKING YOU RIGHT NOW, WHAT, WHAT IS ANOTHER ISSUE YOU HAD WITH THE REPORT, IF YOU CAN RECALL? THE MIXING.
UH, THE MIXING THE MIXING OF CHARGES BECAUSE WE CANNOT HAVE MAKE EASY NOT GO TO CITY COURT OR DISTRICT COURT.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ARE FAMILIAR WITH HOW UH, THE CRIMINAL SYSTEM WORKED WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, BUT WE'D HAVE TO SEND THE CHARGES TO ALL THE WAY TO DISTRICT COURT OR TO CITY COURT.
I CAN'T SEND HALF OF IT TO CITY COURT AND HALF OF IT TO 19 JDC.
OTHER THAN THAT I'M ASKING, YES, HE DIDN'T, WITH THE REPORT, HE DIDN'T HAVE, UH, BURGLARY.
HE DIDN'T CHARGE IT WITH BURGLARY.
HE DIDN'T, UH, CHARGE A CHARGE WITH THE DAMAGE, UH, UH, THE VEHICLE DAMAGE, SIMPLE DAMAGE TO PROPERTY.
UH, HE, HE DIDN'T CHARGE IT WITH NONE OF THAT.
IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE REPORT THAT STOPPED YOU FROM APPROVING IT? I WASN'T GONNA APPROVE IT BECAUSE IT WASN'T CORRECT.
IT DIDN'T HAVE THE RIGHT CHARGES IN IT.
IS IT TRUE YOU DIDN'T LIKE YOUR NAME BEING IN THIS REPORT? IT'S NOT THAT I DIDN'T LIKE MY NAME.
IT'S HOW IT'S WORDED BECAUSE CORPORAL JONES AND, AND TRAINEE GRINDS WOULD HAVE TO BE THE ONES TESTIFYING TO THE REPORT IN COURT.
AND THERE'S NO DIFFERENCE THAN IF YOU WOULD WRITE A TRAFFIC TICKET AND CHARGE SOMEBODY WITH SPEEDING.
BUT THEN YOU PUT A SEATBELT CHARGE ON THERE AND I TELL YOU, HEY, THIS IS THE WRONG CHARGE.
I'M NOT GONNA COME TO COURT AND TESTIFY ON YOUR TICKET.
YOU ARE, I'M JUST CORRECTING THE CHARGES 'CAUSE YOU, BECAUSE IT'S INCORRECT.
SO A PERSON HAS TO TESTIFY AN OFFICER WHEN HE WRITES A REPORT TO HIS PERSONAL KNOWLEDGE.
IS THAT CORRECT? UH, TO HIS PERSONAL KNOWLEDGE AS WELL AS WHAT HE WRITTEN ON THE ACTUAL REPORT.
SO YOU DIDN'T, YOU DON'T LIKE HIM SAYING, I MEAN, IS IT TRUE YOU JUST DON'T LIKE HIM USING YOUR NAME TO DESCRIBE THAT YOU TOLD HIM THESE THINGS? IT'S HOW NO, THAT'S INCORRECT.
IS THAT, NO, THAT'S INCORRECT.
'CAUSE I'VE TESTIFIED IN COURT A DOZEN TIMES.
MY NAME IS IN A LOT OF REPORTS.
SO THAT, THAT, THAT WAS NOT THE ISSUE.
SO, SO WHAT WAS WRONG WITH, WHAT WAS WRONG WITH OFFICER GRIMES SAYING, SERGEANT SMITH TOLD ME THESE THINGS AND THIS IS WHY I'M ADDING THIS TO THE REPORT.
WELL, THE ISSUE IS THAT AT THE TIME SERGEANT, UH, TRAINEE GRIMES IS IN TRAINING, HE DOES NOT KNOW HOW TO WRITE A REPORT.
CORPORAL JONES WAS NOT TEACHING HIM CORRECTLY HOW TO WRITE A REPORT AND HOW TO DO POLICE WORK CORRECTLY.
HE WAS, HE WAS, HE WAS CUTTING CORNERS WITH HIM.
SO I DON'T FAULT OFFICER GRIMES, OFFICER GRIMES IS AN INNOCENT VICTIM IN THIS.
HE DID NOT KNOW HE WAS BEING TRAINED INCORRECTLY BY CORPORAL JONES.
THAT'S WHY HE CORPORAL JONES WAS RELIEVED FROM HIS FTO DUTIES BY THE TRAINING ACADEMY.
HAVING BEEN THROUGH THE ENTIRETY OF THIS MEETING AND HAVING REVIEWED THE ENTIRETY OF THE FOOTAGE, UH, IS IT STILL YOUR TESTIMONY TODAY THAT SOMETHING WAS WRONG WITH THE REPORT? IT IS.
WERE YOU EVER TOLD THAT THE REPORT ON MAY 11TH, WERE YOU EVER TOLD THAT THE REPORT WAS CORRECT? HELI ALEXANDER, WHEN SHE CAME IN, SHE SAID THE REPORT WAS CORRECT AND I ASKED HER, AND IT'S ON THE VIDEO AND I WAS, AND I SAID, YOU MEAN TO TELL ME THAT WE COULD SEND CITY AND DISTRICT COURT CHARGES IN THE SAME FILE? HELI ALEXANDER SAID THAT IT'S HIS REPORT, HE CAN TESTIFY AGAINST IT.
AND SO WHEN SHE BECAME, UH, I DON'T WANNA USE THE WORDS COMBATIVE, BUT WHEN SHE, HOLD ON, LET ME, LET ME OBJECT RIGHT NOW.
'CAUSE WE'RE GETTING INTO WHAT YEAH, WE NEED TO, WE HAVEN'T WATCHED THE VIDEO AND I'D SAY IT'S IRRELEVANT TO THE, TO THE SITUATION.
UM, I THINK THIS IS A, IF I MAY, I BELIEVE THIS IS A PERFECT TIME TO ADDRESS THE VIDEO BEFORE WE CAN PLAY IT AGAIN AND THE RELEVANCY OF IT BEFORE THE BOARD.
SO MS. ALEXANDER IS, WHAT IS HER RIGHT? CORPORAL CORPORAL CORPORAL ALEXANDER, UM, IS A UNION REP.
AND SO EVENTUALLY AFTER THIS VIDEO CONTINUES TO PLAY, UM, SHE SHOWS UP AT
[02:55:01]
THE SCENE TO SIT THERE WITH OFFICER GRIMES AND COMMUNICATE WITH SERGEANT SMITH AND LIEUTENANT MILLER ABOUT THE REPORT.UM, CORPORAL JONES HAS ALREADY GONE AT THIS POINT, HE'S ALREADY BEEN RELIEVED OF HIS DUTIES.
SO HE IS NOT THERE, HE'S NOT PRESENT.
THE CHARGES THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH, HIS VIOLATIONS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH HER EX HER OPINION ABOUT THE THE POLICE REPORT AND WHETHER IT WAS VALID OR NOT.
WE'RE JUST, THE, THE CHARGES ARE RELATED TO THE CONDUCT THAT WE WATCHED.
WHETHER A UNION REP, UM, BELIEVES THAT THE REPORT WAS CORRECT OR INCORRECT, REALLY DOESN'T HAVE ANY MATTER TO WHAT WE'RE DEALING WITH HERE TODAY.
SO IF WE START GOING DOWN THAT ROAD, WE'RE GONNA WATCH A BUNCH OF VIDEO.
WE'RE GONNA HEAR TESTIMONY FROM FOLKS THAT, I MEAN, HONESTLY, WE DON'T EVER ALLOW THE UNION TO COME IN AND JUST GIVE THEIR OPINION ABOUT, UH, INTERNAL AFFAIRS CASES.
UM, YOU'VE NEVER SEEN, IN ANY CASE THAT I'VE EVER HAD THE UNION HAVE A REPRESENTATIVE TO JUST COME IN HERE AND TESTIFY ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THEY BELIEVE, UH, WHAT WAS DONE WAS APPROPRIATE.
THAT'S NOT THE POINT OR THE PLACE OF THE UNION REP.
AND SHE WASN'T THERE TO ASSIST CORPORAL JONES.
SHE WAS THERE TO ASSIST OFFICER GRIMES.
WELL, I'M EXPLAINING MY POSITION.
WELL, NO, I'M, I'M OBJECTING TO THE VIDEO EVEN BEING SHOWN BE SHOW YOU USING YOUR MIC.
UM, I, I THINK IF I'M, I'M SURE WE, UM, KNOW IT OR NOT THAT WELL HOLD ON, HOLD ON IN YOUR RESPONSE REAL QUICK, REAL QUICK.
WE'RE GONNA LET HIM FINISH THE ARGUMENT, THEN WE'RE GONNA LET Y'ALL RESPOND TO THE OBJECTION AND THEN WE'RE GONNA RULE ON IT.
THIS IS JUST A RELEVANCY OBJECTION AND I'M OBJECTING TO IT BEFORE ANYTHING WOULD BE PLAYED THAT I THINK IS IRRELEVANT FOR THE BOARD TO VIEW.
IN RESPONSE TO THAT OBJECTION, THE VIDEO IS VERY RELEVANT, I THINK TO, TO OMIT THE VIDEO OR FOR THE OTHER ATTORNEY TO NOT WANT TO SHOW THIS PART OF IT WHILE THE PERSON IS TESTIFIED WHO'S PRESENT IN THE VIDEO.
WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT HOURS OF VIDEO FOOTAGE.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A 10 MINUTE CONVERSATION.
THE WHOLE POINT OF, THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS IS THE REPORT.
THEY'RE IN THIS MEETING, HAVING THIS MEETING BECAUSE SOMETHING WAS DEEMED WRONG.
UH, YOU, HE'S BEEN CORPORAL JONES AT THIS POINT IN THE VIDEO HAS BEEN PUNISHED BECAUSE OF SERGEANT SMITH'S BELIEF THAT SOMETHING WAS DONE WRONG AND NEEDED TO BE CHANGED.
AND THEY'RE NOT AGREEING TO DO THAT.
UH, I FEEL THAT THE REMAINDER OF THE VIDEO SPEAKS POTENTIALLY CHANGES SERGEANT SMITH'S POSITION.
YOU CAN WATCH SERGEANT SMITH'S POSITION CHANGE OVER THE COURSE OF THIS VIDEO.
UH, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S BEYOND RELEVANT.
I DON'T THINK IT WOULD, I THINK IT WOULD BE MORE PREJUDICIAL TO NOT HAVE IT, TO NOT SHOW IT, UH, TO EXCLUDE THIS, THIS THING WOULD BE MORE OF A, AN OMISSION.
UH, IT'S, IT'S A 10 MINUTE CLIP WE'RE TRYING TO PLAY.
WE, WE, WE DID PROMISE AT THE OUTSET OF THIS THAT WE WOULD SHOW WHATEVER YOU WANTED TO SHOVE DURING YOUR TIME.
AND I THINK WE'LL LIVE UP TO THAT.
NO, WHAT, WHAT WE, WE SAID WAS THEY WOULD HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, BUT I SAID I WOULD SUSTAIN, I WOULD STILL RAISE MY OBJECTIONS.
HE'LL RECOGNIZE YOUR OBJECTION, BUT I THINK THAT WE OUGHT TO LET COUNSEL PLAY THE VIDEO IF HE WANTS TO.
WELL THEN I WOULD ASK YOU, YOU AT A MINIMUM RULE ON THE RELEVANCY OBJECTION.
BUT WE'LL, WE'LL PLAY STARTING AT HOUR ONE HOUR 20 MINUTES OF UH, EXHIBIT ONE.
YEAH, IT'S ABOUT TIM, IF YOU'D LIKE TO SIT DOWN, YOU CAN.
I'D JUST LET HIM STAND THE WHOLE TIME.
FAST FORWARD TO ONE HOUR AND 20 MINUTES.
[03:00:02]
YOU CAN PLAY.HEY MAN, YOU COME, YOU AIN'T GOTTA KNOCK.
PUT YOUR COMPUTER AND HAVE A SEAT OVER THERE.
HOW YOU DOING? YOU WAS AT HOME WHEN THEY CALLED YOU? MM-HMM
WHO CALLED YOU? HOW YOU GET INVOLVED IN IT? UH, EVERYONE CALLED ME.
I'M JUST, I'M JUST, I'M JUST WONDERING WHAT DO YOU MEAN? UH, HOW YOU GET INVOLVED IN IT? BECAUSE I'M A UNION REP.
SO WHAT JONES CALLED A UNION REP OR SOMETHING CALLED YOU? NO, NO, I HAVEN'T CALLED JONES.
OH, WELL I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT.
SO, UH, HE TOLD YOU WHAT'S GOING ON? I'M UH, I HAVE AN AMBULANCE THERE THAT I'M GONNA RECORD THE ENTIRE TIME.
DID HE TELL YOU WHAT'S, UH, 'CAUSE I'M ALREADY RECORDING.
SO DID HE TELL YOU, UH, DID JONES TELL YOU, UH, SYNOPSIS WHAT'S GOING ON? YES.
HOW DID HE EXPLAIN THE REPORT? HE DIDN'T EXPLAIN.
HE DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO, I CAME AND SPOKE TO HIM.
I, I CALLED JOHN AS HE WAS ON HIS WAY HOME WITH, UH, I FORGOT THIS WAS AUGUSTINE.
UH, HE JUST SAID HE, I ASKED HIM, HE WAS LIKE, I MARIO ON THE WAY HOME.
I SAID, OKAY, WE'LL TALK LATER.
SO, UH, THE REPORT WAS, UH, APRIL 2ND, 2024.
SO, UH, BASICALLY, BASICALLY THEY WENT TO A CALL AT THE HOME DEPOT AIRLINE HIGHWAY.
UM, THE CALL WAS ONE OF THE EMPLOYEE'S CARS WAS BURGLARIZED.
SHE, UH, TOOK SOME PILLS AND THEN SHE TOOK, I THINK IT WAS $10.
WAS IT 10 TO $30? HOW MUCH WAS IT? SHE SAID $10 OUT OF THE CAR.
UH, THE OWNER WORKS AT HOME DEPOT AND THE SUBJECT HAD A BOX CUT.
AND WAS GONNA TRY TO SLICE UP WITH IT.
SO WHEN I READ THE REPORT, WHEN THEY SENT THE REPORT IN THE VERY FIRST TIME, I DIDN'T KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE CALL OR WHATEVER IT WAS.
THE LADY CALLED UP HERE AND SHE STARTED TO TELL ME WHAT HAPPENED ON THE CALL AND WHAT WAS GOING ON.
LOOKED THE REPORT UP, THE REPORT HAD NONE OF THAT UP IN IT.
I SIMPLY CALLED UH, UH, GRIMES.
DID I CALL JONES? I CALLED GRIMES, TOLD GRIMES TO FIX REPORT.
THIS IS WHAT THE LADY SAID ACTUALLY HAPPENED.
UH, JONES INSTRUCTED HIM NOT TO WRITE, TO REPORT LIKE THAT BECAUSE AT FIRST IT WAS GOING TO CITY COURT 1356.
THAT WAS SOMETHING DAMAGE TO PROPERTY.
THAT'S HOW THEY ORIGINALLY WROTE IT.
AFTER THE LADY CALLED AND SAID THAT SHE BROKE INTO HER CAR AND THAT SHE HAD THE KNIFE.
OKAY, WELL NOT I'LL HAVE TO GO TO DISTRICT COURT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T SEND A SIMPLE BURGLARY TO CITY COURT.
SO TELLING 'EM TO FIX IT JONES TELLING HIM, UH, NOT TO FIX IT.
SO WHEN HE DECIDED TO GO IN TO THE REPORT AND HAVE YOU, HAVE YOU READ THE REPORT YET? PART OF IT? YEAH.
SO WHEN HE WENT IN AND I WAS LOOKING AT IT AND UH, HE PUT, UH, WHAT'S THIS 1, 2, 3, HE PUT THE ID THE FOURTH PARAGRAPH, I INSTRUCTED HIM TO CHANGE THE 13 COLON TO 14 COLON.
SO IN THE ONE IN THE 1, 2, 3 FOURTH PARAGRAPH, THE LAST PART OF THAT SENTENCE WHERE IT SAYS, UH, WHERE IT SAYS SERGEANT SMITH, ADDITIONAL ORDERS ARE AS FOLLOWS AT AGGRAVATED ASSAULT DUE TO LEWIS STATING ON THE PHONE CALL WITH SERGEANT SMITH THAT MO HAD THREATENED HER WITH THE BOX CUTTER AND TO CHANGE THE 1356 STATUTE ON THE SUMS TO 1456 BECAUSE ALL CHARGES NEEDED TO GO, UH, NEEDED TO BE FILED IN THE SAME COURT.
THAT SENTENCE DON'T NEED TO BE UP IN THERE, TRY TO TELL HIM TO TAKE IT OUT OF THERE.
HE DON'T WANT TAKE IT OUT OF THERE BECAUSE JONES TOLD HIM DON'T TAKE IT OUT OF THERE.
WELL, HE DOESN'T HAVE TO TAKE IT OUT OF THERE.
HE DON'T HAVE TO TAKE IT OUT OF THERE.
IT IS, IT IS, IT IS HIS REPORT.
BUT HE DON'T HAVE TO WRITE IT NOW.
[03:05:01]
SAID CHANGE FROM 13 BECAUSE 13 CODE IS NOT UP THERE.WELL DID YOU, DID I WHAT? TELL HIM TO CHANGE.
I SAID WE GOT, WE GOTTA SEND IT OFF TO 19 JDC 14 COURT.
THAT'S WHY I TOLD HIM TO CHANGE IT.
SO I SIMPLY TOLD HIM, HEY, TAKE THAT SENTENCE OUT OF THERE.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO TELL THE COURTS, I TOLD YOU TO CHANGE IT TO 13 COLON FOR 14 BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO 19 JDC IN.
THEY'RE GONNA ORDER AN EXPLANATION AS TO WHY HE HAD TO CHANGE THE CHARGES, WHY HE HAD TO CHANGE THE CHARGES.
WELL, I GOT THAT, BUT HE CHANGED THE CHARGES ON THE OFFENSE PAGE.
HE, HE CHANGED THE CHARGES ON THE, HE WAS TRYING TO JUSTIFY HIS NARRATIVE WHY HE CHANGED THE OFFENSE PAGE.
YEAH, WELL SEE THE, IT, IT STILL SHOWS THE CITY CHARGE IN THE NARRATIVE, BUT YET IT SHOWS DISTRICT COURT CHARGES.
BASICALLY WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO GET HIM TO DO IS JUST FIX IT TO THE BEST OF HIS KNOWLEDGE FROM THE INVESTIGATION HE DID TO MATCH THE CHARGES.
WE WEREN'T TRYING TO TELL HIM WHAT TO PUT IN THE REPORT.
WE JUST WANTED TO FIX IT BASED ON HIS INVESTIGATION.
BECAUSE WE'VE BEEN GETTING COMPLAINTS.
WE GOT SEVERAL EMAILS ABOUT THAT REPORT THAT NEED TO GET CORRECTED IN COMPLETED THAT NEED TO BE CORRECTED IN COMPLAINT BASED OFF THE INFORMATION THAT YOU RECEIVED LATER, UH, THIS WAS SENT BY, UH, BRANDON BLACKWELL REGARDING THIS, AND THIS WAS SENT MAY 7TH.
AND THE ORIGINAL ONE THAT IT NEEDED FOR PROCESSING IN COURT WAS APRIL 29TH.
WE GOT THIS FROM, UH, THE CHANEL YOUNG IN THE CLERICAL OFFICE.
AND AS SUPERVISORS WE REVIEW REPORTS, WE SEE WHAT NEEDS CORRECTIONS AND THAT'S IT, IT'S, IT, IT DIDN'T HAVE TO TURN INTO THIS AND MM-HMM
I MEAN, I TRIED TO GET IN TOUCH WITH A LIEUTENANT MAYO WHEN HE HADN'T CALLED ME BACK YET.
WELL, HE'S AT, HE'S AT POLICE WEEKEND.
HE OH, HE IS? OH, I EXPLAIN HIS, HIS SISTER WOULD KILLED A ON OF DUTY, SO HE'S GONNA BE THERE.
WELL I KNOW HE WAS, BUT CORPORAL BLACKWELL RUNS THE FT O PROGRAM.
SO THAT'S HIS FIRST TIME SUPERVISING.
BUT I, I'VE, I'VE CORP UH, LIEUTENANT MAYO'S HAD A COUPLE OF MEETINGS WITH ME ALREADY.
UM, ABOUT WHAT'S BEEN GOING ON.
ABOUT THESE PARTICULAR REPORTS TOO, BECAUSE THEY DID SHOW UP AT HIS DOOR MM-HMM
AND HE SAID THAT REPORT WAS INCORRECT.
WHO SAYS THAT? THIS REPORT MAYO.
SO I WAS TRYING TO GET HIM BACK ON THE PHONE TO LET HIM KNOW WHAT WE'RE UP AGAINST.
AND SO HIS CURRENT SUPERVISORS AND UH, HE REPORT THAT BLACKWELL, HIS EMAIL TOLD ME TO MAKE, I'M LOOKING AT THAT.
I WHAT YOU SAY? THE CORPORAL BLACKWELL EMAIL HIM ABOUT THE SUPPLEMENT MM-HMM
EVERYTHING THAT IN THE EMAIL WAS CHANGED.
IT'S THE WAY THAT UH, WHOLE BLACKWELL SAID DID, WAS THAT SENT TO US? UM, IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE, SEE THAT'S THE PROBLEM.
I GOT LIEUTENANT MAYO TELLING ME SOMETHING ELSE AND CORPORAL BLACKWELL DOING SOMETHING AND, AND THAT'S FINE.
WELL, THAT'S, THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT OF THE, THE RANK STRUCTURE OF THE TRAINING ACADEMY.
CORPORAL BLACKWELLS HIS FIRST LINE SUPERVISOR AFTER THE FDSI.
BUT I HAD A LIEUTENANT APPROACH ME A FELLOW LIEUTENANT.
SO WHAT DID YOU SAY BLACKWELL SAY? YOU, YOU SAY HE TOLD HIM WHAT NOW? HE HAD HIM CHANGE.
I COULD NOT ADD CHARGES AFTER THE ARREST.
HE ALSO SAID IN THE THIRD PARAGRAPH, THE ADDITIONAL CHARGES AND, AND FROM INFORMATION HE REMOVED THE WORD.
HE ALSO SAID, UH, TO ADDRESS WHY HIS BODY CAMERA WASN'T ON.
[03:10:01]
AND THAT WAY THE DETECTIVE WOULD KNOW TO REVIEW HIS BODY CAMERA.SO WHAT DOES SOMETHING, WHAT ABOUT CONFLICTING CHARGES? HEY, YOU OUTSIDE LOOKING AT, UH, I'M LOOKING AT THE CHARGES.
HEY, I'M, I'M GONNA COME BRING YOU THE KEY AND JUST SWITCH IT OUT AND BRING IT BACK TO THIRTEENS.
EARLIER TODAY WHEN I WALKED IN HERE, HAS THAT BEEN, HAS THAT BEEN FIXED? I'M IN THE MINIMUM MEETING.
IT'S STILL IN THE ORIGINAL REPORT.
I, SO IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT WAS AN OUTSTANDING REPORT.
THE SUPPLEMENT'S THE ONLY THING THAT'S OUT THAT IS IN THE SUPPLEMENT.
BUT YOUR REASON IS IN THE SUPPLEMENT.
I KNOW, BUT THE, I GOTTA GET THIS IN MY DAUGHTER.
THE CHARGES, I'M LOOKING AT THE, THE CHARGES 13, THEY'RE IN THE ORIGINAL REPORT.
SO AS FAR AS YOU CAN TELL EVERYTHING TO FIXED, I MEAN, YEAH.
AND I UNDERSTAND HE DOESN'T WANT HIM TO PUT THAT HE TOLD HIM TO, BUT HE CAN'T MAKE HIM TAKE THAT OFF THIS REPORT.
SEE, MY, THE, THE THING WAS IS WE WEREN'T TRYING TO MAKE HIM TAKE ANYTHING OUT.
IT'S MORE OR LESS I'VE CONSULTED WITH MY SUPERVISOR AND THIS IS WHAT COMES ABOUT BECAUSE HE'S DONE AN INVESTIGATION.
AS A SUPERVISOR, YOU CAN'T TELL SOMEBODY YOU NEED TO DO THIS AND DO THAT IF IT WASN'T THERE.
BUT YET OFFICERS DO CONSULT WITH SUPERVISORS EVERY DAY.
MAYBE THAT WAS THE MISUNDERSTANDING.
I, WELL, IN ALL, IN ALL ACTUALITY, AND I GUESS THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE PRACTICE AND SHOULDN'T PRACTICE MM-HMM
UM, IF THEY WERE NOT EVEN THERE FOR THIS MEETING WITH SERGEANT SMITH AND THE WOMAN AND SERGEANT SMITH IS THE ONE THAT SHOULD HAVE SUPPLEMENTED THE REPORT.
SEE, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT A ZOOM THING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
I, WELL, UM, WHAT? THAT HE SHOWED SUPPLEMENT.
CAN YOU TELL ME? WELL, I MEAN AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, THE CORRECTIONS WERE MADE AS IN THAT EMAIL.
I JUST NOW FOUND OUT ABOUT IT THEN THAT'S FINE.
UM, EVERYTHING ELSE THAT CAME ABOUT HERE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH NOTHING AT ALL.
AND I'M, I DON'T WANT I TO, UM, SO, BUT WE WERE NOT TALKING TO HIM TRYING TO VERIFY THE REPORT.
SO WE'RE GOING WITH THIS REPORT.
IT CAN BE SUBMITTED IF, IF HE'S GOOD WITH IT AND THE EMAILS THAT HE GOT FROM THE TRAINING ACADEMY WERE GOOD, THEN IT'S FINE.
WHAT I'VE BEEN TRYING TO SAY, MR. JOHNSON.
SO WE HAD OUR MEETING WITH LIEUTENANT MAYO AND UM, CORPORAL BLACKBOARD BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T GET A TRAINED MM-HMM
THEY WENT OVER, THEY CALLED ME OUT, THEY HAD PRINTOUTS AND EVERYTHING WENT THROUGH HIGHLIGHTED.
AND THEY INSTRUCTED ME FROM THE ORIGINAL TO THE SUPPLEMENT.
THEY SAID THAT IT WAS THAT HOW I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE JUST TAKE OUT THE THINGS THAT I DID.
AND THEN THEY REVIEW THE DASH CAM
AND WE DID NOT TAKE ANY OF THOSE ITEMS OFF OF THAT NIGHT.
SO THEY WAS LIKE, I CAN'T QUIT.
SOMETHING THAT SHE SAID HAPPENED OR THAT SHE SAID THAT SHE TOLD, BECAUSE THEY SAID THEY WATCHED EVERYTHING.
NONE OF THAT WAS MENTIONED AT NIGHT.
NONE OF THAT STUFF WAS STILL TAKEN OUT OF, ON, OFF OF HER PERSONS OR NOTHING LIKE THAT.
SO HE SAID BEING THAT IT WAS UM, YOU KNOW, THROUGH RECORDING AND THAT SHE DIDN'T TALK TO ME MM-HMM
AND SHE TO SERGEANT RO, I MEAN SERGEANT SMITH THAT UM, HE COULD DO A SUB.
WELL I COULD DO SUB, BUT IF I DO SUB JUST PUT THAT IT WAS TOLD TO SERGEANT SMITH AND NOT ME.
THAT'S WHAT THEY TOLD US TO ME.
BLACKWELL SAID, SEND ME THE REPORT.
I'M GONNA GO OVER IT AND I'M GONNA SEND IT BACK TO YOU AND TAKE YOU TO CORRECTIONS.
I TEXTED HIM TO AND UH, SAID, IS EVERYTHING, ARE YOU GOOD? HE SAID, YES, UH, I RESUBMITTED IT AND THEN HE CAME BACK TO ME.
I CONTACTED, HE TOLD ME TO CONTACT JONES 'CAUSE HE'S MY PROBLEM.
FIRST TIME CONTACT AARON AND CONTACTED JONES.
UM, AND THEN I TALKED TO CORPORAL BLACK BLACKWELL AND THEN THEY SAID JUST RECENT IT AGAIN, DON'T MAKE ANY CHANGES.
AND THEN I DID IT AGAIN AND AGAIN, AGAIN, I CAME UP HERE THURSDAY.
AND TALKED TO CORPORAL BLACKWELL, LIEUTENANT MALE.
AND THEY SAID IT'S STILL NOT DONE.
IT WAS LIKE THE REPORT IS APPROVED.
[03:15:01]
AND THAT'S WHEN, I GUESS HE SENT THAT LAST EMAIL AND HE SAID, DIDN'T UM Y'ALL TALK TO HIM? HE SAID HE'S STILL THERE.I SAID, NO, I'M AT FIRST ISSUE NOW, BUT IT IS, YOU KNOW, I SAID, TALKED TO JONES.
JONES TOLD ME UH, WHAT HE WAS GONNA DO, BUT I SAID THAT I WAS GONNA COME AND TALK TO Y'ALL FIRST.
AND THEN THEY TOLD ME GO THROUGH MY CHAIN, WHICH IS, UM, AARON AND LIEUTENANT C MM-HMM
THAT'S WHY I DIDN'T RESPOND TO THE CAUSE OF TEXT 'CAUSE THEY TOLD ME TO GO THROUGH THE CHAIN OVER THAT.
SO I DID THAT AND SERGEANT BLACK, BLACK BLACK NOW AND ALL THEM TOLD ME, HEY LOOK OVER RESUBMITTED.
I WAS CALLING YOU BECAUSE I GOT THE EMAIL FROM UPSTAIRS.
AND I WAS TRYING TO CONTACT YOU TO GET THE REPORT FIXED.
AFTER I COULDN'T CONTACT YOU, I CONTACTED BLACKWELL ON EMAIL TO FIND OUT WHERE HE WAS AND WHO HE WAS WORKING WITH.
THAT'S WHEN HE TOLD ME, TAKE AARON AS FTO AND THEY GAVE YOU THE NUMBER AND I CALLED HER AND HAD HER GIVE YOU THE PHONE TO GET THE REPORT FIXED.
NOW THE ONLY THING IN THAT REPORT THAT YOU GOT IT FIXED THAT I WASN'T, THAT YOU FIXED WAS THE STATEMENT SAID THAT I TOLD YOU TO CHANGE IT FROM 1356 TO 14 SIX, WHICH AS A SUPERVI YOU HAVE 1356 ON THE OFFENSE PAGE.
IN THE BEGINNING I SAID CHANGE IT TO 1456.
WHICH YOU DID, YOU CHANGED THE OFFENSE UPDATED TO 1456.
I SAID, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE 1356 IN THAT, THAT SENTENCE.
I TOLD YOU TO CHANGE IT BECAUSE THE REPORT MATCHES THE CHARGES.
I KNOW YOU AND ANSWER O PROGRAM.
I KNOW YOU ARE ROOKIE AND YOU AND I, AND I KNOW YOU PROBABLY DON'T UNDERSTAND, UH, EXACTLY HOW TO REPORT
BUT WHEN I THERE, THERE'S NO DIFFERENCE.
THEN IF HALEY ALEXANDER WORKED FOR ME AND I WAS LIKE, HEY, WE GOTTA FIX THIS REPORT, YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA REWRITE IT OR WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE.
YOU KNOW, I'M NOT TRYING TO SET YOU UP ALL THIS IS BECAUSE I WAS LIKE, HEY JONES, HE NEED TO TAKE THE, THE, UH, THAT SENTENCE OUT SAYING I TOLD HIM CHANGE FROM 1356 TO 1456 BECAUSE HE ALREADY CHANGED IT.
AND THE OFFENSE PAGE SAYS THAT SENTENCE IS IRRELEVANT.
JONES SAY I'M NOT MAKING HIM CHANGE IT.
AND, AND THAT'S JUST BEING DEFIANT.
SO THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT.
SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, DID Y'ALL SIGN GARY? OKAY.
SO WE DIDN'T SIGN GARY SIGNED GARY FOR WHAT? HE'S NOT IN I'M HE'S NOT IN INVESTIGATION.
HE'S NOT IN NO PREVIOUS, HE'S NOT IN TROUBLE.
WE'RE JUST TRYING TO FIX THE REPORT FOR THE COURT SYSTEM.
SO WITH ME GARY, 'CAUSE WE'VE BEEN GETTING EMAILS AND AGAIN, THERE'S BEEN NO COMMUNICATION BETWEEN NO THE ACADEMY AND US.
IF THIS WAS ALL TAKEN CARE OF BEFORE THIS MEETING, THAT RIGHT NOW THEY TOLD ME TO LEAVE THAT LINE ANYMORE.
THAT WAS THE DAY THAT WE HAD SQUAD TRAINING THAT AND THEY SAID DON'T TOUCH AFTER HE DON'T TOUCH THAT IN THE REPORT.
JUST KEEP WELL AND THE STUFF 'CAUSE THE REPORT WAS APPROVED.
SO IN THE ORIGINAL REPORT IT SAYS 1356.
OKAY, HERE, HERE, HERE'S THE DEAL.
IF IT WENT THAT FAR AND THEY WERE COOL WITH IT AND EVERYTHING, WHY ARE THEY SENDING, WHY WERE THEY SENDING US EMAILS TO LOOK INTO IT? I FOR IT TO BE APPROVED 'CAUSE IT'S STILL NOT APPROVED.
THAT'S WHAT LIEUTENANT MAYO TOLD CORPORAL BLACKWOOD WHEN I WENT THERE.
SEND, CAN I DO GET THE REPORT APPROVED BECAUSE IT'S BEEN TOO LONG.
AND I TOLD HIM, I SAID, RICK IS TRYING TO GET THE REPORT, BUT THAT REPORT AND RICK'S EMAILED ME ABOUT, I MEAN, UH, OTHER REPORTS.
HOW, HOW LONG YOU BEEN RIDING WITH AARON? JUST MY LASTLY.
SHE, SHE COULD HAVE CALLED US.
SHE KNOWS IF IT WAS SOMETHING THAT NEEDED TO BE LOOKED AT.
SHE CAN'T, NOBODY WANTS TO ADDRESS SERGEANT SMITH.
WELL, I AIN'T, I HAVEN'T DONE NOBODY ANYTHING.
WHAT I MEAN, WHAT, WHAT WHAT NOBODY WANTS TO ADDRESS SERGEANT SMITH, WHO IS NOBODY.
I MEAN LIKE ATON OF PEOPLE LIKE, LIKE HOW, WHAT, WHAT DID I DO? I'M JUST KIND OF BIG, BAD, BAD.
I AM AM I HOSTILE EVERY DAY? UH, UH, LIEUTENANT, YOU WORK WITH ME EVERY DAY.
WELL, THAT'S A WHOLE NEW STORY.
SO, BUT I JUST FEEL LIKE ALL OF THIS CAN BE AVOIDED AND THAT'S OUT OF MY BOUNDS HERE.
THE ONLY REASON I'M REALLY EVEN HERE IS TO MAKE SURE THAT HIS RIGHTS AS AN OFFICER NOT BEING INVITED, NOBODY VIOLATED HIS RIGHTS.
NO, THEY, HIS RIGHTS, IT, IT DIDN'T AFFECT HIM.
I MEAN, WE, WE HAD ANOTHER OFFICER SAY IN, HE STEPPED OVER HIS BOUNDS AND UNFORTUNATELY HE WAS HERE.
WELL, NOBODY VIOLATED NOBODY RIGHTS.
NOBODY WASN'T GONNA VIOLATE SERGEANT.
HE DOES NOT WANNA CHANGE THIS REPORT.
HAILEY, I HEARD WHAT YOU SAID THE FIRST TIME.
SO WHAT WE DOING NOW? I'M, I'M EXPLAINING TO YOU WHAT THE PROBLEM WAS.
YOU KNOW, YOU SAID YOU DON'T HAVE TO CHANGE THE REPORT.
HEY, I, YOU, IS THAT ONE SENTENCE THAT YOU
[03:20:01]
CHANGED THE OFFENSE FROM 13 TO 14? YOU DON'T NEED 1356 IN THE NARRATIVE.IF EVERYBODY'S TELLING HIM, HEY, YOU COULD LEAVE IT LIKE THAT WHERE THE CASE MAY BE FINE.
HOW, HOW ARE Y'ALL TEACHING OFFICERS WHEN IT COMES TO SUPERVISORS, WHEN YOU LOOK AT REPORTS AND WE ADVISE OFFICERS THAT SOMETHING THAT NEEDS FIXING OR CHANGING, THEY'RE JUST SUPPOSED TO TELL THE SUPERVISORS.
WELL, NO, BUT AS A SUPERVISOR, WHEN YOU'RE REVIEWING THIS REPORT, IT SAYS, I MEAN, REPORTS ARE VERY, VERY SUBJECTIVE.
BUT A REPORT, THIS REPORT IS MY DOCUMENTATION WHAT I DID ON THIS CALL MM-HMM
AND I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.
AND, BUT IF, BUT IF CHARGES NEED TO BE ADDRESSED OR IF CERTAIN THINGS IN THE NARRATIVE DON'T MATCH CHARGES AND, AND, AND DON'T GET ME WRONG, IT'S GREAT THAT OFFICERS ARE VERY DETAILED.
SOME PEOPLE WILL OVER MUCH LIKE, THEY'LL GO THE NARRATIVE AND PUT AT THIS SUCH AND SUCH TIME, DATE, I DID DISCHARGE, DISCHARGE, DISCHARGE.
AND SOMETIMES IT DOESN'T MATCH THE CHARGE PAGE AND WE'VE ALWAYS BEEN TAUGHT THE NARRATIVE SHOULD BE ABLE TO STAND ALONE.
IF THAT'S THE CASE, EVERYTHING SHOULD MATCH.
AND I TELL OFFICERS, YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN'T MATCH DATES OR CHARGES OR THINGS, OR IF IT'S A LITTLE TOO MUCH, I MEAN, LET, LET, LET'S REEVALUATE, LET, LET'S TRY AND DO IT A DIFFERENT WAY.
IT'S ALL TRYING TO BETTER REPORT.
WELL, I'M NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND SAY, YOU NEED TO DO THIS AND YOU NEED TO DO THAT.
'CAUSE WE HAVE TO APPROVE THESE REPORTS.
AND BECAUSE IF I DON'T ADDRESS IT, THEN I GET LOOKED AT OR AREN'T YOU CHECKING THESE? WELL, WHY, WHY IS THIS WRONG? WHAT IS THIS, WHAT IS THAT? I, I HAVE A JOB TO DO JUST LIKE THEY DO.
SO I GOT, I GOT THE QUESTION FOR YOU.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT JUST EARLIER, BUT LIKE, SO YOU SUPERVIS MS. SQUAD AND THEY SEND A REPORT UP TO YOU AND YOU LOOK AT IT SUPERVISOR STANDPOINT AND YOU SEE SOMETHING'S NOT RIGHT.
AND YOU TELL 'EM, HEY, YOU NEED TO FIX THIS, YOU KNOW, X, Y, Z.
AND THEY SAY, WELL, I'M NOT GONNA FIX IT.
SOMETHING AS SIMPLE AS, I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY WORDS THAT ON THERE.
I DON'T EVEN THINK THAT'S A WHOLE COMPLETE SENTENCE ON THERE.
AND THEY SAY, HEY, I'M NOT GONNA FIX IT.
WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS THEN? WELL, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT? UH, THE PROBLEM IS, IS LIKE THE CHARGES, THE CHARGE IS 1456.
I SAID, HEY, CHANGE 1356 TO 1456 BECAUSE ALL OF IT HAS TO
IN THE NARRATIVE, WHAT HE WROTE, UH, AND CHANGED THE 1356 STATUTE ON THE SUMMONS TO 1456.
'CAUSE I TOLD HIM, I SAID, HEY, YOU GAVE HIM A SUMMONS FOR 1356.
IT IS GOING TO DISTRICT COURT.
SO YOU GOTTA EITHER GO GET THE SUMMONS FROM HIM OR, OR THEY GONNA BE PENDING INVESTIGATION, WHATEVER WE FIND.
'CAUSE IT'S GOING TO THANK YOU.
NOW STATEMENT, YOU GOTTA CORRECT THAT SENTENCE.
RIGHT? YOU DON'T NEED THAT SENTENCE IN THAT BECAUSE YOU DON'T HAVE A 1356 OFFENSE PAGE.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO EXPLAIN WHY IN THE PARAGRAPH THAT YOU PUT 1356.
IT IS NO DIFFERENT THAN IF, LET'S SAY HE CAME IN HERE AND THE CHARGE WAS, UH, UH, SIMPLE BATTERY, HYPOTHETICALLY.
AND I READ THE NARRATIVE AND I SEE THAT AND, AND I SEE THAT THE BATTERY WAS INCLUDING, UH, A CHIP THAT HIT HIM WITH A CHIP.
AND I SAID, HEY, CHANGE THIS TO, UH, AGGRAVATED BATTERY BECAUSE IT'S NOT SIMPLE BATTERY.
THEY'RE NOT GONNA WRITE IN A REPORT THAT I TOLD 'EM TO CHANGE IT TO AGGRAVATED BATTERY.
WE ORIGINALLY PUT SOME SOMEWHERE BECAUSE IT WAS AN INCORRECT CHARGE.
SO HE'S JUSTIFYING WHY HE'S WRITING THE SUPPLEMENTS WITH THAT SENTENCE.
THE ORIGINAL REPORT, THE, THE 0 0 0, THE SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT AS 14.
HE'S JUSTIFYING IN HIS NARRATIVE WHY HE SUPPLEMENT CHANGING THE IF LT, I'M, I'M DONE TALKING ABOUT IT.
IF IT ISN'T TAKEN CARE OF, SOMEBODY ELSE CAN APPROVE IT.
[03:25:05]
YOU KNOW, RECENT YOUR, JUST LET THEM REVIEW IT.ANYTHING WRONG, JUST EMAIL HIM BOTH.
I DUNNO WHY THEY JUST DIDN'T APPROVE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE WHEN HE LEFT FROM OVER HERE.
YOU KNOW, IT ALL THIS COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED FROM THAT ONE SENTENCE ONE A.
THAT'S, THERE'S NO DIFFERENCE IF WHEN YOU BECOME A SUPERVISOR, UH, CORPORAL, UH, LEXANDER, YOU, YOU CORPORAL OFFICER, I DON'T KNOW CORPORAL CORPORAL LEXANDER.
I'M A SUPERVISOR IN THE MILITARY AS WELL.
YOU'RE, AND WELL, THE MILITARY AIN'T GOT TO DO WITH THIS.
WELL, I'M, BUT I'M GONNA, THIS I'M MAKE REFERENCE TO BRP.
CORPORAL HALEY, AND THIS IS STRICTLY AN EXAMPLE.
WHEN YOU BECOME A SUPERVISOR IN BRPD, BECOME A SERGEANT AND YOU GRADE YOUR SUBORDINATES REPORTS AND WHEN YOU SEE THE CHARGES IS WRONG AND SAY, HEY, THAT'S THE WRONG CHARGE, UH, OFFICER BILLY JOHN DOE CHANGE IT.
YOU'RE EXPECTING HIM TO GO CHANGE THE REPORT WHEN YOU SEE SOMETHING IN THE REPORT.
A YOU DON'T NEED, UH, X, Y, Z IN THE REPORT THAT, UH, UH, UH, OFFICER JOHN DOE JUST TAKE THAT OUTTA THAT AND WRITE BACK BECAUSE YOU ARE SUPERVISING, BUT YOU ARE CORRECTOR.
YOU HAVE TOLD HIM TO DO NOTHING E ANYMORE ILLEGAL, UNETHICAL.
YOU, YOU HAVE NOT, YOU HAVE NOT TOLD HIM TO INJURE PUBLIC RECORD OR TO FALSIFY A DOCUMENT AND LYING IT SIMPLY A, YOU DON'T NEED 13 SIX IN THAT PARAGRAPH BECAUSE YOU CHANGED THE OFFENSE PAGE.
BUT IF YOU TELLING HIM HE COULD DO IT, IF BLACKWELL UH, CORPORAL BLACKWELL SENT THE EMAIL THAT MYSELF AND THE LIEUTENANT DID NOT GET, THEN HEY, IT'S WHAT? IT'S UH, THEY CAN APPROVE THE REPORT.
YOU CAN EVEN JUST SMITH CONTINUE SOME QUESTIONS.
SO WATCHING THE ENTIRETY OF IT AGAIN TODAY.
UM, ARE YOU STILL OF THE OPINION? YOU KNOW, IT IS WHAT IT IS.
QUESTION WHAT THE REPORT? YES SIR.
I'M NOT GONNA APPROVE THE REPORT BECAUSE HE HAS MIXED CHARGES IN IT.
UM, COULD, COULD A, COULD A SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT HAVE BEEN A, COULD YOU, COULD YOU HAVE DRAFTED JUST A SUPPLEMENTAL REPORT TO RESOLVE THIS? I'M THE SUPERVISOR.
I'M LOOKING AT THE REPORT FOR THE CORRECTNESS FOR IT TO GO UPSTAIRS AND THEN COME TO WHATEVER, UH, COURT THAT HAS JURISDICTION OVER THOSE PARTICULAR CHARGES.
THAT PARTICULAR REPORT HAS MIXED CHARGES.
CRIMINAL RECORDS IS NOT GONNA PROVE IT.
IT'S GONNA KEEP GOING UP THE CHAIN UNTIL YOU GET TO THE CHIEF'S OFFICE AND THEN WE ALL GONNA BE IN TROUBLE.
YOU MADE REFERENCE TO LEGAL, UH, CONTACTING YOU.
DO YOU RECALL WHO CONTACTED YOU FROM LEGAL? FROM LEGAL? MM-HMM
UH, DID IS THAT IN, UH, IN THE CLERK OF COURT'S OFFICE? CRIMINAL RECORDS? NO, BECAUSE